SECRET SECURITY CLEARANCE. GOOD DAY FROM MSNBC WORLD
HEADQUARTERS IN NEW YORK
I’M FRANCES RIVERA
LONG TIME TRUMP FRIEND ROGER
STONE TALKING TO NBC NEWS
OUTSIDE OF HIS HOME IN FLORIDA
ONE DAY AFTER THE SPECIAL
COUNSEL CHARGED HIM.
HERE’S WHAT HE SAID JUST A SHORT
TIME AGO
TIME AGO >> THIS WAS AN EGREGIOUSOVER
REACH BY MR. MUELLER, THE FBI
DIRECTOR WHO HAD TO HAVE
APPROVED THIS RAGE SHOULD IN MY
OPINION BE FIRED OVER IT BECAUSE
IT WAS UNWARNED.
I GUESS IT’S AN EFFORT TO
INTIMIDATE ME BUT I AM NOT
INTIMIDATED.
INTIMIDATED. I AM CONCERNED FOR MY WIFE AND
ONE OF MY DOGS IS STILL
TRAUMATIZED, WILL NOT COME OUT
FROM UNDER THE BED AND WON’T
STOP SHAKING
STOP SHAKING THE ALLEGATION THAT TWO CAMPAIGN
OFFICIALS INSTRUCTED ME OR
INQUIRED OF ME ABOUT WIKILEAKS
IS FALSE
IS FALSE >> STONE DENYING ONE OF THE MOST
CONSEQUENTIAL ALLEGATIONS.
CONSEQUENTIAL ALLEGATIONS. PROSECUTORS ARE WRITING "A
SENIOR TRUMP CAMPAIGN OFFICIAL
WAS DIRECTED TO CONTACT STONE
ABOUT ANY ADDITIONAL RELEASES
AND OTHER DAMAGING INFORMATION
WIKILEAKS HAD REGARDING THE
CLINTON CAMPAIGN."
CLINTON CAMPAIGN." SO THE QUESTION NOW CAPTURING
THE POLITICAL AND LEGAL WORLD,
DID THEN CANDIDATE DONALD TRUMP
GIVE THAT DIRECTIVE?
STONE DENIES TRUMP WAS INVOLVED
IN TALKS ABOUT WIKILEAKS
AND THE PRESIDENT DEBS ANY
COLLUSION.
COLLUSION. ROGER STONE IS SET TO APPEAR IN
COURT ON TUESDAY CHARGED WITH
SEVEN COUNTS OF LYING TO
CONGRESS, OBSTRUCTION AND
WITNESS TAMPERING.
WITNESS TAMPERING. HE WAS NOT CHARGED THOUGH WITH
CONSPIRING AGAINST THE UNITED
STATES
STATES BUT HIS INDICTMENT REVEALS A
CLEARER PICTURE OF POTENTIAL
TIES BETWEEN THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN
AND WIKILEAKS.
AND WIKILEAKS. JOINING ME IS FORMER TRUMP
CAMPAIGN ADVISER SAM NUNBERG
GREAT TO HAVE YOU WITH ME RIGHT
HERE.
HERE. >> THANK YOU.
>> THIS IS THE FIRST TIME YOU
HEARD THOSE WORDS FROM ROGER
STONE AS HE STEPPED OUT MOMENTS
AGO.
AGO. WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS CALLING
IN AN AINGE JUS OVERREACH BY
MR. MUELLER AND SAYING HIS DOGS
ARE TRAUMATIZED?
ARE TRAUMATIZED? >> IT SEEMED IT WAS PRETTY
AGGRESSIVE THAT THEY RAIDED
ROGER’S HOUSE LIKE THAT FROM
WHAT I UNDERSTAND WAS 39 FBI
AGENTS
AGENTS AND THAT THEY CAME THERE EARLY
IN THE MORNING WHICH FINE, IS
ROUTINE.
ROUTINE. BUT KNOWING ROGER, WAS EXPECTING
TO BE INDICTED I AM SURE THAT HE
WOULD HAVE GONE TO -- HE WAS NOT
GOING TO FLEE THE COUNTRY, NOR
WAS HE GOING TO DESTROY ANYTHING
AFTER HE ALREADY KNEW HE WAS
GOING TO BE INDICTED
BUT THAT’S UP TO THE FBI
I MEAN, THAT’S ONE OF THE ISSUES
THAT HAVE PEOPLE HAVE COMPLAINED
ABOUT WITH THIS INVESTIGATION
ABOUT SOME OF THESE PEOPLE HAVE
BEEN TREATED
BEEN TREATED >> DOES THAT SURPRISE YOU HOW
HE’S SPEAKING AND TAKE THE TONE
HE HAS AND THE MESSAGE HE’S
GIVING OUT THERE
HE WAS YOUR MENTOR.
