I'm Libby Casey and my colleagues here at The Washington Post Matea Gold and
Drew Harwell have spent four months tracking the origins of Ivanka Trump's
clothing .What's the supply chain where it comes
from. Thanks guys for talking about your reporting with us so why is it so
complicated because I'm looking at this Ivanka Trump what is this skirt?
Blouse. It says it's made in India so what gives?
why is it so complicated? I mean we all sort of recognize these garments we know
the made in China tag or made in India tag but after that the clues sort of get
kind of cold you can't really track it to which factory it is unless the
supplier or the clothing brand like Ivanka's tells you where it starts it
gets into being a very non transparent process and it's really hard to know
what the conditions are like for workers or where it even comes from so beyond
that tag and beyond the little information that the clothing company can
give you it's really difficult to find these things and that was our main
mission to sort of go into how can we know that these things are being made in
a place that's good for the workers and being made to conditions that Americans
want to see. So we all have a lot of fast retail in our lives clothes that are
made and bought at cheap prices. They're made overseas. I checked what I was
wearing today and I'm wearing clothes made in Vietnam and China. So Matea,
why is it important to look at the Ivanka brand in particular? So we decided
to focus on Ivanka because one she's a fascinating character and President
Trump's administration and there's a lot of focus on her political point of views
and whether she's going to be an influence on him politically. One thing
that's gotten less attention is her business background the fact that she's
been an entrepreneur herself and continues to own this business while
serving in the White House as a senior adviser and that business has issues
that are implicated by President Trump's "buy American" agenda. "We will follow two
simple rules buy American and hire American." We thought it would be
interesting to look at how much Ivanka Trump's company has tried to actually
work with some of the policies laid out the policy goals of the administration and also
what kind of oversight they have brought to their supply chain. One thing that Drew
and I learned doing this project is that increasingly apparel companies are
trying to have over site of the factories where their goods
are made so they can reassure consumers like all of us that people aren't being
exploited in the process. Like you point out adidas is one of those companies
that's trying to track its own supply chain and tell people about the working
conditions of their employees? Exactly. And it's not just big companies like
adidas we found a lot of smaller brands have made this sort of a central part of
their mission that we want you as consumers to know that we're keeping an eye
on our overseas production so we thought we would try to figure out
exactly what kind of oversight the brand had and what were the conditions for the
workers in the factory. Give us a sense of where this clothing is coming from what do we know?
This clothing comes from we found five countries all around the world China
India Indonesia Bangladesh and Vietnam. These are countries that export a lot
of the clothing that we buy and and where in the U.S. 97 percent of the
clothing we wear and shoe is imported so the supply chain depends on
factories both mostly across Asia for stuff like this. So you have the Ivanka
shoes, you have the Ivanka handbags, Ivanka sort of electronics like this
little USB battery, jackets, shirts, blouses they all come from these
factories that have different labor rights issues have different wages often
very low wages and you know different standards for how they treat the workers
how workers can survive on those kinds of conditions so you know it's important
because "buy American, hire American" it's the agenda that her father has set and
now that she's in the White House, it's the agenda that she's pushing as well
and yet there's a huge contrast between that and the reality of you know the
modern clothing industry today that is so reliant and so dependent on factories
overseas to to make stuff at prices that we feel comfortable paying.
Okay so Ivanka Trump still owns this brand and that's important because even
though she and her father have talked about separating themselves from the
daily business but they've been involved with she still ultimately sees the money
from this company? Correct. She still has a vested interest for this to succeed so
you guys call up the Ivanka Trump line and you say where's your clothing made
and what happened? Yes, it was actually very interesting they invited us up to
Trump Tower and we sat down with Abigail Klem, the president of Ivanka Trump's
brand who's now running it on a daily basis now that Ivanka
Trump has removed herself from daily oversight and they told us something
really interesting which is that because of this increased scrutiny that the
brand is getting, they're actually we're in the process of increasing oversight of
their supply chain so they're talking to a nonprofit group to possibly come in
and provide some independent monitoring of the factories and try to come in and
actually look to improve conditions. They still weren't saying to you okay here's the
factory that were contracted with in Bangladesh to make this jean jacket
here's what we know about the workers there? No, and that's one thing where
we really ran into a wall in our reporting, which is the company and its
suppliers refused to disclose to us the factories where the goods are made and
so we were able to identify some of them through shipping records and customs
records but there is a big unknown mystery out there about where some of
these products are being produced. What do we know about a jacket like this that's
made in Bangladesh? So a jacket that's made in Bangladesh like this you can see
from the tag that's the country where it comes from there's another tag inside
that was sort of a number that can you know dove tail with a company or
supplier but beyond that that's it so what we had to do was we used data from
US Customs Records that track every shipment that comes in through every
port in the US on the big cargo ships that you see on the horizon when you're
looking out on the water and when they come in, they're tracked by the
trademark, they're tracked by the goods that's been shipped some of those
dovetail back to what shipper it was what what factory it was a lot of them
don't a lot of them are put into bulk shipments where you know you sort of
lose the scent. So it became following the evidence for us following the
customs records to the country or the factory if we could and then also we
went to a couple different data services that track not just customs data but
where the cargo ships are at every point along their voyage so we can see you
know this ship is traveling from China to California we know it's in the Sea of
Japan right now or or whatever so it became you know almost sort of a
sleuthing process to track it back to what hands you know were laid on these
these products to put them together. It's a very complicated process none of these
things are made in just one factory alone the fabric has to come from
somewhere the buttons have to be attached on at some point even the
buttons have Ivanka Trump brand unique and special in their own way.
