>>> WELCOME BACK TO VELSHI AND RUEHL.
RUEHL. THE FINAL VOTE IS UNDER WAY IN
MISSISSIPPI.
MISSISSIPPI. A CONTENTIOUS SENATE RUNOFF
BETWEEN ESPY AND HYDE-SMITH.
CLOUDED BY RACIAL JOURPDUNDERTON
CONTROVERSY.
CONTROVERSY. THE STATE HASN’T VOTED A
DEMOCRAT INTO THE SENATE SINCE
1982.
1982. THAT WAS 36 YEARS AGO.
AMONG THE POPULATION, THERE’S A
STRONG RACIAL DIVIDE, 59% IS
WHITE, 38% IS BLACK.
THE 1954 LANDMARK SUPREME COURT
DECISION BROWN VERSUS BOARD
MANDATED SCHOOLS DE SS NOT SEGRE
MAINLY WHITE STUDENTS MOVED TO
PRIVATE SCHOOLS IMMEDIATELY
AFTER THAT CASE.
FROM THE 1960s THROUGH THE
1980s.
1980s. TWO-THIRDS OF THOSE STUDENTS
CAME FROM SIX OTHER STATES,
MAINLY MISSISSIPPI.
MAINLY MISSISSIPPI. BASICALLY BLACK STUDENTS
COULDN’T OVERCOME.
COULDN’T OVERCOME. THEY WERE WHITE SCHOOLS.
THAT HASN’T CHANGED AS MUCH AS
YOU MIGHT THINK.
A SOUTHERN FOUNDATION STUDY
FOUND THAT 87% OF PRIVATE SCHOOL
EPROLLMENT IN MISSISSIPPI IS
WHITE.
WHITE. JOINING US NOW, GEORGETOWN
UNIVERSITY PROFESSOR, HE IS ALSO
THE AUTHOR OF TEARS WE CAP NOT
STOP, A SERMON TO WHITE AMERICA.
NBC NEWS POLITICAL ANALYST AND
ELISE JORDAN.
ELISE JORDAN. >> CALEB, YOU’VE BEEN COVERING
THIS ELECTION.
THIS ELECTION. YOU WERE THERE THE DAY CINDY
HYDE-SMITH MADE THE PUBLIC
HANGING CONTEST.
HANGING CONTEST. YOU SAID, IT IS THAT REPORTING
THESE REMARKS DIDN’T OCCUR TO
ME.
ME. I HEARD PUBLIC HANGING AS A PLAY
UPON THE SENATOR’S BACKGROUND AS
A FARMER.
A FARMER. MORE BLUNTLY PUT, I HEARD WHAT I
HEARD BECAUSE I AM WHITE.
I’VE HAD LIMITED LIFE EXPERIENCE
AND THAT EXPERIENCE HAS BEEN
INFLUENCED BY THE HISTORY OF
WHITENESS IN THE AMERICAN SOUTH.
I HAVE NO RELATIVES WHO WERE
THREATENED WITH LYNCHING.
IT’S A PERSONAL AVERSION TO THE
SPECTACLE OF PUBLIC EXECUTIONS.
I HAD THE LUXURY OF HEARING
THOSE COMMENTS ONLY WITH POP
CULTURE WESTERN.
CULTURE WESTERN. THIS IS NOT ANCIENT HISTORY.
NOT AN OLD AND FORGOTTEN WOUND.
THERE ARE PEOPLE ALIVE TODAY WHO
ARE OLD ENOUGH TO HAVE HAD
FAMILY MEMBERS LYNCHED BY A
WHITE MOB.
WHITE MOB. IF WE WHITE SOUTHERNERS ARE
PROUD OF THE PRAGUEOGRESS, WE MU
HAVE A WILLINGNESS ABOUT
EDUCATION.
EDUCATION. DO YOU THINK THEY’RE
REPRESENTATIVE?
REPRESENTATIVE? >> I’M NOT SURE.
I’VE SPOKEN TO A LOT OF PEOPLE.
SOME OF WHOM WERE AT THE RALLY
WHO HEARD THE COMMENTS.
WHAT I HEARD A LOT, THIS IS
FUNNY BECAUSE THIS IS DIFFERENT
FROM WHAT WE HEARD.
I’VE HEARD A LOT OF WHITE
REPUBLICANS IN THIS AREA THAT
HAVE SOME NO, SHE SHOULDN’T HAVE
SAID THESE COMMENTS.
THEY WEREN’T A GREAT IDEA.
SHE SHOULD HAVE APOLOGIZED.
