despite what a lot of people say I'm not
actually a vampire yeah you didn't
rescue the dragon or I didn't find a
dragon Nick Cave understands the
contradictions of the heart of rock and
roll this is why for my money he is both
true rock and roll star but also an
iconoclast of the genre he is probably
one of the finest lyricist working in
popular music today more importantly in
2015 is delivered a heavyweight livery
statement in the form of the sick bags
on his new book published by calico this
spring Nick that's mania hi
the sick bag song is a road poem /
horror story think The Hitcher meets the
Book of Psalms meets John Berryman meets
a bit of Indian is mo meets the
wasteland meets blues meets
Nosferatu meets Marilyn Monroe Jimi
Hendrix and Janis Joplin and anyone else
who's drowned in their own sick the sick
bag song it's a Ron seal title it does
what it says on the tin it is a song or
maybe you'd say an epic poem written on
sick bags do you want to tell us where
this idea came from it basically
happened because I was involved in a
kind of experiment if I actually stated
something out loud with enough
conviction it might come true and I was
having trouble writing some songs and I
thought on this American tour which was
22 dates I would write 10 songs and so I
was on the plane going to Nashville and
I thought you know I've got better
start writing these songs and I didn't
have a notebook so I grabbed the sick
bag as one does out of the back of the
seat and started to write my first song
which I called for one of a better title
the sick bag song at some point through
five or six sick bags into the exercise
I started to realize I was writing a
poem and not a song and that was a huge
leap for me because I have always had a
terror of writing poetry once I'd
realized that I was writing a poem and
the kind of strictures of writing a song
the economy of writing a song was lifted
off me I started to ride a lot it sort
of opened the gates to something that I
hadn't done before the conceit in a way
is that it's this guy on tour who bears
a striking resemblance to myself that's
kind of musing on all manner of things
on some small level it's a tour diary
because it goes from town to town but
it's really about other things
with you writing poetry is this for want
of a better phrase a leap into the
unknown you know for me there was song
writing which I felt I could do and I've
written hundreds of songs but poetry was
always something up up there it was on
another on another level
I felt like I was a kind of imposter I
always feel like I'm kind of dabbling in
something that I don't really know that
much about this can cause a lot of
anxiety but it also can be quite a
freeing there's a sort of ignorant and
naivety about the process of writing
something that you're not really
supposed to be doing so the book opens
with you as a young boy standing on a
bridge facing a very serious dilemma I
was wondering if you could explain what
our dilemma was is myself as a as a boy
and this is a true memory as much as
memories these sorts of things can be
true a young boy climbs a riverbank he
steps onto a railway bridge he is 12
years old the boy starts to run along
the tracks he arrives in the middle of
the bridge he stands on the edge and
looks down at the muddy river below and
this becomes I guess a kind of metaphor
I guess that runs through the the book
about this decision that's made as an
artist whether you are willing to kind
of leap into something it leap into the
unknown
very quickly we realize that it's not a
boy is the memory of a boy running
through the mind of a man in a suite at
the Sheraton Hotel in downtown Nashville
Tennessee who is being injected in the
thigh the steroid shot
that will transform the jetlag fluid and
singer into updated I think it's
important that the book is written on
sick bags it is a looker
in some ways at the aging process and
your own mortality isn't it basically
the sick bag in this in this extended
poem becomes this thing that everything
gets put into right yeah so it has a
physical representation of the bag and
I'm often looking inside the sick bag
the sick bag that I'm filling up through
these 22 dates and inside the sick bag
is everything that I loved and loathed
my influences and the people that I that
I kind of worship in a way the people
have had huge impact on me over the
years I was interested to see the poet
the revered 20th century poet John
Berryman crop up and I was wondering to
what extent he's kind of playful and
sometimes quite funny confessional style
of poetry has been an influence on you
anytime a new crew well he's been a huge
influence you know there's a definite
nod to the dream songs takes very
ordinary things that are happening in
his live and articulates them in some
way that they become these kind of
massive incidences basically what I do
in songwriting is to take the smallest
of instances of gestures of things that
happen that that are that are small and
ordinary things and kind of inflating
them and making them kind of epic in
some way and the idea of being on tour
and having certain anxieties about
what's going on at home becomes the kind
of engine of this particular book
because my wife isn't answering the
phone throughout throughout this when
you got to the end of the tour whose was
all you had 22 sick bags you know the
sick bags that are basically the kind of
notes of that day but I had started
writing the the poem I took my kids away
into France somewhere and it was kind of
writing it crab-like on the side
pretending I wasn't doing any work
but and a lot of it got done then so
each chapter starts with a bag a sick
bag and with the notes on it and then
there's the there's the sort of the
relevant poem I spoke to your publisher
he told me that it went through an
incredibly intense editing period I in
my way I got very excited about the idea
of doing this very early on I took a
photograph of two of these bags which
had a couple of things scribbled on them
and kind of sent a a message to him
saying um that I'm writing this thing I
don't know what it is it's called the
sick bag song his two sick bags will you
publish it and and Jamie goes well
right-back going well maybe it needs a
little developing as an idea before I
kind of commit and I believe there's
like a very special edition is walking
