it's my pleasure to introduce Nick Raimo back to the channel you may have seen Nick
already undertake our electrician's challenge in which we christened this stool here little Nick's
step uh we would check out that video we'll put a link in there for everyone who wants a bit of
uh entertainment if you don't know Nick already he has his own YouTube channel what's it going in the
name of now uh well it's just EV Nick EV Nick just search EV Nick if you're not subscribed already
check out over there because Nick has been on a bit of a mission hasn't he Gary what's he been
doing yeah he's actually gone away and installed all the EV chargers behind us and reviewed them
and then fed back all the pinch points which means Gordon we don't have to do it which is fantastic
isn't it yeah and people often come to us oh you've reviewed lots of EV charges actually the
truth be told on the wall behind us we've actually only looked in detail at two of them and we're in
the process of looking at a third at the moment so watch for that video coming out and then i
kind of but remember also there's one missing from the world back in the early days when we
started the channel our first EV charger partner you had a look at with Joe was the uh was the uh
yeah it was Rolec and at that time they owned the market there wasn't any other chargers really out
there and i don't see them on the wall behind us Nick what's happened to Rolec uh well i used
to have a Rolec at my house and i uh took it down they replaced it with one of these right
okay so we went smart yep and it seems yeah Rolec have sort of drifted away and we're not we're not
seeing any of the Rolec anymore but we've got an immense range behind us who are the rising stars
we should be looking at now oh that do you know what that is actually a more difficult question
than you think but i think at the moment we've got lots of money pouring in off Wallbox because
they've now entered the US market big big market the Zappi the Indra and the Ohme and the Easee
are all at the moment really heavily investing and really moving forward and we looked in your video
Nick about all those things about looks about apps and all the decisions the customer may want
to make but this video is more concentrating on the electrician isn't it yeah and obviously
there's two things electricians really care about the first one being price and the second
one being how easy to install we'll go in the reverse order Nick which one and you've reviewed
them all do you think's the easiest to install so the absolute easiest to install is this one
here this is the new Ohme system so at the moment i've just got it for testing purposes i've got
i've got a commando socket on the end but it just basically comes ferruled at the end
you put this into a waterproof junction box that all electricians you know you know how to use
you're used to doing them and you've got some CT clamps that go in a Wago box again something
that you're all simply you know using that and then you plug it in turn it on and some buttons
come on the screen you select what the main fuse is for the dynamic load balancing and you select
the customer's got solar and then you walk away right so hold up so let's just unpack that there
Gary Gary normally comes in oh i love an app no no i don't know i like the fact we didn't mention an
app at that stage so all i'm going to make is a separate box of connections line neutral and CPC
so i'm going to hard wire it in i'm going to make some connections made for those CT clamps
i don't have to unseal the box or take it that box box do not what you open in the box wow so
that that removes one of the issues electricians are feeding back to us is that danger of not
necessarily getting the screws back on maybe the correct torque setting and the ingress of liquids
moisture etcetera and causing a problem down the road isn't it yeah damage to what we know as the
farm yard inside there so you know that i mean that looks that looks pretty good any other any
other star performers from an install point of you so there's a couple more standouts so the Wallbox
the Indra at the moment and i'm just not saying if there's any others uh the Evbox at the end
they all use uh Wago style terminals inside for their connections and i don't know about you but
from electricians that i've seen they don't tend to have torque screwdrivers to hand to you know
tighten up some of the connections in there so maybe using a maintenance free block like that
would get rid of some of those possible issues i'd say yeah that's a really important thing there the
seal on often these there's a torque setting from vitally important once you get in there and you've
got a connection on to what you call the farmyard PCB board obviously an aggressive wrist could mean
that we weaken and possibly snap it off the board itself and from personal experience i can tell you
that normally doesn't show up that failure when you've installed it it's normally it's only a
little bit down the road when the circuit board connection gives up and you'll be back for for a
warranty call out and so you when you fitted them have you actually wired these units in yourself
so i i've just wired them up to one of these for testing purposes obviously because it's just quick
and easy for me to put it in show show me you know how it's installed and how it's done and
that's just basically how i've done it so i've opened some of the units up that need opening
up now i'm not electrician so i don't own a torque screwdriver so to have a a maintenance
free block like that it's perfect for me to to show an example but i've also seen that a couple