INSTEAD, HER FIRST COMMENT, HE
SAID ANY ATTEMPT TO MAKE IT A
NEGATIVE CONNOTATION BUT HER
REMARKS WERE RIDICULOUS.
I HEARD A LOT OF PEOPLE SAY SHE
SHOULD HAVE APOLOGIZES
IMMEDIATELY.
IMMEDIATELY. IT’S USUALLY WE KNOW SHE DIDN’T
MEAN ANYTHING BY IT.
I WROTE MY COLLEGE PARTLY TO TRY
TO MODEL THE KIND OF
CONVERSATION I HOPED WE WOULD
HAVE WHICH IS WE DON’T NEED TO
POINT FINGERS.
POINT FINGERS. I CAN ONLY SPEAK FOR MYSELF AND
WAS HOPING TO MODEL A
CONVERSATION THAT WOULD BE
WILLING TO RISK A LITTLE
INTROSPECTION, MAYBE RISK A
CONVERSATION THAT MAY LEAD US TO
SEE THINGS WE’RE NOT TRYING TO
SEE.
SEE. >> IT WAS BRAVE OF YOU TO WRITE
THAT.
THAT. WE TALKED A LOT IN THE LAST FEW
DAYS ABOUT SEGREGATED ACADEMIES.
SHE WENT TO ONE.
SHE SEPTEMBER HER DAUGHTER TO
ONE.
ONE. >> I WENT TO ONE.
>> SOME SAID BECAUSE THE PUBLIC
SCHOOL ARE ALSO DETERIORATING IN
MISSISSIPPI, THOSE ARE THE BEST
OPTIONS THEY ARE.
OTHERS SAID MISSISSIPPI CREATING
THESE SO THEY CAN STAY ROOTED IN
THE SEGREGATED TIMES.
>> IT’S AN INCREDIBLY -- YOU
HAVE TINY UP TOS WHERE THE
RESOURCES ARE COMPLETELY DIVIDED
BETWEEN STUDENTS.
BETWEEN STUDENTS. THERE REALLY ISN’T -- IN TOWNS
THAT SHOULD HAVE ONE SCHOOL,
IT’S COMPLETELY DIVIDED.
SHELL DIDN’T HAVE A CHASE ABOUT
WHETHER TO ATTEND THE SEGREGATED
ACADEMY.
ACADEMY. >> WOULD YOU LIKE THERE NOW?
>> NO, I THOUGHT THE SCHOOLS
WERE GOOD COMEWERE DOING THIS.
WHEN PEOPLE SAY, HOW CAN THEY
LIVE LIKE THIS?
IF THEY’RE LIVING IN A FINANCIAL
DEPRESSED STATE, IS THERE AN
ARGUMENT?
ARGUMENT? >> THE REALITY IS, GIVEN THE
STRURL
STRURL STRUCTURAL ORGANIZATION, OF
COURSE WHITE PEOPLE WILL MAKE
DECISIONS BASED ON THEIR BEST
INTEREST.
INTEREST. WE CAN DAMN A STATE THAT
CONTINUES TO HAVE THIS RACIAL
CHISM.
CHISM. THEY’RE RICH FROM THE POOSH BUT
THEY ALSO ALSO HAPPEN --
>> THAT HAPPENS ACROSS AMERICA.
IT’S THE SAME THING, WHITE
PEOPLE LIVE IN AREAS WITH BETTER
SCHOOLING AND HIGHER PUBLIC
SAFETY.
SAFETY. >> IT’S RACISM ACROSS THE BOARD.
RACIAL SEGREGATION IS NOT
ENDEMIC TO THE SOUTH.
THE REALITY IS, WE ARE ON A
TELEVISION PROGRAM IN 2018 WHERE
MY DEAR REPORTER HAS WRITTEN A
PIECE YOU THOUGHT WOULD BE FROM
2005.
2005. TRYING TO ASK MORE WHITE PEEL TO
BE INTROSPECTIVE ABOUT THEIR OWN
CONSIDERATIONS AS A RACE?
IT IS ASTONISHING THAT WE ARE AT
THIS SLOW CREEP OF A RACIAL
PROGRESS THAT WE ARE
CONGRATULATING SOMEBODY FOR
DOING SOMETHING THAT SHOULD HAVE
BEEN DONE 50 YEARS AGO.
T
T TO CONGRATULATE SOMEBODY NOW.
IN THE AGE OF TRUMP, IT IS TO BE
CERTAIN OF A SIGN OF THAT
WILLINGNESS TO BE INTROSPECTIVE.
IT IS THE REASON WHY WE WILL
NEVER MAKE MUCH PROGRESS UNTIL
WE’RE READY TO TAKE A SERIOUS
EFFORT.
