We start with a water story that I
know has baffled many Arizonans.
You may have heard about the
alfalfa farm in Western Arizona
run by a Saudi Arabian company.
The company was attracted
to the land by something.
Saudi Arabia doesn't have
water to grow alfalfa.
Now the Arizona Republic is revealing
that the Saudis got a sweetheart deal
to rent that land and get the water.
And do you know who the landlord is?
I'll let our guests answer that question.
Arizona Republic reporter Rob
O'dell was part of a team that's
worked on this story for a year.
Welcome back to square off.
Thanks for having me good to see you again.
There's been reporting about this
farm over the last few years.
Many stories written.
You've been part of that coverage.
But your new reporting has raised
some pretty urgent questions.
Let's start with what I tease there.
Who is the landlord
is actually us.
It's the state of Arizona.
They rent A state trust land
from the state land department.
So us the taxpayers are this
landlord for this company.
That's getting a sweetheart deal.
Describe the deal. Why?
Why is it a sweet deal?
And how does the water figure into
it? Well, it's it's actually
they have two farms.
There's one that you can
see as you go down I.
And as you hit Vicksburg and there's a,
there's another farm that's
farther north in Butler Valley in
a remote part of Butler Valley,
and they they rent the
land for $25.00 an acre,
which we showed that is about
1/6 of the market price,
1/6 a market value for the
land from the state land
department. Yes, and the state lands
on the state Land Department's
own appraisal puts the the
rental price at more like 125 or.
175 an acre. So they they are
definitely getting a sweet deal.
It's compounded by the fact that
they're taking water out of a basin that
potentially be could be used by Phoenix.
So if our water crisis grows more intense,
we could potentially use the
water from this valley.
And that makes the water very expensive.
That makes the water worth a lot.
And so according to some state estimates,
they it could be 3 to $4 million a year
worth of water that they're pumping to.
To grow off alpha
and they can use as much
water as they want,
as much groundwater as they want.
Do we know how much they're using?
We don't know
how much they're using,
and that's actually back when when
these leases were getting put together,
the employees of the state Land
Department wanted to know that because
they were worried that potentially if
it's used over 20 or 30 years it could.
It could deplete this backup
water source for Phoenix.
So let's put a map up of show folks exactly
where this this property is called.
Under Monte did I pronounce that right?
Yeah, fundamente Fonda Monte.
It's near the La Paz County hamlet of bouts,
about 140 miles northwest of Phoenix.
So put this in the larger context of
the challenges we face with groundwater
in Arizona as we try to meet this water
crisis and what this tells us about that.
Well, you know we we have a groundwater
crisis in in Arizona, especially in
rural Arizona because there's no,
there's no rules for how much you can pump.
So if you own the land.
You can think of well you
can pump as much as you want,
so that's drawing down aquifers
so people there there's rural
residents want regulation.
It's kind of unusual for rural residents
to be crying out for regulation,
but they are, and members of both political
parties want to see groundwater reform.
The difference with?
With this with this particular story
is we don't need the legislature to,
you know, fix this problem or
make changes to this problem.
This is the state land department,
so they could charge more.
Just by deciding to charge more,
they could, you know,
make the Saudi company report
how much water they're taking.
If they wanted to do that,
but they haven't done that.
So
who's the person or who are
the people who could do that,
or require them to pay more?
Or maybe it sounds like we might
need to take back this water for
Phoenix's needs, and other needs?
Will that be the state land
Commissioner? At least Adkins.
And Doug Ducey, the governor.
And you tried to reach them.
What was the response? You
know they made us put our
questions in writing.
We tried to reach Lisa
Atkins for more than a year.
They they answered some basic
questions for us. You know,
for you know when the leases were,
how much you know how much,
how many wells they put in.
They put in eight wells
on their two properties,
but they didn't answer the questions.
Why aren't you charging more?
Why aren't you asking them?
Why aren't you requiring them to
to tell us how much water they're
using and you know why are you
letting a Saudi company pump out
of our future water supply and they
they didn't answer those questions?
They just didn't
answer. What about the governor?
What could he do on his own governor Ducey?
Well, then we asked them that too,
and they didn't answer that question either.
So but but a lot of people
think that you don't need a,
you know a majority in the legislature
to fix some of these things.
It's not like. There's there's a lot
of opposition to metering wells,
making people tell how much water they're
using because of private property rights,
and people doesn't want the government
to know that this is different.
This is if you rent our land.
You have to tell us otherwise.
Don't rent the land they you know you.
There are ways to do that,
but they they haven't done it yet.
Do you expect anything to
come out of the legislature?
And now the final, likely final weeks
of its session?
Well, there's a lot of discussion about
Ducey's $1 billion plan for water,
so when we talked to a couple
of legislators they said we're
bringing this issue up as part of
that as part of that, you know,
potential authority that he wants to build.
You know, while we're also talking desal,
we're also going to be talking
groundwater regulation in in the
rural parts of the state. It's
a really, really big deal.
I do want to let folks know
that alfalfa goes back to Saudi
Arabia where it becomes hey for
their cows to feed their cows,
feed their cows all right.
Rob Odell, the Arizona Republic.
Terrific reporting.
Thanks so much for joining.