>>> SO YOU KNOW VLADIMIR PUTIN.
YOU THINK HES A KILLER?
>> UH-HUH, I DO.
>> WHAT PRICE MUST HE PAY.
>> THE PRICE HES GOING TO PAY
YOULL SEE SHORTLY.
HE HAD A LONG TALK, HE AND I.
I KNOW HIM RELATIVELY WELL.
AND THE CONVERSATION STARTED OFF
I SAID, I KNOW YOU AND YOU KNOW
ME.
IF I ESTABLISH THIS OCCURRED,
THEN BE PREPARED.
>> YOU SAID YOU KNOW HE DOESNT
HAVE A SOUL.
>> I DID SAY THAT TO HIM, YES.
AND HIS RESPONSE WAS WE
UNDERSTAND ONE ANOTHER.
>> THAT WAS PRESIDENT BIDEN BACK
IN MARCH.
HE WILL BE ABLE TO DELIVER THAT
MESSAGE DIRECTLY TO RUSSIAN
PRESIDENT VLADIMIR PUTIN NEXT
MONTH.
THE TWO LEADERS WILL MEET IN
GENEVA ON JUNE 16th, THE WHITE
HOUSE ANNOUNCED YESTERDAY.
THE MEETING COMES AT A TIME WHEN
THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE TWO
WORLD POWERS HAS GROWN TENSE.
EVEN MORE SO, PRESIDENT BIDEN
IMPOSED NEW SANCTIONS ON RUSSIA
LAST MONTH FOR INTERFERENCE IN
U.S. ELECTIONS.
AND THE HACKING OF AMERICAN TECH
COMPANY SOLAR WINDS.
THIS WAS AFTER BIDEN CALLED
PUTIN A KILLER.
THE RUSSIAN PRESIDENT RESPONDED
TO THE SANCTIONS AT AN ANNUAL
ADDRESS IN APRIL WHERE HE WARNED
THE WEST AGAINST CROSSING WHAT
HE CALLED RUSSIAS REDLINE.
JOINING US NOW CHAIRMAN OF THE
RENEWED DEMOCRACY INITIATIVE,
FORMER WORLD CHESS CHAMPION
GARRY KASPAROV.
GOOD TO SEE YOU.
YOU ARE AGAINST THIS MEETING.
YOU SAY IT OFFERS VLADIMIR PUTIN
TOO MUCH.
IT PUTS HIM ON THE STAGE WITH
THE WORLDS GREAT POWER.
WHY SPECIFICALLY DO YOU THINK
JOE BIDEN SHOULD NOT HOLD THIS
MEETING WITH PUTIN?
>> BECAUSE AMERICA HAS NOTHING
TO GAIN OUT OF THIS MEETING.
AND THE ONLY VALUE IS FOR PUTIN,
FACE TO FACE MEETING WITH JOE
BIDEN, THE LEADER OF THE FREE
WORLD, PROVES THAT PUTIN IS
STILL THE BIG BOSS.
THATS THE MESSAGE THAT PUTIN
DESPERATELY NEEDS TO SEND TO HIS
CRONIES AND HENCHMEN BECAUSE
AFTER BIDEN CALLED HIM A KILLER,
AND THATS A VERY STRONG
STATEMENT THAT YOU JUST AIRED,
PUTINS REPUTATION WAS
SHATTERED.
DICTATOR NEEDS TO DEMONSTRATE TO
HIS COUNTRY AND TO THE REST OF
THE WORLD HES THE AURA OF
INVINCEBILITY.
THERES NOTHING AMERICA CAN GAIN
OUT OF THIS MEETING.
WE CAN SEE THAT PUTIN KEEPS
RAISING STAKES AND MAKING
STATEMENTS THAT HE WOULD
CONTINUE INCREASING THIS TENSION
WITH THE FREE WORLD AND WE WILL
CONTINUE THIS HYBRID WAR.