EFFORT. >> THE POINT WAS TO MAKE A
PERSONAL INTROSPECTION.
PERSONAL INTROSPECTION. >> YOU’RE MISSING MY POINT.
THE FACT WE’RE SEEING WE’RE
IN -- I TEACH FROM GEORGETOWN.
I CAN’T DONE GREAT LATE FRESHMAN
STUDENTS INTRODUCTIONRY MATH.
YOU’RE SUPPOSED TO BE WAY BEYOND
THAT WHEN YOU GET HERE.
UNLESS WE’RE WILLING TO NOT
CODDLE BUT TO CONFRONT, WE WILL
NEVER MAKE THE KIND OF PROGRESS
NECESSARY.
NECESSARY. >> DAYCALEB, DO YOU THINK THE
INTROSPECTION THAT YOU ARE
EXPERIENCING, DO YOU THINK IT’S
WIDE SPREAD AMONGST WIDEHITES IN
MISSISSIPPI?
MISSISSIPPI? >> I THINK THERE’S A BUILD-IN
EFFECTIVENESS FOR MANY, MANY
WHITES.
WHITES. I THINK WHEN THESE PEOPLE ARE
ALONE WITH THEMSELVES OR THEIR
FAMILY, PROBABLY THERE IS A
WILLINGNESS TO THINK TO SOME
EXPIRATIONS OF MEANTS WE HEARD.
IN THE PUBLIC AREEVE THAT,
THERE’S A DIEEFENSIVENESS.
I WASN’T THERE.
THOSE WERE MY ANCESTORS.
WE HEAR THAT A LOT.
THAT IS A PROBLEM.
I’M NOT LOOKING FOR ANY
CONGRATULATIONS.
CONGRATULATIONS. >> NO, I THINK HE’S MAKING A
BIGGER POINT.
BIGGER POINT. >> IN MY BOOK, TEARS WE CANNOT
STOP, THE ONE YOU MENTIONED, I
SPECK TO THAT.
I’M SAYING THE RETREAT INTO
WHITE INNOCENCE IS THE FAILURE
TO CONTENT WITH THE COMPLEXITY
OF WHITE SUPREMACY.
THAT’S WHY WE’RE ASTONISHED WHEN
WE SEE WHITE WOMEN VOTING WITH
WHITE NATIONALISTS WHEN WE
SOMEHOW EXCEPT THEM BECAUSE
THEY’RE WOMAN.
THEY’RE WOMAN. WE HAVE TO DO IT MORE
AGGRESSIVELY.
AGGRESSIVELY. TO SAY NOT ONLY IN 2018 SHOULD
WE BE INTROSPECTIVE, WE SHOULD
MOVE BEYOND TO RECONSTRUCTION.
IN MISSISSIPPI, WITH THE
HISTORY, THE GHOST OF
MISSISSIPPI, THE BLOOD OF
MISSISSIPPI FROM ITS RIVERS
WHERE TILL DIED, WHERE MET GARR
EVERS DIED.
EVERS DIED. WE HAVE TO COME TO GRIPS WITH
IT.
IT. THE ONLY WAY TO DO THAT IS TO
TAKE A HARDER ERER LOOK AT WHAT
THEY’VE BEEN DOING.
CINDY HYDE-SMITH IS A WHITE
SUPREMACIST.
SUPREMACIST. IT’S A SHAME WHITE
MISSISSIPPIANS WOULD EXONERATE
HER IN ADVANCE.
THEN SHE WOULD BE ELECTED TO DO
MORE DAMAGE TO MISSISSIPPIANS IN
AMERICA IN GENERAL.
>> DO WE UNDERSTAND WHITE
MISSIPPIANS?
MISSIPPIANS? THEY WOULD SAY THEY’RE SIMPLY
TRYING TO THEIR THEIR BEST
LIVES.
LIVES. YOU HAD SAID THE YOUNG PEOPLE OF
THAT STATE, THE YOUNG MEMBERS OF
THE GOP ARE SAYING THIS ISN’T
WHO WE ARE, THIS IS THE FUTURE.
WHAT DO YOU SEE ACROSS IN
MISSISSIPPI?
MISSISSIPPI? >> HEARING THIS FROM MY YOUNG
FRIENDS IN MISSISSIPPI WHO WERE
RAISED REPUBLICAN.
RAISED REPUBLICAN. BUT SEE HOW HARMFUL RACISM IS
FOR THE STATE MORALLY.
YOU LOOK AT MISSISSIPPI AND THE
STAG MATION THERE.