>> YES.
>> YES. >> YOU HAD PREDICTED THIS WAS
GOING TO BE COMING
> RIGHT.
> RIGHT. >> TIME AND TIME AGAIN HERE.
BASED ON YOUR KNOWLEDGE ABOUT
THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN, WHAT DOES IT
TELL YOU NOW ESPECIALLY WITH
POOES THESE INDICTMENTS?
>> ROGER IS GOING TO NOT PLEAD
GUILTY
GUILTY HE’S ALREADY SAID THIS
I AM SURE ROGER WILL WANT TO
TAKE THIS CASE TO TRIAL JUST IN
THE VERY INSTANCE BECAUSE OF HIS
PERSONALITY THAT HEAL MAKE THE
GOVERNMENT HAVE TO PROBLEM THEIR
CASE
CASE THIS WILL BE BE SOMETHING PEOPLE
HAVEN’T SEEN BEFORE.
IT WILL BE AN O.J. SIMPSON TYPE
CASE FOR POLITICS.
ROGER JUST SAID IF YOU READ THE
INDICTMENT, FRANCES, THERE’S A
PART WHERE ROGER HAD CONTACT
WITH STEVE BANNON.
THE PART WE’RE ALL TALKING ABOUT
IS THE UNNAMED TRUMP ADVISERS IN
JULY WHEN MANAFORT AND GATES ARE
THERE AND WHO DIRECTED THEM.
IF HE IS SAYING NONE OF THAT IS
TRUE, THE GOVERNMENT HAS TO
PROVE THAT
PROVE THAT THAT WOULD GO ALSO TO SAYING
THAT ROGER DID NOT HAVE THE
INTENT TO LIE TO CONGRESS
BECAUSE HE WAS NOT COVERING
ANYTHING UP IN TERMS OF NOT
TALKING ABOUT CORSI.
>> TALKING ABOUT THE WORD
DIRECTED IN THIS TOP LINE HERE
VERY INTERESTING ABOUT THAT.
IT’S INTERESTING, YOU TALKED
ABOUT IT BEFORE.
THE QUESTION NOW IS, WHAT WILL
IT TAKE?
IT TAKE? WILL HE GET PUSHED SEWED FAR TO
FLIP
FLIP HE SAID IN THE PAST 24 HOURS
HE’S GOING TO DO IT.
HE WAS GOING TO FIGHT THIS
YOU COULD SEE HIM TAKING THOSE
YEARS IN JAIL BECAUSE WHAT WILL
HAPPEN AFTER.
HAPPEN AFTER. >> >> HE WOULD LOVE LIMELIGHT
AFTERWARDS.
AFTERWARDS. >> ROGER IS SOMEONE WHO SAID
YESTERDAY IT’S BETTER TO BE
INFAMOUS THAN NOT FAMOUS
REMEMBER, PRESIDENT TRUMP OPENED
UP THE GOVERNMENT AND SPEAKER
PELOSI STARTS TWEETING ABOUT
ROGER STONE YESTERDAY.
THIS CASE HAS LARGE IMPLICATIONS
AND THE INDICTMENT HAS LARGE
IMPLICATIONS TO THE CONSPIRACY
CHARGE THAT THE PRESIDENT WILL
BE FACING IN CONGRESS.
ROGER FOR HIS PART AS OPPOSED TO
ME WHO I NO LONGER HAVE HAS AN
AFFINITY AND BOND WITH THE
PRESIDENT HE WILL STAND BY HIM
HE’S A FRIEND OF HIS.
>> I WANT TO TALK TO YOU ABOUT
TO THE INVOLVEMENT
WHERE IN ALL OF THIS DOES THE
PRESIDENT FALL, RIGHT?
WE HAVE THIS PORTION IN THE
INDICTMENT THAT SAYS, "SENIOR
TRUMP CAMPAIGN OFFICIALS REACHED
OUT TO STONE TO ASK ABOUT
INFORMATION WIKILEAKS WAS
EXPECTED TO RELEASE ON HILLARY
CLINTON.
CLINTON. I WANT TO PLAY WHAT STONE TOLD
FOX NEWS WHO THOSE OFFICIALS MAY
HAVE BEEN.
HAVE BEEN. AND WE’LL TALK ABOUT IT.