There's a lot of skills that go into it a lot of
machinery is very common and that's just to make it that doesn't even dovetail
to how it comes to the US and gets transmitted in this difficult
process so you know it's not easy and a lot of the companies say we're not going
to share with you what factory we use because you know that's that's an
important part of our business we don't want to necessarily give away something
that could be you know competitive but that prevents the consumers from really
knowing are the people who made this jacket being treated in the right way
Bangladeshi especially is really interesting because it's a country that
has one of the lowest minimum wages in the world it has also has a huge garment
manufacturing industry just second to China really and you know workers there
face really different conditions in here they get paid a lot less money but they
also face sort of worker crackdowns for for asking for higher wages some of the
factory owners and even some of the government authorities will push back
arrests you know people who are who are asking for a wage boost so when you see
something like made in Bangladesh it says something I mean it says these are
the conditions that these workers face and also that this company chose to work
there and in to choose factories there that are going to build you know the
Ivanka Trump brand. What were you able to learn about the actual workers and a lot
of them are women who are making these garments which is so interesting because
Ivanka is really promoting a women who work agenda here in the United States
are really around the world she's very popular right now in China popular parts
of Europe and what did you learn about the people who actually made these garments? So
it's fascinating because the garment industry internationally is
overwhelmingly made up of women and especially in some countries where we
had reporters on the ground like Indonesia it's almost entirely women and
we heard some really interesting and compelling stories from these women a
lot of them see these jobs as a lifeline they don't have a lot of other
opportunities in poor regions so there is an economic boost they get when
factories open jobs to produce for American companies but they also face
really difficult working conditions sometimes where you have constant
beratement from supervisors who are saying work faster or work faster you
have people who still are earning very very low wages.
one woman who spoke to us in Indonesia talked about how she makes the
equivalent of about a hundred and seventy-three dollars a month and she
barely has enough to cover her rent in a one-room apartment and she doesn't think
she can save enough money to pay for her daughter's school fees because in
Indonesia you actually have to pay fees to go to elementary school and she's a
two-year-old and doesn't know how she's going to actually pay her expenses so
while these jobs do offer opportunities they do offer often also put these women
in a situation where they feel like they're barely getting by. And
unfortunately this is common throughout the garment industry so certainly not
unique to the factory that Ivanka Trump's clothing might be made in why is
it significant to look at where hers are made I mean should she be held at any
kind of different standards and other clothing companies? I think the one
standards that we have to hold her to is also as somebody who is pushing policy
who is representing the White House representing the government in a way
that she's traveling the world suggesting that family work life issues
are really important to her she's called you know caring about about how women
are treated in the workplace and their you know female empowerment as as
her life's mission so it's important to see how she acts you know when it comes
to her business but also you know these companies have extraordinary influence
over you know how they want their workers to be treated how they want
workers to be paid the conditions they're in how safe they can be in these
factories so you know there are companies big and small who do a lot
more we found than than the Ivanka Trump
brand push a little bit more to ensure that their their workers are not
necessarily facing exploitation and not facing dangerous conditions so you know
we have to ask if there were ways that maybe the Ivanka Trump brand could have
improved or or questions they could have asked somewhere along the process if
they didn't ask them why not and and if so what does that mean about you know
the truth behind the "buy American" agenda or the truth behind sort of the Ivanka
Trump kind of life mission what does it tell us about the people who are running
in the country and also you know the factories that we buy from all the time
and of course all of us buy like I said in clothes that are part of this fast
fashion industry so let's talk about who's wearing Ivanka's
clothes and where are these popular right now in the United States? We saw
such a brouhaha when Nordstrom turned decided to drop her
line a few months ago we heard White House reaction to that
so Matea who's wearing this clothes? So like anything attached to the name Trump
Ivanka Trump's brand has become a very polarizing topic right so what we found
is executive that the brand actually tell us revenues are up they were up in
2016 they're continuing to go up this year we found talking to women across
the country that women who are fans of Ivanka and really believe that she is
someone who's a role model they aspire to be like are wearing her clothes as a
political statement there is now a trend of woman posting selfies wearing Ivanka
dresses and saying using hashtags look adorable deplorable I mean really
embracing sort of the Trump political language and attaching it to her. I also
spoke to a woman who said they see her as the best part of this administration
they see her someone very relatable you know she is someone who has given
consumers or a window into her life on Instagram posting pictures of her
children and that's something that a lot of women we spoke to really connected to
and so women like the fact that it's a price point that a lot of people can
afford. Like what are we talking about here?
