>> Donald Trump is already distancing himself from Rudy Giuliani following the revelation
earlier today that two of Giuliani's associates were apparently arrested while attempting
to flee the country.
We're gonna have the details on what they're being charged with.
But first here, from just a little bit ago, is Donald Trump being asked about it.
>> I don't know those gentlemen.
Now it's possible I have a picture with them because I have a picture with everybody.
I have a picture with everybody here.
But somebody said there may be a picture of something we're at a fundraiser or somewhere.
So but I have pictures with everybody.
I have.
I don't know if there's anybody I don't have pictures.
I don't know them.
I don't know about them.
I don't know what they do.
But I don't know.
Maybe they were clients of Rudy, you'd have to as Rudy, I just don't know.
>> Just to be clear, the question was it was either do you know them or what do you know
about them?
And he began saying picture, picture.
I don't know, is there pictures?
Maybe there's pictures.
I take a lot of pictures.
Everybody taking selfies.
I'm like Elizabeth Warren I got selfie lines up and down the block.
>> Yeah.
>> Because he knows the photos are out.
We're gonna have the photos.
We already have the photos.
He knows that.
He's seen the photos, everybody talking to him has seen the photos.
So that performance needs to go on.
>> Yeah, well two things about that performance once it sounds like a guy who is closeted
walking into a room going, I am not gay.
Okay, no one asked.
Right?
No one asked about the pictures yet.
You are like there could be pictures, but it doesn't mean I know them.
Well, they've given a lot of money to you, so that's how you might know them, because
that's the kinda folks you usually care about.
And then, of course, the usual Trumpian, I've got pictures with almost everybody.
Here, here's a person you don't have a picture with, okay?
Thank God, and so it's an absurd claim, obviously.
In fact, that reaction.
I didn't think that Trump was that implicated.
He took a ton of money from them, but he might not have known that they were funneling the
money from foreign countries, etc.
But his panicked reaction makes me think, he knew, and apparently is more involved.
>> Maybe, maybe.
>> Yeah, maybe.
>> It's hard to say.
More importantly, at the end of that he's starting us with, no, no, you should talk
to Rudy.
Talk to Rudy.
I don't even know Rudy.
Wait, who is Rudy?
>> So we're getting there, we're getting there.
>> I love Rudy, good movie, good movie, good movie.
Kid couldn't play, got on the team, scored a couple of touchdowns.
>> Yeah.
>> But you're talking about a different Rudy, a Giuliani?
I never heard of him.
>> Yeah, Rudy's like, Trump is such a good friend of mine.
We're just hanging out on the side of the road, and there's a bus coming.
And now he's picking me up by the seat of my pants!
>> That's funny, because there was a circumstance where I would have found myself in the position
of saying well, the picture is useful politically.
But the picture with the President really doesn't mean anything.
>> Hm.
>> They could have been they're obviously associates of Giuliani.
He brought him in, get the picture.
Trump's like, yeah, great to meet you guys.
Thanks.
>> Yeah.
>> For all your great work and he doesn't know them.
But after that little performance, I'm like thinking, no, he knows them.
>> Yeah, like really well.
>> He's got like extremely well.
Yeah.
>> I would assume at this point that people would know some of the basics, but let's just
run through it really fast, just in case.
The FBI arrested the two men Lev Parnas and Igor Fruman who are also important witnesses
in the House's impeachment inquiry as they were trying to board a Frankfurt-bound flight
with one way tickets on Wednesday night.
As you do they just they were going for food >> After lunch earlier in the day.
Yeah with Rudolph Giuliani.
>> Yes at a Trump hotel.
I mean, it's like out of a movie and, as you tweeted earlier Ben, their names sound like
characters out of- >> Film noir yeah totally.
>> Yeah, yeah.
>> And, take a look at how- >> Lev Parnas and Igor Fruman, somebody responded
to me on Twitter with.
That Igor Froman must be the brother of the sausage king of Chicago which is a great Ferris
Buehler's Day, Abe Froman.
>> The sausage king of Chicago.
>> That's pretty good.
So, at an initial court appearance earlier today, prosecutors said they were concerned
that they were flight risks.
But that they would negotiate with their lawyers about a possible bail package.
Gee do you think they were like getting on they'd checked their bag already on a one
way flight, that's not actually what happened but they had one way tickets out of the country,
yeah, they might be a flight risk.
>> Okay two things one under no circumstances should they get bailed they get bail that's
the last time we ever see them.
