BARACK OBAMA: Lincoln declares a house divided shall not stand.
We can't have a nation that's half slave and half free.
It does mark a turning point in his mind.
He recognizes that in his political life,
he's going to have to object to slavery in a way that is
tougher and more controversial.
ALLEN C. GUELZO: Lincoln begins to campaign through the State
and invites Douglas to a series of joint debates.
Douglas writes back and says, I'm under no obligation
to meet jointly with you.
I'm the incumbent senator.
I'm the most famous politician in America at this moment.
Why am I going to give you space on a platform with me?
But Douglas can't resist.
[applause]
Good afternoon, everyone.
Thank you so much for coming out.
Appreciate you.
DORIS KEARNS GOODWIN: Douglas comes in as the champion.
He comes in a train with a special car decorated.
He comes with servants, with secretaries.
Ma'am.
Good to see you.
DORIS KEARNS GOODWIN: And Lincoln has to walk
from one debate to another.
The reputation of Lincoln and Douglas were both on the line
here.
They literally are setting up the conflict in the nation.
From when we were both young men
and no one can compete with him in wrestling, or a foot race,
or on whisking his grocery store,
we served on the State legislature together.
And then Mr. Lincoln submerged for a time
until he reappeared in the hallowed halls of Congress,
where he distinguished himself by his opposition
to the war with Mexico, taking the side of the common enemy
against his own country.
[booing]
And he, again, submerged.
He came up again in 1854, this time in cahoots with Fred
Douglass and his abolitionist friends just in time
to create this Black Republican platform.
[booing]
That's right, Douglas.
Hit him again.
Lincoln, you're two faced.
[laughter]
If I had two faces, do you think I'd be wearing this one?
[laughter]
DORIS KEARNS GOODWIN: This old rivalry has come to roost.
Very good.
DORIS KEARNS GOODWIN: Lincoln felt
that his life had been a flat failure compared to Douglas's.
Douglas had gotten further than he had,
and now, they're running against each other for the Senate.
Now, I am no giant like Judge Douglas.
I'm a mere mortal.
Now, his ambition, it far exceeds my own.
His party, they all expect him to be president one day,
and then they will all reap the benefits of his greatness.
But nobody has ever looked at my lean, lank face
and expected me to be president.
[laughter]
DORIS KEARNS GOODWIN: People come to these debates
with all the fervent love and attention
that they would bring to a giant sporting event today,
but these were more important than any sporting
event could have been.
I am here to talk about basic principles.
Now, if the Negro is a man, why, then, my ancient faith
teaches me that all men are created equal
and that there can be no moral right in connection with one
man making a slave of another.
[applause]
Well, let's talk about principle.
I care more for the great principle of self-government,
the right of the people to rule, than I do for all
the Negroes in Christendom.
When a white man governs himself,
that is self-governance, but when he governs himself
and he also governs another man, that
is more than self-government.
That is despotism.
Mr. Lincoln and his ilk want Negro equality in all things.
If they get their way, Negroes and whites
will be permitted to marry.
Negroes will serve on juries.
Negroes will vote.
[booing]
CHRISTY COLEMAN: During these debates,
Lincoln is not an abolitionist by any stretch,
but he's inadvertently making their arguments
as he's looking for logic in the constitutionality
of all of this.
TED WIDMER: And he goes way back to Euclid.
Euclid is very much about how you prove something
beyond any shadow of a doubt, and he's
working toward crushing the fallacious arguments
on behalf of slavery.
CHRISTY COLEMAN: But like most people of the day,
he absolutely fervently believes that Black
people are inferior, whether they're enslaved or freed.
Just because I believe the Negro should be free
does not mean that I want to marry one.
As a nation, we began by declaring
that all men are created equal.
We now practically read it, all men are
created equal except Negroes.
Soon it will read, all men are created equal except Negroes
and foreigners and Catholics.
Negroes, like many other men, may not be equal in all things,
but if they are men, they are entitled to their right
to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
[applause]
The real issue, which will last long after the tongues of Judge
Douglas and I are silent, is the eternal struggle
between these two principles, between right and wrong.
[applause]
CHRISTY COLEMAN: What Lincoln does so brilliantly
is he takes that core language to the Declaration
of Independence and turns it into a nation's moral compass.
And he couples that with constitutionality,
and he couples that with scripture.
He has a really powerful argument.
DORIS KEARNS GOODWIN: This is where Lincoln makes his name,
one debate after another.
Everything had prepared him for the repertoire of talents
that he was able to show in these debates.
He's telling stories.
He's funny.
He can talk philosophically.
He can talk politically.
TED WIDMER: The Lincoln-Douglas debates helped Lincoln.
It raised his profile, lifted him up a lot,
but he loses the election.
CAREY LATIMORE: One of the things about Lincoln
that's amazing is that he loses a lot,
but the great ones in life take a loss and they come back.
DORIS KEARNS GOODWIN: Even though he loses
this election, once again, the loss becomes a platform for him
to grow.
Underlying it all is there's a passion that he has,
a passion for that cause of anti-slavery,
which is coming to a head.