YOU LOOK AT THE TOL IT’S HAD ON
PEOPLE BLACK AND WHITE IN TERMS
OF HOLDING THE STATE OF THE JOB.
AND CAUSING OUR BEST AND
BRIGHTEST ALSO TO FLEE IN MANY
CASES TO OTHER STATES.
WE HAVE OUR STUDENTS GOING
TOANT, GOING TO NASHVILLE
LEAVING THE STATE.
IT IS A BIG ISSUE.
>> IT’S A BRAIN DRAIN.
>> YOU SAID SOMETHING ABOUT THE
STRUCTURAL PRO BUSINESSES
AGAINST THE ECONOMIC FLOURISHING
IN MISSISSIPPI.
IN MISSISSIPPI. SPOKING TO THE IDEA THERE ARE
STRUCTURE WHERE THEY NOT
ENYOUING IT AS MUCH AS THE
COUNTRY.
COUNTRY. >> IF HIS WIFE CAME TO HIM AND
SAID, DR. KING WHAT YOU’RE
PUSHING FOR IS WRONG.
HE SAID NO IT’S NOT.
THEN HE ASKED THEM, HOW MUCH
MONEY DO YOU MAKE?
HE SAID, HELL, YOU NEED TO BE
OUT HERE MARCHING WITH US.
WHITE WORKING CLASS PEOPLE HAVE
MORE IN COMMON WITH BLACK AND
BROWN AND INDICES INEND DISCNESS
HE SAID WHITE PEOPLE ARE PAID
SOMETHING DIFFERENT.
SOMETHING DIFFERENT. THEY ARE PAID A PSYCHOLOGICAL
WAGE.
WAGE. AT LEAST YOU’RE NOT A BLACK
PERSON, AT LEAST YOU’RE NOT AN
"N-WORD."
"N-WORD." THE RACISM PASSED ON TO THEM
LIKE HERITAGE, THEY’LL BE ABLE
TO FORGE CONNECTIONS WITH PEOPLE
TOGETHER TO REALLY HAVE A
DESPERATE SYSTEM IN MISSISSIPPI.
IF WE CAN ADDRESS THE ISSUES,
THE LACK OF FLOUSHISHING THEY
EXPERIENCE, EVEN IN THE
PHYSICAL, OVERCOMING THE RACHEL
DIVIDE, THE STATE ITSELF WILL
FLOURISH.
FLOURISH. >> ALL THOSE PEOPLE IN THE STATE
DO WANT THE THEM THINGS, THEY
WATT TO FLOURISH.
DAY LOB, LAST POINT, YOU WERE
THERE.
THERE. >> THAT’S RIGHT, I’M IN TUPELO
RIGHT NOW.
RIGHT NOW. I THINK HYDE-SMITH WILL PROBABLY
STILL WIN.
STILL WIN. HEARING MORE ABOUT THE
MOORE/JONES CONTEST.
MOORE/JONES CONTEST. AND THEN LOOKING AT THAT AS AN
OPPORTUNITY.
OPPORTUNITY. THAT A DEMOCRAT CAN TRIUMPH
AGAINST A WEEKEND REPUBLICAN
CANDIDATE.
CANDIDATE. IT TOOK AN AWFUL LOT FOR
REPUBLICANS TO PEEL OFF.
THE OTHER SITTING SENATOR WASN’T
VOTING FOR ROY MOORE.
THE REPUBLICAN STRATEGY IS.
THE DISPARITY WILL CARRY
HYDE-SMITH OVER THE FINISH LINE.
>> IT’S NOT THAT EVERYBODY WANTS
THE SAME THING.
WANTING IT FOR MY KIDS BUT NOT
YOURS.
YOURS. MAINTAINING A DIVISIVE AREA OF
SOCIETY IS NOT GOOD FOR US.
UNTIL WE OVERCOME WHAT IS SPEWED
FROM THE MOUTH OF THIS PET TORE,
WE WILL NOT BE ABLE TO INSIDE
THE GOLF.
THE GOLF. ABOUT ALL OF US TOGETHER.
>> THANK YOU, WHAT A GREAT
CONVERSATION.
CONVERSATION. >> SHE HAD A LAST POINT.
>> WE HAVE CLOSE OFF WITH YOU.
>> THIS HAS BEEN AN UNFORTUNATE
EPISODE BUT BEING A MISSSIPPIAN.
WE HAVE A LOT OF WORK TO DO.
WE CAN AND MUST DO BETTER ON
ISSUES OF RACE.
>> WE APPRECIATE YOU BEING IN
THIS.
THIS. THE AUTHOR OF "TEARS, WE CANNOT