SO FAR, EVERYTHING PUTIN DID
FROM AN EXIZATION OF CRIMEA AND
MANY OTHER CRIMES, BACKING ASSAD
AND USE OF CHEMICAL WEAPONS IN
SYRIA, SHUTTING DOWN THE
AIRLINER IN 2014 AND BACKING
BELORUSSIAN DICTATOR LUKASHENKO
LANDING A EUROPEAN FLIGHT IN
MINSK AND KIDNAPPING AN
OPPOSITION JOURNALIST, ITS ALL
WENT UNPUNISHED AND THE MEETING
IN GENEVA WILL CONFIRM TO PUTIN
IF HE KEEPS RAISING THE STAKES,
AMERICA AND EUROPE WILL ALWAYS
FOLLOW THE COST.
>> GARRY, WHAT IS IT ABOUT
VLADIMIR PUTIN THAT AMERICAN
PRESIDENTS UNDERESTIMATE.
LOOK DURING HIS PRESIDENCY,
GEORGE W. BUSH SEEN AS A HAWK ON
MOST FRONTS SAID HE LOOKED INTO
HIS EYES AND SAW HIS SOUL.
MITT ROMNEY WAS MOCKED ROUNDLY
BY BARACK OBAMA BY IDENTIFYING
RUSSIA AS OUR MAJOR GEOPOLITICAL
THREAT.
DONALD TRUMP OBVIOUSLY DEFERRED
TO VLADIMIR PUTIN IN HELSINKI
AND JUST ABOUT EVERY OTHER
CHANCE HE GOT.
EVEN SAYING HE TRUSTED THE EXKGB
AGENT MORE THAN HE TRUSTED OUR
INTEL COMMUNITY AT THAT HELSINKI
PRESS CONFERENCE.
WHAT IS IT ABOUT PUTIN THAT OUR
PRESIDENTS ALWAYS SEEM TO
UNDERESTIMATE, TO GET WRONG?
>> I WOULD NOT BRING THEM ALL
TOGETHER.
TRUMP IS A SEPARATE STORY AND I
DONT WANT TO WASTE TIME TALKING
ABOUT TRUMPS STRANGE RELATIONS
TO PUTIN.
ITS VERY DIFFERENT FROM OTHER
U.S. PRESIDENTS.
YOU MENTIONED GEORGE W. BUSH,
BUT WHAT HE SAID HAPPENED IN
2001.
WHILE HE WAS DEAD WRONG ON
EVALUATING PUTIN, HE HAD VERY
LITTLE DATA YET TO RELY ON.
>> RIGHT, RIGHT, RIGHT.
BUT IN 2008, THOUGH, VLADIMIR
PUTIN INVADED GEORGIA.
HE INVIEDED A COUNTRY WHILE BUSH
WAS PRESIDENT.
HE INVADED UKRAINE WHILE BARACK
OBAMA WAS PRESIDENT.
AGAIN ITS SO EASY FOR ME TO SIT
IN THE CHEAP SEATS IN 2021 AND
JUDGE ALL THESE PRESIDENTS.
I UNDERSTAND THEY WERE TRYING TO
FIND COMMON GROUND WITH HIM AND
YET IT SEEMS TO ME WITH CAN LOOK
BACK AND LOOK AT THOSE EXAMPLES
AS WARNINGS FOR THE FUTURE.
>> ABSOLUTELY.
ABSOLUTELY.
AND IN 2021 YOU MADE THIS VERY
IMPORTANT POINT.
AND IF WE HAD ANY DOUBTS IN
2001, I DIDNT BUT BUSH COULD
HAVE.
IF IN 2008 YOU COULD FIND SOME
EXCUSES FOR WAR AGAINST GEORGIA. I DIDNT.
I DIDNT.
BUT AFTER ANNEXING CRIMEA.
LOOK AT BELARUS, LUKASHENKO
WOULD NEVER HAVE DONE THAT
WITHOUT PUTINS BACKING.
SO NOW OFFERING PUTIN A MEETING
WITH NO AGENDA IS NOTHING TO
DISCUSS, AND ALSO YOU MENTIONED
SANCTIONS.
BUT AT THE SAME TIME, AMERICA
BASICALLY GAVE A GREEN LIGHT,
TOO.