Let's talk about maybe the dresses are probably around $100 or
$139 dollars this jacket is about a hundred dollars and women feel like the
cut is something that's flattering and I heard that a lot from people so it's
interesting because the actual image of the brand has shifted when she started
off her company it was really about glamour and New York luxury and it's now
something that's really identified as something that Main Street can connect
with and that's those really appear to be the woman were flocking to buy her
products. Parts of the country where this brand is more popular? It's hard to
say but we did find a lot of women in red states who are buying her clothes
and very proudly wearing them. Ivanka Trump like many salespeople is selling not just a
clothing line but also a lifestyle in her new book that came out recently
"Women who Work" has a lot of through mottos and aphorisms in about like how
you can live your life and how to find your best success as a working woman so
what do we see in terms of the the branding of these items? Clearly it's
resonating with people clearly it's resonating that here we have you know a
a woman who has had you know run her own business who who is a mother who is
traveling the world who who clearly has power clearly very much on the spotlight
you know in the brand sort of follows in that in that lead.Can I just read to you
some of the label here?
So this says, "be bold, act purposefully, embrace the future, respect the past" yeah
very aspirational sort of yeah greeting card I mean these are the things that
people when they go online and look at Pinterest and and they want to feel
inspired and empowered and want to take charge. This charger says "Take charge"
Yeah, they mainly look to somebody like Ivanka Trump and they may. #Womenwhowork is on
all of the garments. That's right yeah so there's a passion there for that
lifestyle and it goes into wearing the badge that says Ivanka Trump. The marketing
of her brand I think has been incredibly savvy and they really tapped into this
idea that there was a cohort of young woman were in the workplace who wanted
to look glamorous without spending a lot of money who wanted to identify with a
young glamorous mother and so they've really captured that and interesting
when Drew and I went to the Ivanka Trump brand offices in Trump Tower
we were remarking to ourselves that we sort of felt like we were in a live
Pinterest board because there were collages of her and some of these
sayings and pictures of women and beautiful clothes everywhere
so there's a sort of a whole atmosphere even in the office that perpetuates the
marketing of the brand. Okay so you know Ivanka Trump's book has statements in it
like we must fight for ourselves for our rights not just as workers but also as
women so take us back to the company's response that you mentioned earlier when
you were asking them like where are these garments being made and who are
the women who were you know not as fortunate to be able to take charge of their
lives who are laboring in factories making Ivanka Trump clothing or really
any clothing that American consumers wear? They said the opportunities that
they've given to thousands of women all around the world
cannot be you know ignored that you know by by creating sort of a
manufacturing process that goes all across the world that they've allowed
for jobs to to be there for women who maybe are young mothers they're
seeking a job they want to leave the village they want to go into the city to
get a job and I think there are some truths about
there's some truth to this supply chain being important for those but they also
acknowledge that there are some things that they haven't been doing that they
want to do they suggested that they want to reach out to a workers rights group
or consultant to tell them ways where they have potentially been lagging
behind other brands so you know they sort of acknowledge there are potential
things that we could do to ensure that the women who are working for us are
being treated in the way that we are hoping all of our customers are being
treated and and you know that aspirational message has to if it's
going to work anywhere it needs to work everywhere for them it they can't just
be sort of reliant on women who are feeling like they have no
influence in the workplace that they're being paid too little that they're being
berated in the workplace and be preaching about a message of empowerment
elsewhere. Where does the story go from here and what have you guys learned it
on a personal level about where your clothing comes from and how this whole
supply chain works? One thing the reporting on the story drove home is
that the American Apparel industry is rooted abroad and it is really all but
impossible to bring it back in any large-scale way in fact Abigail Klem the
president of Ivanka Trump's brand said that to us so that really I think raises
questions about how far President Trump can go in his buy American agenda at
least when it comes to the apparel industry I think it also really showed
how far in some ways much of the clothing industry has come in dealing
with supply chain issues since the sweatshop scandals we heard about
involving companies like Nike right 20 years ago 25 years ago we were actually
really struck by how far many of these companies go to inspect their own
factories to go in and have programs for workers there's actually quite a bit of
transparency now one of the things we heard from a lot of experts in this
field is that consumers expect this now I mean this is a given most
sophisticated consumers who are buying fashion have a sense of workers issues
and they want to feel good about the clothes they wear right so brands are
trying to give them some comfort in that area.
All right Matea Gold covers influence in politics and money also we're talking to
Drew Harwell who covers national business retail your beats combined
perfectly together on this huge story and you guys tracked workers in how many
countries to report this? Three countries we we talked to almost 20 workers we
were in four factories talking to workers around four factories you know we
traveled across the country we talked to people across the country
so it was a huge sort of endeavor going into this really complicated industry. All
just to get at this very simple question of where is this made and who made it?
Right and there's still mysteries that we're hoping to unravel particularly in
Bangladesh where we were not able to find the exact factories and confirm
where her goods are made and we've asked the brand and it's apply repeatedly and
they refused to tell us. All right, thank you Matea, Drew, I'm Libby Casey thank you
for watching.
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