>> WHEN THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN
OFFICIAL WHO DIRECTED STONE TO
FIND OUT ABOUT WIKILEAKS WAS
DONALD TRUMP
DONALD TRUMP NO, IT WAS NOT
THERE ARE SEVERAL THINGS IN HERE
IN THE INDICTMENT THAT ARE
SIMPLY NOT TRUE.
>> SO WHO WAS IT IF IT WASN’T
THE PRESIDENT?
THE PRESIDENT? >> WELL, I HAVE TO SPECULATE
ABOUT THAT, SINCE IT NEVER
HAPPENED, IT APPEARS TO ME THAT
THEY HAVE COMPOSED TESTIMONY FOR
SOMEONE.
SOMEONE. PERHAPS RICK GATES, PERHAPS
STEVE BANNON
STEVE BANNON >> ALL RIGHT
SO YOU JUST MENTIONED THIS
YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT THAT.
HOW FAR IN THERE IS THE
INVOLVEMENT?
INVOLVEMENT? COULD IT BE DONALD TRUMP
>> LOOK, THE SHORT ANSWER IS WE
DON’T KNOW
DON’T KNOW MUELLER IS VERY, VERY CAREFUL
ABOUT HOW HE DRAFTS THESE
INDICTMENTS.
INDICTMENTS. THAT WAS PUT IN THERE FOR A
REASON
REASON I SUSPECT THAT WAS PUT IN THERE
FOR A REASON FOR MUELLER’S
PURPOSE BECAUSE OF COMING
INDICTMENTS.
INDICTMENTS. THAT’S A PRESUMPTION
I HAVE NO OBVIOUSLY DIRECT
KNOWLEDGE OF IT.
BUT IN TERMS OF ROGER, THAT IS A
CRITICAL POINT
CRITICAL POINT AND IF ROGER SAYS THAT THIS
CONVERSATION DID NOT HAPPEN,
WE’LL SEE ROGER’S DEFENSE,
FRANCES.
FRANCES. THEN IT WOULD MAKE SENSE THAT
ROGER DID NOT LIE TO CONGRESS
BECAUSE ROGER DID NOT RECALL
POSSIBLY THE COURSECY ISSUE.
WHAT I THINK THE INDICTMENT MADE
THE POINTS OF WAS THAT ROGER,
THEY’RE ARGUING THE SPECIAL
COUNSEL IS GOING TO ARGUE
BECAUSE HE WAS DIRECTED I BY THE
TRUMP CAMPAIGN, HE DID THE WANT
TO DISCLOSE HE WAS HAVING
CONVERSATIONS WITH CORSI.
>> I WANT TO EXPAND ON SOMETHING
YOU TOLD ARI MELBER WHEN YOU
WERE ON WITH HIM AS FAR AS ROGER
STONE COL INCLUDING WITH RUSSIA.
LET’S REMIND OUR VIEWERS.
>> WAS HE TRYING TO INCLUDE?
I THINK HE WAS
I DON’T THINK HE DID
I THINK HE CONSPIRED AGAINST
HIMSELF.
HIMSELF. WHAT HE HAVE GONE?
LOOK, I CAN’T SPEAK FOR HIM BAU
MAYBE HE WOULD HAVE.
>> THAT’S EXACTLY RIGHT.
WHAT I’M SAYING IS, WOULD HE
HAVE MET WITH ASSANGING IF
ASSANGE -- I BELIEVE ASSANGE IS,
I’M NOT ARGUING HE ISN’T
WOULD HE HAVE MET WITH
ASSANGING?
ASSANGING? WOULD HE HAVE STRATEGIZED WITH
ASSANGE?
ASSANGE? YES, HE WOULD HAVE, BUT HE
DIDN’T
DIDN’T HE WAS DESPERATE
WHAT HE DID WAS, I THINK,
UNFORTUNATELY FOR HIM, IS ONE,
OBVIOUSLY MADE HIMSELF A PUBLIC
TARGET
TARGET EVERYBODY HAS BEEN TALKING ABOUT
THESE TWEETS HE HAS DONE, THE
PODESTA TWEETS, TWEETS COMING IN
OCTOBER OF 2016.
YOU COULD SEE HIS EXPLANATION
FOR IT, BUT NUMBER TWO, WHAT WE
DO SEE FROM THE INDICT IS THAT
HE WAS TRYING TO
HE WAS TRYING TO BUT HE DIDN’T
I CAN’T TELL YOU IF HE DID
I WOULD THINK IF HE HAD THE -- I
COULD SEE ROGER HAVING A CAMERA
AND VISITING WITH JULIAN ASSANGE
DURING THE SUMMER OF 2016
BECAUSE THAT IS ROGER’S
MYSTIQUE, THAT IS THE IDEA OF
BEING RELEVANT, BEING PART OF
THE RUCKUS OF THE ELECTION
BUT HE DIDN’T.