PUTTING EUROPE AT RUSSIAS MERCY
FOR GAS SUPPLY BECAUSE I
UNDERSTAND BIDEN DIDNT WANT TO
SPOIL THE RELATIONS WITH
GERMANY, HIS POLICIES PROBABLY
TO REBUILD RELATIONS WITH
EUROPEAN ALLIES, BUT ITS
HAPPENING AT THE COST OF UKRAINE
AND EASTERN EUROPEAN ALLIES THAT
ARE VERY, VERY CONCERNED ABOUT
PUTINS GROWING STRENGTHS AND
HIS BELLICOSE POLICIES.
>> MIKE BARNICLE IS WITH US AND
HAS A QUESTION FOR YOU, GARRY.
>> SO, GARRY, I DONT THINK
ANYONE LISTENING TO YOU WOULD
QUIBBLE OR TAKE ANY ISSUE WITH
ANY OF THE LITANY OF AUTOCRATIC
OUTRAGES THAT BELONG TO VLADIMIR
PUTIN THAT THE WORLD HAS
WITNESSED, BUT IN THIS CASE,
THIS MEETING IS GOING TO TAKE
PLACE ON JUNE 16th BETWEEN
PRESIDENT BIDEN AND PRESIDENT
PUTIN.
SIT NOT GOING TO BE THE FIRST
TIME THAT PRESIDENT PUTIN IS
GOING TO MEET A PRESIDENT OF THE
UNITED STATES WHO ARGUABLY HAS
MORE DIPLOMATIC EXPERIENCE AND
DIPLOMATIC KNOWLEDGE OF WHO HES
CONFRONTING IN PUTIN THAN ANY OF
THE PRIOR THREE AMERICAN
PRESIDENTS COMBINED.
JOE BIDEN HAS BEEN AROUND A LONG
TIME.
HE IS A TOUGH GUY.
ISNT IT ABOUT TIME THAT A
SITTING PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED
STATES LOOKED EYEBALL TO EYEBALL
WITH VLADIMIR PUTIN AND SAID
BASICALLY, STOP.
ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.
>> YEAH.
ITS VERY NICE TO SAY STOP.
HE ALREADY CALLED HIM A KILLER.
HE DOESNT NEED A MEETING, A
HIGH-LEVEL SUMMIT WITH VLADIMIR
PUTIN, WITH RUSSIAN DICTATOR, BY
THE WAY, NOT PRESIDENT, TO
CONFIRM IT.
THERES NOTHING THAT AMERICA
WILL GAIN OUT OF THIS MEETING.
NO MATTER WHAT BIDEN SAYS, PUTIN
DOESNT CARE.
DICTATORS DO NOT CARE ABOUT
WORDS.
THEY CARE ABOUT ACTIONS.
SO FAR YOU LOOK AT THE ACTIONS
AND THEYRE WAY, WAY, WAY BEHIND
THE WORDS.
ITS TIME TO WALK THE WALK.
BIDEN DID THE TALK.
AND THIS MEETING WILL NOT ADD
MUCH TO PUTINS KNOWLEDGE OF
AMERICA.
IT WILL JUST CONVINCE HIM IF HE
KEEPS PUSHING, SO HELL GET
WHATEVER HE WANTS.
>> SO, GARRY, LETS CHANGE THE
SUBJECT PRETTY DRAMATICALLY, SO
WE -- MIKA AND I SAW THE QUEENS
GAMBIT, LOVED IT.
INSPIRED ME TO GET MY YOUNGEST
SON TO THE CHESS BOARD.
AND TEACH HIM TO PLAY A LITTLE
BIT.
SO WE GO BACK AND FORTH.
I UNDERSTAND YOU ARE A
CONSULTANT AND ACTUALLY YOU HAD
BEEN OFFERED A ROLE THERE BUT
DIDNT DO IT.
>> YES.
>> DECIDED NOT TO TAKE THAT
ROLE.
IM JUST CURIOUS, WHAT -- IF I
WANT TO TEACH MY CHILDREN TO
PLAY CHESS MORE EFFECTIVELY,
WHAT DO I DO?
>> OH.
YOU INTRODUCE THEM TO THE GAME.
THATS ALREADY THE FIRST STEP.