of the units they put the screw terminals for the electrician's connection right at the end of the
PCB where if you just tightened it a little bit too tight you might break the PCB at the back okay
and the tendency then is to go a little bit looser and you suggested that you're not an electrician
and you don't own a torque screwdriver that's not exclusive to people that aren't electricians
and if you haven't seen Nick on the electrician's challenge you will see he is definitely
not an electrician obviously put your comments in below as well on what your thoughts are about the
PCB connections to the chargers who's who does a really easy install in terms of your opinion
what you found those cable entries i mean i see some of them there's a tendency to try and shrink
the size down of the charger yes which is great for the homeowner yes and i know what you're going
to say now what if you got a big armored cable in there and i've got to admit there's some of them i
would not want to install with a big armored cable yeah but yeah and then of course the smaller it
gets then the lead becomes a problem doesn't it so of course once we've seen behind us here we've got
leads all around and in your video we also talked about the tethered and untethered lead as well
and whether that was an issue you said the other thing was going to be about
cost to that installer and we know as time moves on and depending when you're watching it there may
not be a grant at all now and obviously we've got the full cost up front for the customer
and is that going to be obviously making some decisions based on which one you want to start
offering out to your customers because obviously it's better value what's your things on that
Gordon uh well yeah well that's what a lot of Nick finds we know which ones we like because you don't
need extra ancillary items which one's your pick for that uh the avoidance of an add-on cost well
at the moment i i just think that every single charge point sold in the UK should come built in
with most protections like DC leakage and also pen fault detection so you're not having to put
earth rods or an extra separate device that most consumers let's be honest don't have room for and
some electricians may be tempted to put them in the DNO cabinet and i would say that RCD
so we can move it out i think the A type RCD should be at the origin love your thoughts on that
and the DC leakage to be built into the actual charges themselves meaning that effectively we've
done a B type RCD at the uh the consumer unit end yeah and that's the trend we're seeing across
most of them yeah they're moving the yeah the upstream protection to the the distribution board
absolutely and again what's your thoughts on if you end up having to RCD protect your cable
yet there's RCD protection in the actual EV charger as well what you're thinking about
that on selectivity is it an issue isn't an issue and that's another topic obviously that
we'd like to tackle yeah some installers actually didn't realize they'd done that actually carried
on installing them without realizing that that protection had gone from inside the charger so
it was in say in an EV charger they'd taken it out as a manufacturer which i think it's a good thing
and they'd ask then the installer to install that A type RCD at source and you're telling me people
have missed that yeah if you've missed it yeah gotta watch those you know obviously electricians
we don't like to read instructions no we don't in this fluid market i would suggest you always
read the instructions yeah i would yeah because it's rapidly changing and with that in mind some
of the easy charging points behind us are due an upgrade and you're you're privy to that and
we know some some different changes about looks as well as what's going on inside them now Nick
you did touch on there i think as you said in the future Gary what is happening with the OZEV grant
so the ooze grant is going to go it's going to disappear we we know that it's going to
disappear i do think there's going to be some kind of regulations maybe put in on making them smart
maybe from more of a DNO and grid's perspective so i think a lot more i think it's going to be
a requirement now that they've got some smart control for the national grid in you know in a
grid response level to turn down or off a charger and that's time dependent as well isn't we've
heard rumors about different times of the day where you won't be able to charge in the new world
of EV charges but you think that'll be regardless every charger has to have it and you don't get a
grant for for the installation yes i think it will go that way but i think we'll we won't see the
you know you're not allowed to charge at this time i think what will happen is customers will
be incentivized not to charge at a time and the customers that want to charge at that time
will will will pay for the benefit okay so you might be able to charge it 5:30 in the evening
but it might be one pound a kilowatt hour or something exactly yeah now make a choice obviously
but what else are you seeing trends in terms of the apps obviously when you talk about smart there
is always an app and that's where Gary normally just glazes over and vanishes on the charges
behind us setting the pace when it comes to actually what they're doing in the apps
so a lot of them now have realised that the way the energy market's going i mean wholesale prices
of electricity are through the roof at the moment they're the highest they've ever been
so a lot of these energy companies are inventing new tariffs with dynamic price balancing which i
know that you guys have got a a referral link for a company called octopus that i
