Speaker 1: Let's go to Vince from Wisconsin. Vince, you're on the air. What's on your mind?
Speaker 3: Before David Pakman, I I'm just wondering, what do you think, what punishment
do you think the ringleaders of the coup should receive like Trump? Orly Cruz, Giuliani, these
people Speaker 1: depends what I mean. Listen, this
is a question really for prosecutors. You have to figure out. First of all, the did
they commit any crimes if they committed crimes? What can you prove in court? And so I just
don't know. And this is part of why I've said, I don't think that the general insiders are
going to suffer any consequences because it's not clear to me what specific crimes you could
actually successfully charge them with. We all know that they spent months fomenting
an environment where they had ignorant, rage filled people weaponized and ready to go completely
crazy on January six. But I don't know that that is a clear path towards any specific
charges, which is why I don't think they're going to be charged.
Speaker 3: And do you think that maybe a part of a reason why prosecutors on charges that
they might be afraid of, of the cult coming to potentially harming their families?
Speaker 1: No, I don't think so. I think that for me, I've said before, I believe if one
prosecutor charged Trump, there would be more prosecutors that would be ready. But it's
I understand that there are likely prosecutors who don't want to be the first to charge a
former president because that is a really, really big deal in the context of American
democracy. But no, I don't think the reason they aren't charging these people is because
they're worried about their families. I just think it's not completely clear that they
think any of the charges will stick. Speaker 3: Yeah. Just reading the other day
that the New York charges are sort of fizzling out, nothing's really going on with that.
Speaker 1: Well, but that's that's a different situation. What appears to be happening with
the Manhattan D.A. is that prosecutors quit because they became aware that the D.A. didn't
really seem to have any intention of charging Trump. And they were like, Well, what the
hell are we doing investigating that? That's a that's a different situation, I would say.
Speaker 3: What's the deal with the D.A. to charge there? So. Right? I mean, it just seems
like, you know, in this country, you only get consequence. Rich, rich and powerful people
only receive consequences if they screw over other rich, richer and more powerful people.
Speaker 1: There are definitely there is a two tiered justice system in the United States,
that's for sure. Speaker 3: And even even if I think they should
at least try, even if it doesn't succeed, but because then you set the precedent that
you can, you can be charged that you can prosecute them.
Speaker 1: That's that's up for debate. I mean, if you don't believe the charges will
stick and that they will go anywhere, there's risks both personally to prosecutors and and
systemically to starting to charge former presidents with stuff you don't really think
you can get them on. So I don't know. I think some legal experts would disagree with you
on that. Speaker 3: Yeah, if it's a low chance that
maybe they shouldn't, but if it's a decent chance, then you know it might make future
people future presidents. You know, think twice about doing this stuff.
Speaker 1: I agree if you think you can demonstrate it in court, even if you're not going to get
a guilty verdict. But if you think you can seriously demonstrate in court the wrongdoing,
which often includes proving state of mind, which can be tough. I completely agree with
you that charges should be brought. Speaker 3: It's just such a disheartening
to me, but thanks for taking my call. Speaker 1: My pleasure. Thank you very much.
That's Vince from Wisconsin. Let's go next to where are we going next? Let's go to Peleg
from Israel Peleg. You are on the air. Speaker 3: Hello, David. It's my second time
calling in. I remember last year on the October 17th show. Yeah, you do. It's great to talk
to you again. Speaker 1: Likewise.
Speaker 3: So my question is more general about in developed countries or in developing
countries, I should say. What do you think is the best way to strengthen democracy there
and build up a system that is desirable? Speaker 1: You are are you saying many developing
countries are democratic, so can you clarify, are you saying in in particular developing
countries that are not democratic? Speaker 3: Yes. Also like helping them economically
to build social democracy there and generally a desirable economic system?
Speaker 1: I mean, the think about the question is it presumes that we need to be helping
every country. I mean, there's lots of countries that are developing, but we're, you know,
we're doing business with them. We're helping them in terms of industry by buying things
from them. I don't know. I think it's a little presumptive to assume we need to be doing
more necessarily. I think that I would first say prove to me we should be doing anything.
Speaker 3: Oh, I meant through trade and aid, not anything interventionalists.
Speaker 1: Oh, OK, yeah. I mean, listen, then we continue trading. I don't know. I mean,
listen, it starts. What? What ideas do you have? For how through trade, you'd like to
see us support democracy in another country. What's an example?
Speaker 3: For example, if you look at the it's called the Commitment to Development
Index. You could see that it's pretty interesting the social democracies, and it's an index
that measures how much a country is committed to helping developing developing countries.
And you look at it has six metrics. If I remember correctly, I don't remember all of them, but
it's trade aid technology, health. All of these factors, I think, are very important.
I don't remember the U.S. being high up there in the list, but I remember Denmark being
pretty high there so that that was something I was interested in. Can I ask you another
question? Sure. So do you have any book recommendations? Speaker 1: Sure, I mean, what fiction, nonfiction,
what genre Speaker 3: economics or nonfiction economics
that I'm sorry. Actually, the specific Speaker 1: nonfiction economics, let's see.
I what have I read recently? I read a book by Esther Duflo and Abhijit Banerjee called
what was the name of the book? Hold on a second. This was a good economics book. It wasn't
oh, good economics for hard times. I would recommend that that's a that's a sort of somewhat
new economics book I've read that I thought was quite good. Also, Angus Deaton recently
wrote, Let me see if I can find the name of the book The Great Escape, which is a really
good book. The Great Escape by Angus Deaton. It's actually nine years old and then also
deaths of despair by Angus Deaton. I would recommend both of those as well.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I'm familiar with Energous. Data is pretty interesting and I I get to
read these books, but I'll also, I'll be sure to read them beautifully.
Speaker 1: Thank you. How? How's the weather in Israel? Is it nice?
Speaker 3: Whether in Israel is pretty bipolar, I mean, like we had pretty huge rains, which
is pretty good for Israel because it's a pretty dry country. You know, the kinetic, which
is the sea or of the lake, I should say shrinking. But then we have rain, so it's getting bigger.
This that's a good thing. But then we had like a period of a month or so where it was
like relatively hotter and then the rains came back yesterday. I don't know what's happening.
Wow. Speaker 1: Are you? Are you in what part of
the country are you in? Speaker 3: So I am in Ashkelon, near Ashkelon,
I should say, but it's sort of in the south, the center of the country, but then I went
to uni from the IDF. I went to uni. They subsidize it. So that's in the north, like that's in
the other half of the of the country. So and now I went back for a month back to my home
and I'm going to go back in the 20th of March, back to the Technion.
Speaker 1: Well, a lot, a lot going on. I think Wolf Blitzer's from Ashkelon. I don't
know why that's in my mind, I think. But don't quote me on that, Peleg. OK, I appreciate
the call. OK, have
a good one. All right, there's Peleg from Ashkelon.