[Hashim] If I understood you correctly, you're saying
[Hashim] the universe is the god of the hindus.
[Hashim] Is that what you said?
[Varun] Yes, yes, everything is god for hindus.
[Varun] So, the whole universe is god.
[Hashim] One second.
[Hashim] Let me ask him the most basic question,
[Hashim] which is based on his question.
[Hashim] You claim that the universe is god, am I right?
[Varun] Yes!
[Swati] Everything is god.
[Hashim] Now, you know the scientist who told you
[Hashim] that life began 3.7 billion years ago?
[Varun] Yes.
[Hashim] What did they say?
[Hashim] When did the universe begin according to them?
[Varun] Yes, they even started 13 billion years ago.
[Hashim] Okay, so 13.8 billion, this is what the scientists say.
[Varun] Yes, something like that.
[Hashim] Is this when your god started?
[Varun] No, god exists forever.
[Hashim] Okay, hold on.
[Mohammad] Yes, go ahead.
[Varun] Is there any scientific evidence that resurrection will
[Hashim] actually happen or is it just a belief?
[Hashim] You had the same problem last time as well, I remember.
[Mohammad] I want to confirm the question.
[Mohammad] Are you saying is there any scientific evidence for resurrection?
[Mohammad] Is that right?
[Varun] Yes.
[Varun] Is there any scientific proof that
[Varun] resurrection will actually going to happen?
[Varun] Is there any scientific proof as scientists are saying?
[Varun] Okay, let me explain why I asked this question.
[Varun] See, I'm basically comparing the goal of
[Varun] Muslims with goal of Hindus.
[Varun] That is why I came up with question.
[Varun] See, for Hindus, the goal of Hindus,
[Varun] scientists already proved it, it will happen.
[Varun] In my opinion, scientists already prove
[Swati] Which proof has been predicted
[Swati] by science, brother Varun, within Hinduism?
[Swati] Lot of things are so unscientific in within Hinduism.
[Swati] I'm wondering because you're talking about science.
[Varun] Let me tell you, madam.
[Varun] For Hindus, their goal is to merge
[Varun] back with the Lord, that is Brahman.
[Varun] It means the universe.
[Swati] Yeah, yeah.
[Varun] Do you understand, madam?
[Varun] The universe is god for Hindus.
[Swati] I understand.
[Swati] Have you seen any scientific proof of anybody merging back?
[Varun] Wait, madam!
[Varun] Let me finish.
[Varun] Let me finish, madam.
[Varun] Let me finish.
[Swati] Sure, yeah.
[Hashim] Calm down.
[Hashim] You need to calm down.
[Hashim] Okay, so if I understood you correctly, you're saying
[Hashim] the universe is the god of the Hindus.
[Hashim] Is that what you said?
[Varun] Yes, yes, everything is god for hindus.
[Varun] So, the whole universe is god.
[Varun] So for Hindus, their goal is
[Varun] to merge back to the universe.
[Varun] And scientists are saying all the life on earth,
[Varun] it will eventually end, it will eventually go extinct.
[Varun] And that means that whole life on earth
[Varun] will eventually merge back into the universe.
[Swati] What is the proof of it—
[Hashim] Swati, one second.
[Hashim] Let me ask him the most basic question,
[Hashim] which is based on his question.
[Hashim] You claim that the universe is god, am I right?
[Varun] Yes!
[Swati] Everything is god.
[Hashim] Now, you know the scientist who told you
[Hashim] that life began 3.7 billion years ago?
[Varun] Yes.
[Hashim] What did they say?
[Hashim] When did the universe begin according to them?
[Varun] Yes, they even started like, 13 billion years ago.
[Hashim] Okay, so 13.8 billion, this is what the scientists say.
[Varun] Yes, something like that.
[Hashim] Is this when your god started?
[Varun] No, God exists forever.
[Hashim] Hold on!
[Hashim] So, the very science evidence you're seeking
[Hashim] the same scientists say that your god had a beginning.
[Varun] I understand your question.
[Hashim] Varun, calm down.
[Hashim] Just listen to the question first.
[Hashim] Your yardstick that you're waving at us is science, yes?
[Hashim] The very scientists that you're holding your yardstick
[Hashim] against or for are saying that your god
[Hashim] had a beginning some 14 billion years ago.
[Hashim] Now, you said, and I actually agree
[Hashim] with that, that God is eternal.
[Hashim] God has no beginning.
[Hashim] But the scientist—do you agree with
[Hashim] the scientist that your god had a beginning
[Hashim] because you said your god was the universe?
[Varun] Let me explain.
[Varun] I can explain that.
[Varun] I understand your question.
[Varun] I understand your question, sir.
[Varun] You're saying because universe had a beginning,
[Varun] how can universe be God?
[Varun] That is your question, right?
[Mohammad] Yes.
[Varun] Is that your question, sir?
[Hashim] Yes.
[Varun] Because universe had a beginning,
[Varun] how can universe be God?
[Varun] That is your question, right?
[Hashim] Yes, because God is eternal.
[Hashim] God doesn't have a beginning.
[Varun] Yes, I understand your question.
[Varun] I expected you to ask this question, sir.
[Varun] I'm ready for this question.
[Varun] Do you understand?