refer as well and they have a couple of energy tariffs some that are dynamically grid grid
controlled so they'll turn off and on depending on the grid with certain charges which is the
Wallbox currently only and then they've also got other tariffs that change every 30 minutes and a
couple of the ones that can currently handle that really easily are the Ohme the Sync the Indra and
the Zappi all do that pretty well at the moment they can respond to those prices dynamically
very quickly so the electrician there's probably got to sell that into the install haven't they
they've got to say that all of a sudden that the app and the intelligence of it can actually avoid
you paying high electricity costs so you might have to pay a slightly different price for that
charger but you'll get your money back in it feels like minutes wouldn't you yeah i mean the biggest
example at the moment is Indra working with a company called ev.energy and they will basically
link you into their vehicle vehicle response system so some days they'll they'll turn your
charger off some days they'll turn your charger on now it may only be given for five minutes 10
minutes 20 minutes that you'll always set a target on the app of what your car wants to charge at in
the morning and they'll always reach that target charge but they'll set it across the hours that
you've been plugged in because let's be honest you come home from work first thing you'll do is plug
in you're not bothered if it takes all the way till eight o'clock when you leave in the morning
for work if it's charged but you will be bothered if that's cost you an absolute fortune to charge
it because it's taken up from five till i don't know two o'clock in the morning where it could
have shed itself across all of those hours and you think that's a personal better benefit to choosing
the right EV charger maybe than looks and maybe on how easy it is to install is that what you
think it is yes i i think if you're looking at a charge at the moment and it's not smart connected
you will really be disadvantaged in the future when all the smart house eventually
all energy companies i think are going to go for a dynamic price balancing system where you will
pay more during peak hours and if you don't have a charger that can handle that you are going to pay
now will that know then so people have now got to this bit and they're probably in the panic
button because when i do come in at 5:30 i want to turn on the oven perhaps and the kettle etc
will the the system be smart enough to understand that it's a car you're trying to charge and maybe
not a kettle or the oven i think that's a question for Gordon yeah oh well we are so i mean the
chargers behind us we talked that load balancing yeah so that yeah energy coming in the house is
differentiating between what's going with the car and what's going in the house so yeah so it's your
right Gary if you want to if you want to cook your tea at 41 pence a kilowatt hour that's your choice
you know the charger will opt out of that energy automatically so okay so okay i'm thinking there
then so our energy prices are in the future going to be a lot higher at those peak times
regardless what we're doing then yeah and i think what you've got to remember is what an EV car
using electricity if it's charging at that cheaper distance it's going to lower your average rate
right down i mean perfect example for me my peak rate at the moment because i'm on an old tariff so
i don't get jealous it's 14p and my off-peak rate is 5p but my average for my entire house usage is
8p right okay that's because you've managed it through the octopuses so i've managed it for the
octopus app using a smart charger and the smart charger only charges my car at the five pence
so even with cooking at normal normal times doing my washing machine you know doing my dishwasher
the average has been brought down from the 14p and close to the five piece so only only eight
pieces i'm actually averaging closer to using most electricity there because you've got to remember
an EV car some EV cars now are 75 100 kilowatt hours of capacity okay so that's a fair amount
of time being connected to your 7 kilowatt charger there nick telling the family sorry folks why not
eat until midnight tonight because we can't afford to switch on the oven oh no i'm not from Yorkshire
is that something that we could find them are we going to find that so in this agile moving tariffs
which sounds great now because it's early adopting isn't it that you can have you know you can charge
a car for free or for five pence the more and more people that take on EV actually the cost of
anything connected to electricity whatever you're doing whether it be charging your car is gonna
change and you're gonna have to be more mindful yes yeah it it's basically eventually going to be
that all electricity in the UK is going to cost more i think that's why i probably think we're
going to see an influx of more people installing solar battery storage and more not just smart
connected EV charges but i'm thinking more smart connected washing machines dryers dishwashers just
more smart appliances using that electricity when it's cheaper especially the rise of heat pumps now
so there's a few bits there food for thought i would suggest and as always we're absolutely
interested in your comments on this where do you want us to go next is it heat pumps
is it now looking at maybe having a washing machine that will actually manage its own energy
and come on at a better time for you especially if you're using something like the octopus energy
please order those comments below and we'll let Nick get back to all the difficult ones