>>> IF THIS WITNESS HAD SOMETHING TO SAY THAT WOULD BE
HELPFUL TO THE WHITE HOUSE, THEY
WOULD WANT HIM TO TESTIFY.
THEY PLAINLY DON’T.
WE ARE NOT WILLING TO ALLOW THE
WHITE HOUSE TO ENGAGE US IN A
LENGTHY GAME OF ROPE-A-DOPE, SO
WE PRESS FORWARD.
>> ANNOUNCING NEW STRATEGIES TO
TRY TO PREVENT DONALD TRUMP’S
STONEWALLING THE IMPEACHMENT
PROBE.
PROBE. NOT ONLY THE FULL HOUSE VOTE BUT
THIS NEW PLAN TO CONFRONT
WITNESSES WHO TRY TO BAIL,
INCLUDING CHARLES KUPPERMAN,
TRUMP OFFICIAL WHO WENT AHEAD
AND SKIPPED A SCHEDULED
DEPOSITION TODAY.
DEPOSITION TODAY. KUPPERMAN IS SAYING HE’S NOT
DEFYING ANYTHING LAWFULLY
BECAUSE HE’S SIMPLY ASKING A
JUDGE TO RULE ON WHETHER HE HAS
TO TESTIFY.
TO TESTIFY. DEMOCRATS SAY THEY’RE NOT
PUTTING UP WITH ANY MORE TACTICS
AND WILL HOLD HIM AND OTHERS IN
CONTEMPT.
CONTEMPT. IT MAY AFFECT OTHER WITNESSES
FROM JOHN BOLTON TO RUDY
GIULIANI.
GIULIANI. POWERS TO SHIELD FROM CONGRESS
HIS CONVERSATIONS WITH CLOSE
AIDES AND GREATER PULL ON THOSE
PRIVATE WITNESSES.
PRIVATE WITNESSES. DEMOCRATS SAY THEY’RE DONE TO
TRY TO USE THE COURTS TO FORCE
TESTIMONY HERE BASICALLY SAYING
ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.
THIS IS AN IMPEACHMENT PROBE AND
OFFICIALS WHO RESIST COOPERATING
WILL BE TREATED AS ACCOMPLICES
TO THE MOUNTING EVIDENCE AGAINST
TRUMP.
TRUMP. I’M JOINED NOW BY NAEL KATYAL
FOR OPENING REMARKS.
>> THIS IS ONE IN WHICH SCHIFF
AND PELOSI AND THE HOUSE OF
REPRESENTATIVES ALREADY HAVE THE
GOODS.
GOODS. DONALD TRUMP GAVE IT TO THEM.
HE TURNED OVER THE TRANSCRIPT,
WHICH WASN’T EVEN A FULL
TRANSCRIPT.
TRANSCRIPT. WHATEVER THAT MEMORANDUM OF THE
CONVERSATION WAS ON JULY 25th.
AND THAT ITSELF IS SO DAMNING.
SO, REALLY, YOU KNOW, THE
PRESIDENT IS THE ONE BEHIND THE
EIGHT BALL.
EIGHT BALL. IT’S ONLY TESTIMONY THAT CAN
REMOVE THE REAL TAINT HERE THAT
HE COMMITTED HIGH CRIMES AND
MISDEMEANORS.
MISDEMEANORS. IF HE’S GOING TO ORDER PEOPLE
NOT TO TESTIFY AND SO ON, I
THINK SCHIFF IS ABSOLUTELY RIGHT
IN SAYING, LOOK, I DON’T NEED
THAT.
THAT. I DON’T NEED ANY OF THIS.
THE TECHNICAL LEGAL TERM FOR ALL
OF THESE FIGHTS AND STUFF LIKE
THAT IS GRAVY.
THEY DON’T NEED IT.
THEY’VE GOT WHAT THEY NEED.