[Hashim] You're ready for the answer?
[Hashim] I'm ready for—
[Varun] Yes, I'm ready to give you the answer.
[Varun] It is mentioned in Chandogya Upanishad, okay,
[Varun] Chandogya Upanishad 6.2.1
[Varun] Chandogya Upanishad.
[Hashim] Let him finish.
[Hashim] Because we know he's not quoting
[Hashim] the scientist now all of a sudden.
[Swati] Yeah, what happened to the scientist now?
[Varun] Wait, wait, wait, madam!
[Varun] Wait for it!
[Swati] Yes, yes, please go ahead.
[Varun] In Chandogya Upanishad it says,
[Varun]
[Varun] See, it is basically saying—
[Varun] See, Brahman is two types.
[Varun] One is Brahman with no attributes
[Varun] and Brahman with full attributes.
[Varun] So it is basically non existence
[Varun] is Brahman with no attribute.
[Varun] Existence means Brahman with all kinds of attributes.
[Swati] Are you talking about Nirguna and Saguna, brother Varun?
[Swati] Are you talking about Nirguna and Saguna—
[Varun] Yes, yes, exactly!
[Varun] Exactly, madam!
[Hashim] Hold on, hold on.
[Hashim] No, no, hold on.
[Hashim] Varun, Varun.
[Hashim] Your yardstick was science.
[Hashim] So why have you gone to the Hindu scriptures, which,
[Hashim] to be honest, are not accepted by the scientists?
[Varun] What is science?
[Varun] Can you tell what is science?
[Hashim] Science is a study of the naturalistic world.
[Varun] Study of the universe, right?
[Varun] Science is the study of the universe.
[Varun] Right or wrong?
[Hashim] And they claim—
[Mohammad] Varun, wait, wait, wait.
[Swati] Yeah, that's a flawed—
[Mohammad] Science is the study based on empirical evidence, right?
[Varun] Yes, but it's still a study about the universe around.
[Mohammad] Right—no, no, no, no, no!
[Mohammad] Varun, please calm down.
[Mohammad] We're not arguing it.
[Mohammad] This is not a football match, okay?
[Mohammad] This is a discussion with adult human beings.
[Mohammad] So your yardstick, when you joined, you said,
[Mohammad] "What is the scientific evidence?"
[Mohammad] Which means, by definition, there must be from which
[Mohammad] we get empirical evidence that we can point to
[Mohammad] to say, this is what we have observed.
[Mohammad] So the question we asked you is, what is
[Mohammad] the evidence that your God is the universe?
[Mohammad] And you agreed that your God is the universe.
[Mohammad] But then we said,
[Mohammad] "Well, does your God have a beginning?"
[Mohammad] And then you said—okay, so the question is,
[Mohammad] your boundary is empirical evidence.
[Mohammad] Where is the empirical evidence that
[Mohammad] your God is the universe?
[Swati] Because that's what he's starting with.
[Mohammad] Because this is your yardstick.
[Mohammad] So we are—I want to use your measure.
[Mohammad] You see, there is no empirical evidence.
[Mohammad] Let me just finish, and then you can start.
[Mohammad] There is no empirical evidence, as far as I know,
[Mohammad] that the texts, the Hindu texts that you
[Mohammad] refer to are in any way valid.
[Mohammad] It is taken on faith.
[Mohammad] So this is not scientific.
[Mohammad] So give me the scientific evidence, not faith.
[Varun] But Hindus are right, right?
[Varun] What Hindus are saying, it is going to happen.
[Varun] It's going to happen anyway.
[Varun] So Hindus are right here, right?
[Hashim] Where is the scientific evidence, Varun?
[Hashim] That's what we've been asking you.
[Hashim] Where is the scientific evidence for your claims?
[Varun] The scientific evidence for what?
[Hashim] For your claim, where is the scientific evidence?
[Varun] What claims?
[Mohammad] You claimed that the universe—
[Hashim] You made the claim that the universe is God.
[Hashim] Okay?
[Hashim] What is your understanding of the term god in this context?
[Varun] In Hinduism, god means everything.
[Hashim] Okay, so where is the scientific for that?
[Varun] You see, when everything god means you can
[Varun] study the universe to know it.
[Varun] As one—
[Hashim] No, don't tell us to study.
[Hashim] You're making the claim.
[Hashim] The onus is on you to provide the evidence.
[Hashim] Don't tell us to study.
[Hashim] You study and you give us the answer to
[Hashim] the question or the claim that you're making.
[Varun] Even I can ask you,
[Varun] "Where is the proof that God is outside universe?
[Varun] Where is that?"
[Varun] You believe God—
[Hashim] We didn't make the claim.
[Hashim] You made a claim.
[Hashim] Yeah, we don't make that claim.
[Hashim] So if you make the claim then
[Hashim] the onus is on you to provide the evidence.
[Swati] Please provide the evidence, brother Varun.
[Hashim] Or just admit you don't have it.
[Mohammad] Yeah, so Varun, look—
[Mohammad] It's perfectly fine for you to say,
[Mohammad] "I don't know," today.
[Mohammad] "I'll go and do some research."
[Mohammad] and then we can come back and talk again another time.
[Mohammad] Okay?
[Swati] That can be done.