>> TALK A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT
THAT
THAT IT’S FASCINATING
IT’S FASCINATING AGAIN, AS A GUY HOW WORKED SO
CLOSELY WITHEN ABKNOW IN THE
LEVEL THAT YOU DO, AND HERE HE
IS COMING OUT AND KNOWING YOU
KNOW, LIKE WE SAID, HE
SELF-PROCLAIMED DIRTY TRICKSTER.
HE HAS THIS TATTOO ON THE BACK
YESTERDAY HE COMES OUT AND DOES
THE NIXON WAVE HERE.
WHAT ARE WE GOING TO SEE.
>> I’M SURE THAT WILL PICTURE
WILL BE FRAMED IN HIS HOUSE TWO
MONTHS FROM NOW.
>> THERE YOU GO.
>> RIGHT.
>> RIGHT. >> SO IS THIS ROGER STONE WE’RE
GOING TO BE SEEING TIME AND TIME
AGAIN WHETHER OR NOT THERE IS
GOING TO BE COLLUSION CHARGE
DOWN THE ROAD, OR WE SEE THIS GO
TO TRIAL AND HE STICKS WITH IT
FOR SPITE.
FOR SPITE. >> HERE’S WHAT I THINK HAVING
ONCE AGAIN BECAUSE OF BEING IN
THE GRAND JURY, BEING IN THE
SENATE INTEL, I THINK THAT THEY
HAVE GIVEN A COMPLETE FORENSIC
TO ROGER STONE
IF THEY HAD EVIDENCE THAT ROGER
COLLUDED DIRECTLY WITH THE
RUSSIANS OR MET WITH JULIAN
ASSANGE DIRECTLY, THEY WOULD
HAVE RELEASED IT OR THEY WOULD
HAVE WAYED FURTHER DOWN THE LINE
IN TERMS OF THE NARRATIVE THAT
MUELLER IS BUILDING WITH THESE
INDICTMENTS.
INDICTMENTS. SO WHAT I DO THINK IS ONCE
AGAIN, ASSUMING ROGER HAS THE
MEANS, HE WILL DEFEND HIMSELF
AND THIS WILL BE A SPECTACLE OF
A TRIAL AND THAT WILL GO TO A
JURY.
JURY. >> DOESN’T HE HAVE THE MEANS
>> WELL, I DON’T KNOW HIS BANK
ACCOUNT.
ACCOUNT. I THINK HE WILL HAVE THE MEAN
FROM PUBLIC SUPPORT THROUGH HIS
LEGAL DEFENSE FUND, YES, I THINK
HE WILL.
HE WILL. ONCE AGAIN, NANCY PELOSI HAS
CALLED OUT THE PRESIDENT BASED
ON THIS INDICTMENT
ROGER WILL BE A CRITICAL PIECE
TOWARDS SAVING THE PRESIDENCY.
>> IT’S INTERESTING HE CAME OUT
WITHIN THE PAST HOUR AND AGAIN,
I THINK IT’S FASCINATING YOU’RE
SEEING IT AND HEARING IT FOR THE
FIRST TIME
FIRST TIME HE’S SAYING HE’S NOT
INTIMIDATED.
INTIMIDATED. THERE’S A LITTLE SMILE HERE AND
HE GOES ON TO SAY HE’S NOT
INTIMIDATED.
INTIMIDATED. WHAT’S HE DOING BEHIND CLOSED
DOORS TODAY AND IN THE DAYS TO
COME
COME >> IF I HAD TO GUESS, HE’S
STRATEGIESING.
STRATEGIESING. HE’S STUDYING THE INDICTMENT,
HAVING OTHER LAWYERS, OTHER
PROFESSIONALS WITHIN THE
ATTORNEY/CLIENT PRIVILEGE.
ATTORNEY/CLIENT PRIVILEGE. >> AN?
>> AN? >> STRATEGIZING FOR WHAT
OUTCOME?
OUTCOME? >> I DO NOT BELIEVE THERE IS A
CHANCE THAT ROGER WOULD IN ANY
CASE COOPERATE WITH THE
GOVERNMENT ESPECIALLY BECAUSE
ROGER HAS ALREADY PUBLICLY
STATED NUMEROUS TIMES HE DID NOT
DISCUSS WIKILEAKS WITH THE
PRESIDENT.