AMBASSADOR SONDLAND WAS THE ONLY
THING TRUMP HAD, SONDLAND SAID
AT ONE POINT IT WASN’T A QUID
PRO QUO, AND EVEN HE HAS BACKED
WAY FROM THAT.
THE WHITE HOUSE IS IN A TASHL,
TERRIBLE POSITION.
TERRIBLE POSITION. SCHIFF IS EXACTLY RIGHT TO DO
WHAT HE DID TODAY.
>> SOMETIMES YOU AND I HAVE
POTENTIALLY INTRICATE
POTENTIALLY INTRICATE CONVERSATIONS ABOUT THE LAW
HERE.
HERE. THE NEXT QUESTION I HAVE FOR YOU
IS VERY STRAIGHTFORWARD.
FOR PEOPLE WATCHING WHO SAY,
WELL, IF MICK MULVANEY COMES OUT
AND GIVES A LONG PRESS
CONFERENCE ABOUT THE DETAILS OF
THIS, UKRAINE, BRIBERY, QUID PRO
QUO, WE DO IT ALL THE TIME, WHY
WOULD HE OR OTHERS BE ABLE TO
THEN SAY TO CONGRESS, THIS STUFF
IS SO PRIVILEGED ANDI CAN’T TALK
YOU ABOUT IT?
>> THE MULVANEY TWO-STEP IS LIKE
THE TRUMP TWO-STEP.
THEY TALK ABOUT THIS STUFF AND
BLAB ABOUT IT IN FRONT OF A
NATIONAL AUDIENCE AND THEN SAY
IT’S COVERED BY CONFIDENTIALITY
AND EXECUTIVE PRIVILEGE.
THESE CLAIMS ARE TOTALLY MADE UP
AND NO RESPONSIBLE SCHOLAR WOULD
SUPPORT THEM, WHICH IS WHY JUST
THREE DAYS AGO THE CHIEF JUDGE
IN D.C., JUDGE HOWELL, TOTALLY
REPUDIATED EVERYTHING THE
PRESIDENT HAS BEEN SAYING ABOUT
HOW THIS IMPEACHMENT INQUIRY
ALLOWS HIM TO CLAIM THESE
PRIVILEGES AND THE LIKE.
SHE CALLED IT, IT SMACKS OF
FARCE, A QUOTE IF HER OPINION.
AND THIS IS, QUOTE,
STONEWALLING, AND SHE WAS
EXACTLY RIGHT.
EXACTLY RIGHT. >> YOU MENTIONED THAT OPINION
WOULD BE APPEALED, EXACTLY THE
KIND OF CASES THAT YOU WOULD
ALWAYS ARGUE, INCLUDING FOR THE
OBAMA ADMINISTRATION.
OBAMA ADMINISTRATION. AND I HAVE ANOTHER SHORT QUOTE
FROM THE JUDGE ON ALL OF THIS
ABOUT, WHY THEY DON’T HAVE TO
TURN OVER THE MUELLER MATERIALS
AND SHE SAID, QUOTE, THE DOJ IS
JUST WRONG.
JUST WRONG. WHAT HAPPENS THEN TO THIS ON
APPEAL?
APPEAL? BECAUSE UNLIKE THE WITNESSES
WHERE THEY’RE SAYING, LOOK, WE
DON’T CARE, THE ACTUAL
UNDERLYING MUELLER -- REDACTED
MUELLER PARTS THEY WOULDN’T GET
UNTIL I UNDERSTAND IT THAT
REPEALS PROCESS IS RESOLVED OR
EXHAUSTED.
EXHAUSTED. >> RIGHT.
>> RIGHT. THAT WILL MOVE VERY QUICKLY IN
THE COURTS.
THE COURTS. THAT IS INFORMATION ABOUT THE
MUELLER INVESTIGATION, NOT ABOUT
THE UKRAINE ONE.
I THINK DEMOCRATS ARE RIGHT TO
SAY, DO THAT IN THE COURT.
