about the election still have on
Republican voters.
This election Georgia has also
revealed a high profile
disagreement between Donald
Trump who we saw endorsing David
Purdue for governor and his
former vice president Mike pence
who is backing Brian Kemp and
his holding a rally for him
tonight.
Let's dive into what is at stake
in Georgia with our politics
Monday team.
Amy Walter and camera Keith of
national public radio -- camera
Keith.
Great to see you both.
Great to be here.
Help me understand this.
Pene is making his most
unambiguous break with president
trump, stumping for the governor
that irritates Donald Trump more
than any other governor in
America, but in the midst of
this ongoing identity crisis for
the GOP does pence move the
needle?
>> I think Mike pence looks at
what's happening Georgia and
thinks, maybe that is the path
for me, too.
A governor, Brian Kemp who stood
U to claims by the president
that the election was rigged.
The president friends, and right
now it looks like Kemp's going
to run away with this primary.
Pence says, gosh, that sounds
familiar.
He has told me I can do all
these things, overturn the
election could I cannot do those
things.
I will present myself like Brian
Kemp did which is I am a
conservative candidate with a
conservative record without the
baggage the Donald Trump ranks.
I'm not going to talk about
20/20.
I will talk about the future.
We will not litigate the past.
That is not where voters want us
to go.
It is much more complicated when
you get into a presidential
contest with Donald Trump versus
an incumbent governor the Donald
Trump is trying to unseat, but
it is clear that that is the
pathway that he would like to to
make for himself.
>> That's pene' strategy-- P
Ence's strategy but we always
get a bit of grief are talking
about the former president a lot
but he does exert a serious
gravitational pull on the GOP,
and that is why he has to be
factored in all of these
phrases.
>> Certainly, and even the
candidates who are openly saying
that they have the support of
Donald Trump, that the election
results should be overturned,
say there are questions that
there are doubts about the
election.
So, even the sort of mainstream
conservative Republican
candidates a-playing just
enough for two with the big lie
to not turn off trump voters in
a primary.
So his presence is very real.
You have to look beyond this one
race.
He has endorsed a dozen
candidates in Georgia primaries.
Many of them are completely
unopposed.
>> The insurance commissioner is
even endorsed.
>> He will be able to declare
that his candidates and he
pulled them across the finish
line even though they were
unopposed.
But you know he also has
Herschel walker, who is his
chosen person for the senate
race,and there was really no
ability of Republicans other
than trump Republican spare
there was no ability to pull
anyone up with him.
He is going to be the Republican
nominee easily.
Even though there are a lot of
Republicans in Georgia and
elsewhere who have a lot of
concerns about him as their
nominee.
>> Let's-- just say once the
midterms come and a certain
number of Republican candidates
who support the idea of the big
lie, let's say those candidates
loose.
Does that help break this fever
within the GOP?
>> Well, I think so much of it
is about the leadership.
What's going to happen when
there are contested elections.
What are the leaders in those
elections going to do, the
candidates in those cases?
Are they going to react the way
Donald Trump did, say that is
the path for us?
I think we have a couple of
examples showing that really for
the most part we are not seeing
that as becoming sort of part of
the DNA or something that
candidates are going to do after
every election.
There was talk after the
California recall election that
the Republican candidate there
wasn't going to conceded.
He ended up conceding pretty
-- quickly.
In Pennsylvania there is a
senate primary that has not been
called in their 1000 vote
celebrating -- separating two
candidates, we are talking about
absentee ballots and signatures
and all of the things we heard
about during the 2020 election,
both Republican candidates,
though, are sticking with the --
let the process work.
Nobody has saying this has been
illegitimate and I will call
myself the winner.
Now, this is early times, but
those are two pretty good
examples to suggest the Donald
Trump's way of doing things is
not going to necessarily be the
way that candidates decide.
Judy: Does it break the fever of
the bunch of the candidates
loose?
>> But there are a bunch of
other candidates who are going
to win.
You're someone like Doug mastery
Ana in Pennsylvania, who is,
part of his stock in trade and
what made him a promising
candidate for the Republicans
and what got him trump's
endorsement is his strong
commitment to the big lie the
fact that he went on January 6
and March towards the U.S.
Capitol he said he did not break
the law or go in.
So, you have candidates who are
going to make it past the
primary, who are going to be
the nominee who may or may not
have trump's backing but support
the idea of only taking the
votes that you want, or only
accepting the result that is the
result that you like.
So, it is, I think that it's not
settled yet whether there will
be some candidates whos imply
say, I'm not accepting the
result.
There certainly are millions of
Americans, Americans who saw
that 2000 move in movie theaters
because it is in theaters, it is
not just in the corners of the
internet.
They got into theaters.
There are Americans who wholly
believe that 2020 was stolen and
if you look at the ads that are
running in states all around the
country in these primaries, they
are talking about how the
election was stolen and how
things were rigged.
And it is feeding upon itself,
so that millions of Americans
believe that 2020 was rigged.
And, if someone tells them in
2022 or 2024 was, they are going
to believe it.
>> I talked to a lot of Georgia
voters coming out of that film,
and they were convinced this was
evidence of fraud.
At us like we are living in two
different ecosystems.
This whole argument about the
big lie yielded January 6 two a
large degree.
We know congress is going to be
holding hearings.
Some Democrats have promised on
the committee that they have
blockbuster testimony that they
will reveal to the public.
We don't know what that is.
Let's say that does come
pass.
Do you think that that searing
day, albeit presented by
congressional hearing, moves
people?
Is there anything that people
can see about January 6 that
will change their opinion?
>> I do doubt that to be the
I just think now the political
lines are pretty well set and
they are pretty deep right now.
To tam's point, if you have seen
a movie and you're convinced
that movie is right, there is
nothing that is going to be
shown at a hearing which
Republicans are going to say is
complete the and completely
biased.
The one thing I will say,
though, as a tacti for being a
strong candidate, if you are
Republican become the issue is
inflation, the inflation is a --
the issue is the economy.
That is what voters are saying
is the most important thing to
them.
If they decide instead these
candidates, I will focus on the
2020 election being rigged, I'm
going to focus on Donald Trump
and show my loyalty, polling
shows that is a terrible
decision, because independent
voters overwhelmingly, just 24%
of them cite, we -- say we want
a Republican candidate who will
focus on the 2020 election.
That's no what they are looking
for.
Trepublicans may be but
independent voters are not.
>> Tomorrow will be a big test
of how these races unfold.
Amy and tam, thank you both very
much.
>> You are welcome.