PRESIDENT. SO THEREFORE, I DON’T KNOW HOW
HE COULD THEN YOU KNOW OFFER
ANYTHING TO THEM
WHAT I THINK IS THAT ROGER WILL
THINK ROGER WILL PUT ON A CASE
TO A JURY AND HE WILL FIGHT
THIS
THIS AND HE WILL LOOK FOR A FAIR
TRIAL.
TRIAL. >> DO YOU THINK THERE’S ANY PART
OF THIS HE REALIZES THAT THAT
JAIL CELL, JAILTIME PRISON WOULD
BE PART OF HIS REALITY IN 20
PLUS I BELIEVE IS THE SENTENCE,
THE PENALTY?
THE PENALTY? >> 20 PLUS WOULD BE ACTUALLY IF
THEY DID THAT -- THAT WOULD BE
RIDICULOUS.
RIDICULOUS. >> REALLY?
>> REALLY? >> WELL, FOR -- FOR WHAT HE’S
BEEN CHARGED WITH, I THINK THEY
SHOULD HAVE A LITTLE THE JUSTICE
DEPARTMENT AND MUELLER SHOULD
HAVE A LITTLE -- THEY HAVE YOU
HAD HAVE A LITTLE -- BE A
LITTLE -- WHAT I WOULD SAY IS IF
HE -- I THINK HE’S WILLING TO
FACE THE CONSEQUENCES.
THIS WHOLE IDEA I’VE BEEN
HEARING HE COULD GET 20 YEARS,
NORMALLY PEOPLE SAY THIS IS A
FOUR-YEAR, TWO OR THREE YEARS.
I THINK HE’S ACCEPTED THE FACT
HE’S GOING TO BE INDICTED.
HE SAID IT PUBLICLY IN AUGUST
LAST YEAR.
LAST YEAR. I THINK PROBABLY EVEN EARLIER
THAN THAT.
THAN THAT. YOU COULD NOT HAVE CALLED IN AS
MANY PEOPLE OF HIS -- IN HIS
SPHERE AS THEY DID AND NOT EVEN
ASK HIM A SINGLE QUESTION.
AND HIS LAWYERS PUBLICLY SAID
THAT THEY HAD REACHED OUT TO THE
SPECIAL COUNSEL’S OFFICE AND
NEVER BEEN CONTACTED BACK.
I HOPE HE DOES GET BETTER
LAWYERS I WOULD SAY.
>> YOU ALSO MENTIONED EARLIER
THAT IF HE DOES DO TIME, YOU CAN
SEE HIM COMING OUT, GETTING
SPEECHES, AND DOING THE WHOLE
ROGER STONE THING.
>> SURE.
>> SURE. LOOK AT JAY GORDON LIDDY
A LOT OF NIXON PEOPLE THAT WILL
STAYED PART OF REPUBLICAN
POLITICS AFTER THEY CAME OUT
THE NATIONALLY SYNDICATED RADIO
SHOWS AND THEY WERE AROUND THE
ARENA AS NIXON USED TO CALL IT
IN THE ARENA
SO I PERSONALLY HOPE IT DOESN’T
HAPPEN.
HAPPEN. >> TELL ME WHY
WHY IS THAT THE CASE THAT YOU
DON’T THINK THAT HAPPENS
>> I SAID I HOPE IT DOESN’T.
I CAN’T TELL YOU WHAT’S GOING TO
HAPPEN IN THE CASE
I THINK ROGER IS A VICTIM OF
HIS -- WE WERE MISTREATED BY
TRUMP IN THE BEGINNING OF THIS
CAMPAIGN
CAMPAIGN I WAS FIRED, ROGER QUIT.
WE WERE NOT TREATED WELL
THE MINUTE SOMEBODY ELSE WAS
BROUGHT IN
BROUGHT IN TRUMP IS NOT A LOYAL PERSON BUT
ROGER IS VERY LOYAL TO TRUMP.
>> YOU THINK HE WAS VICTIMIZED
>> I DON’T WANT TO SAY -- I
THINK THAT HE -- IT’S TOUGH TO
SAY HE’S A VICTIM.
I THINK THAT HE PUT HIMSELF IN A
POSITION THAT HE WANTED TO
INGRATIATE HIMSELF AND CONTINUE
TO HELP DONALD TRUMP
DONALD TRUMP DIDN’T -- THOSE
PEOPLE THERE DIDN’T WANT
ANYTHING TO DO WITH HIM EVEN IF
TRUMP WAS TALKING TO HIM
I FOUND THAT VERY DISRESPECTFUL.