WE DON’T NEED THAT.
IT’S ALL GRAVEY FOR PURPOSES OF
THE UKRAINE IMPEACHMENT
PROCEEDINGS.
PROCEEDINGS. ARI, WE DO HAVE HISTORIC
PRECEDENT FOR CASES LIKE THIS
MOVING IP CREDIBLY FAST.
THE NIXON TAPES CASE, HE TRIED
TO FILE A CASE TO SAY I HAVE
EXECUTIVE PRIVILEGE ON MAY 1st
IN THE SAME COURT THAT JUDGE
HOWELL IS IN, D.C. DISTRICT
COURT, MAY 1st, 1974, THE
SUPREME COURT ORDERED THAT CASE
HEARD ON AN EXPEDITED BASIS
RIGHT FROM THE TRIAL COURT.
THEY SKIPPED THE COURT OF
APPEALS WITH A DECISION JULY
24th, JUST A COUPLE OF MONTHS
LATER.
LATER. IT COULD MOVE QUICKLY.
THE POINT HERE IN WHICH
REPRESENTATIVE SCHIFF RECOGNIZES
IS IT DOESN’T NEED TO MOVE
QUICKLY BECAUSE UKRAINE IS
DIFFERENT AND THEY HAVE THE
GOODS.
GOODS. ONE OTHER INTERESTING PIECE
ABOUT JUDGE HOWELL’S OPINION,
ARI.
ARI. REMEMBER, NANCY PELOSI HAS SAID
TO PRESIDENT TRUMP, I DON’T NEED
A FORMAL VOTE FOR IMPEACHMENT.
HE SAID YOU NEED IT.
OTHERWISE IT’S ILLEGITIMATE.
SHE SAID NO.
THEN YOU HAVE THIS JUDICIAL
DECISION SAYING YOU DON’T NEED A
FORMAL VOTE OF IMPEACHMENT AND
NOW, IN WHAT CAN ONLY BE A
TECHNICAL LEGAL TERM THAT I
GUESS WE LAWYERS WOULD CALL IT
AS A BALLER MOVE, PELOSI SAYS
I’M NOW GOING TO SEEK THE FORMAL
VOTE OF IMPEACHMENT.
I THINK THE REASON FOR THAT IS
SHE KNOWS SHE’S GOT THE GOODS.
THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES HAS
THE GOODS.
THE GOODS. THE PRESIDENT IS GOING TO BE
IMPEACHED.
IMPEACHED. IT’S IN BLACK AND WHITE IN WHAT
HE SAID ON JULY 25th.
>> I ALWAYS LOVE IT WHEN NEAL
KATYAL GETS TO THE LEGAL
EQUIVALENT OF BALLING.
YOU MAKE SUCH AN INTERESTING
POINT THERE, TO THOSE WHO ARE
FOLLOWING YOU CLOSELY.
A LOT OF OUR VIEWERS ARE.
THAT THE SPEAKER WAITED TO MOVE
IN A POSITION OF STRENGTH.
THEY LAID OUT AND WON PROCEDURAL
VICTORIES IN COURT TO SAY THAT
THEY DON’T NEED TO DO THIS.
THEY’RE NOT DOING IT IN RESPONSE
TO THE PRESIDENT, A POSTURING
VICTORY, AND THEY GO AHEAD AND
DO IT.
DO IT. EVENTUALLY YOU DO HAVE FLOOR
VOTES.
VOTES. HAYS WHERE IT’S HEADING.
FASCINATING ON THAT.
AS SIGHI SAY THANK YOU AND GOOD-
YOU HAVE A NEW BOOK COMING OUT.
WE WANT TO MENTION THAT HERE ON
"THE BEAT," AS FRIENDS OF NEAL
KATYAL.
KATYAL. IT’S CALLED "IMPEACH: THE CASE
OF DONALD TRUMP."
I ASSUME WE’LL BE DRAWING ON