AND THE REST DEPENDS WHETHER
THEY HAVE INTEREST BECOMING NOT
PROFESSIONAL CHESS PLAYERS BUT
MORE INVOLVED WITH THE GAME.
AND SO MANY OPTIONS NOW --
>> I JUST WANT THEM TO BE ABLE
TO BEAT THEIR DAD AND LOVE THE
GAME AND DONT YOU HAVE SOMEBODY
TOLD ME YOU HAVE -- YOU ACTUALLY
HAVE A PROGRAM, DONT YOU?
>> NO.
I JUST LAUNCHED KASPAROV CHESS,
THE PLATFORM.
ITS A FRENCH-AMERICAN PROJECT.
ITS THE FRENCH GIANT VIVENDI
AND ST. LOUIS-BACKED.
SO I BELIEVE THAT THIS WILL
OFFER UNIQUE OPPORTUNITIES TO
STUDY CHESS, TO BECOME PART OF
THIS GLOBAL CHESS COMMUNITY.
AND ITS ALSO BASED VERY MUCH ON
THE IDEA TO ENTERTAIN.
EDUCATIONAL SHOULD BE
ENTERTAINING.
AND I THINK THAT ITS NO MATTER
HOW STRONG YOU ARE, NO MATTER
WHAT EXPERIENCE YOU HAVE IN
CHESS, YOULL FIND AN
OPPORTUNITY TO ENJOY AND BE
EDUCATED ON KASPAROVCHESS.COM.
>> VERY COOL.
>> SO KASPAROVCHESS.COM.
LET ME ASK YOU A HISTORICAL
QUESTION.
IT SEEMS TO ME AS I READ THROUGH
HISTORY, A LOT OF GREAT LEADERS
WERE OBSESSED WITH CHESS.
A LOT OF GEOPOLITICAL TITANS --
MIKAS FATHER ABSOLUTELY LOVED
CHESS.
WE HAVE A BIG PICTURE.
I WANT TO SEND IT TO YOU.
A BIG PICTURE OF DR. BRZEZINSKI
PLAYING CHESS AT CAMP DAVID.
AND THEY WERE TRYING TO SORT OF
BREAK THE TENSION.
AND THE PRIME MINISTER OF ISRAEL
COMES UP AND LOOKS AT THE CHESS
SET AND GOES CHESS, I HAVENT
PLAYED THIS IN YEARS.
>> 40 YEARS.
THEY START PLAYING AND THE
MIDDLE OF THE THIRD GAME HIS
WIFE HAS THE POOR TIMING OF
COMING UP, IM SO GLAD YOURE
PLAYING CHESS.
HE PLAYS IT EVERYDAY.
AND LOVES IT.
[ LAUGHTER ].
>> BUT TALK ABOUT, IF YOU WILL,
JUST WHAT IS IT ABOUT CHESS THAT
HELPS PEOPLE THINK MORE
CRITICALLY AND WHY A LOT OF
LEADERS, WORLD LEADERS, PLAYED
CHESS IN THE PAST.
>> I CANNOT REVEAL THE SECRET OF
THE GAME OF CHESS AND ITS
POPULARITY THAT SURVIVED
CENTURIES, YOU KNOW, IN A FEW
WORDS.
BUT IT SEEMS TO ME THAT ITS
NEVER LEAVING ATTRACTION.
TODAY WHEN WE HAVE OTHER
TEMPTATIONS ONLINE, SO CHESS HAS
BEEN STEADILY GAINING GROUND.
YOU MENTIONED POLITICAL LEADERS.
I CAN SAY THAT IN SO MANY
HOLLYWOOD MOVIES THE WAY TO SHOW
THE POWER OF THE INTELLECT OF A
CHARACTER, YOU KNOW, WAS TO
BRING A CHESS BOARD.
HUMPHRY BOGART IN CASS BLANCA.
ONE OF THE JAMES BOND ANTAGONIST
BRONSON FROM RUSSIA, JOHN WAYNE
PLAYING CHESS.
SO IT SEEMS TO ME THAT CHESS HAS
THIS AURA OF -- ITS COMBINATION