his house were those there is 220
limited edition versions ten for each
city it also has a sick bag which I've
written onto and designed which is taken
forever
I've just finished writing a book I
don't want to draw an equivalence but
what I will say about it was I found it
one of the most distressing and
unpleasant experiences of my life
I wouldn't wish write in a book on my
worst enemy yet you've written three do
you see yourself doing it again yeah I
mean I'm sorry to hear that
and I'm sure maybe the second one won't
be like that I've always found writing
books to be really pleasurable because
you you're kind of pursuing one idea
once you've got the idea once you've
kind of got over the hurdle of what
you're going to write what the
things going to be about you're kind of
often running I find whether they're any
good or not I don't know but I've always
found the writing of books to be
something of that I've been able to kind
of disappear into do you not find it
contradictory the fact that somebody
who's so prolific is you seems to spend
so much time worrying
of our inspiration songwriting is is is
really fraught with dread the whole the
whole thing because because there's a
sort of history of songwriting and
there's all these songs that are kind of
breathing down my neck that I don't want
my new songs to be like for me the
process of being able to continue to
work is of absolute importance to me and
there's the kind of complacency that
goes with repetition if you start
writing the same thing over and over
again you get complacent you get bored
and eventually the work suffers so the
anxiety comes about for me about finding
a new voice each time or at least
finding a new way of saying perhaps the
same things my current favorite from the
sick bag pages is a jihadist rides a
unicorn into a cafe in Jerusalem or on
the actual printed pages on the next
table a homo antecessor female in sequin
Stetson scoops the brains out of her
husband's decapitated head the part of
the book that I really enjoyed writing
this was that kind of riff on
professional vampirism the idea that
we're all sucking off everybody else to
put it
that's probably not the right way to
said 26 years previously you know we did
have another look at the Bad Seeds on
tour but it couldn't have been more
different it was the kind of the road
film the road to God knows were a more
cynical young man's look at life on the
road but this couldn't be more different
could a road to God knows where I was
come to the road to God goes where yeah
I was basically straight out of rehab on
tour so it was a nightmare yeah
I agree with me like you've had some
experience in this which I'm sure you
have but was suddenly I was not drinking
and I wasn't taking drugs and I was on a
tour of America things are
different for me now first of all I
enjoy going on tour a lot more these
days than maybe I used to especially in
America that feel like a whole
different thing than we've done and I
think that we've ever done mostly
because a lot of younger people I guess
bought this last record for some reason
God knows why but they did they don't
give a about Tupelo and the mercy
seat and all that sort of stuff they
just want to hear the new stuff and they
they don't have they haven't invested
anything and so there's this kind of
excitement that's going on it's changing
the bad seats in a very profound way
quite wisely you know you don't invite
people into your house to see the real
Nick Cave at home washing the car or
doing the dishes or any of that stuff
for Mike well I don't do that yeah of
course not because you're a vampire who
keeps dragons like anyone who buys like
you know the seatback song or goes to
see 20,000 days on earth expecting to
see the real use it's kind of like
either mistaken or an idiot
has it become easier over the years for
you to curate the Nick Cave miss is it
kind of self-sustaining now I guess the
word myth suggested it's not real you
know if you invest enough time and
enough attention to something you become
that thing there's no going back this
kind of idea that someone can come into
your house and see behind the mask I
think for a lot of people in my
profession that the mask just doesn't it
just doesn't come off just what it is
there's not there is nothing behind the
mask a colleague of mine claims I was
working in a bookshop once and you came
in and said in a really thunderous way
where do you keep the Bibles and the
more I think about it or I think about
this the more it cracks I need one yeah
where are they I think like everyone
knows that they do know that the Good
Book has had a maybe profound influence
on your life as an artist over the years
I think you know that there was there's
a for me there was a lot of beauty in
the Bible but there was a lot of horror
too and this some hopping voice that
goes through the Bible that I found
really interesting of you must do this
and you must
you should not do that and I find that
kind of bizarre up instructional
text quite interesting I mean it
actually looks it's designed to look
like a sort of instructional manual of
some sort and there's a kind of riff
going through the book that becomes like
part motivational manual or part
instructional manual in a similar way
just some of the stuff in the Bible I
guess I think the book is genuinely very
deeply touching
does your wife Susie like it shouldn't
read it really oh you seem to suggest in
it that you might get a flack from a
depending on different things I was
wondering are you a district or over
your lyrics no no she doesn't but she's
she's very connected to those songs not
just that a lot of the songs are about
her if she recognizes where these songs
are coming from which is what which is
what I'm talking about these tiny
ordinary moments between a husband and
wife let's say that becomes songs and
become much greater greater things but
she also understands that it's not a lot
that goes on between us that I'm not
prepared to write about in some kind of
way the process of writing is so
anxiety-ridden
especially about the idea of having
nothing to write about that you just got
to write about everything that's given
to you you can't kind of pick and choose
a fine well I've got so absolute
pleasure reading this book I really
thoroughly enjoyed it thanks very much
Roger thank you
you