Okay.
Secondly, if you wanna get away with something, do not buy a one-way ticket.
That's the biggest tell tale sign that you're leaving and not coming back and up to no good.
>> Exactly!
>> So we all know now, the 9/11 terrorists.
They all bought one way, first class tickets, and now every law enforcement authority knows
look for the guys buying one-way tickets.
>> I mean, maybe they were just going to Europe to find themselves, hashtag live free.
Just go, don't book a return flight yet, you don't know where you might end up.
So what did they actually do?
Well, according to the indictment unsealed in New York, Parnas, Fruman, and other defendants
quote conspired to circumvent the federal laws against foreign influence by engaging
in a scheme to funnel foreign money to candidates for federal and state office so that the defendants
could buy potential influence with the candidates' campaigns, and the candidates' governments.
They previously drew the attention of the FEC for donating over $300,000 to a pro-Trump
super PAC, America First PAC.
>> He doesn't know them.
He'd, I never, I don't know them.
There might be a picture, there might be $325,000, but I don't know them.
>> It remains to be seen.
What does not remain to be seen is that America First PAC is taking money from people who
definitely are not putting America's interests first here.
>> But anyway, we always knew that it was a sham.
So last year, they donated money to, and pledged to raise additional funds for a member of
Congress who was not named in the indictment, but is identified in campaign finance filings
as representative Pete Sessions, Republican of Texas.
So another name gets drawn into this story.
>> Do you have any more from that article or anything or-
>> About Pete Sessions?
>> No just about what they did because Cenk you were asking beforehand.
Like the New York Times makes it a little clear Parnas and Froman illegally funneled
money through a company they set up the mask themselves as its sources, then gave the money
to pro Trump super PAC America First, according to the indictment.
Prosecutors said that Parnas and Frumon along with the other two men indicted Korea and
Kukushkin also funneled money with ties to Russia to state and federal candidates in
exchange for potential influence according to the indictment.
>> So there's two potential crimes here.
And obviously they've been arrested so that now alleged crimes but one is you can't have
foreign countries, companies or individuals donate to American political campaigns.
Okay, so the second potential, but the alleged crime here is that you can't donate under
somebody else's name.
And so that's also an allegation.
So Fruman was that person actually supplying the funding, but Parnas, I believe, is the
one that said he was giving the money.
So that's funneling money through someone else to avoid limits, and that is also illegal.
So these two guys are in a lot of trouble.
>> I guess these two guys are the associates of Rudy, the two other guys indicted, one
of whom is expected to turn himself in Korea.
And then Kukushkin, he's already appeared in federal court in San Francisco.
>> Yeah.
Now what.
So those are the things we know, and those are the things they're in big trouble over.
What we don't know is how much Giuliani and Trump are implicated?
So Giuliani is their lawyer, so if he didn't know any of this and he's their lawyer, then
there's no trouble at all, okay?
On the other hand, if he did know it, and this is part of a scheme to get Ukraine to
investigate the Bidens and Giuliani is aiding and abetting that, then he's in a lot of trouble.
>> It would be remarkable if Giuliani who was aggressively proudly visiting Ukraine
and calling to attempt to get them to investigate Biden was working with these two guys.
Ukrainians with influence and American citizens also I mean these guys are also American citizens.
But that part didn't come up.
>> Like we're stretching the bounds of credulity.
>> Right, what else was he working with them on?
Like if he was their lawyer on a traffic ticket, right?
Or they were brought up on armed robbery and something else and he was their lawyer and
look at this coincidence, turns out they're Ukraniane American and I've been funneling
money from outside the country into Trump's campaign.
And so what were they asking for, among the different things they were asking for was
to get the US ambassador to Ukraine fired, why?
>> Which worked.
>> Yeah, and of course Trump did fire her.
But they didn't have to ask very hard she was not in favor of continuing the bogus request
for the corruption of the Bidens in Ukraine.
So she was not in favor of this.
She's like look, I hear you, but the Ukrainian government already investigated that and it
turns out there's nothing to it, so I don't know what you want me to do.
And so these guys, connected to Giuliani, come in and go, fire her.
Trump goes, okay and he fires her.
So they got what they wanted and look, there's another angle to this because you see all
the Ukrainian figures but you also hear about potentially money coming in from Russia.
This is really important and not mentioned in almost any of the news items, okay?
So why did the Russians care about any of this?
Well, obviously they've got the situation where they annexed Crimea, which used to be
part of Ukraine, etc.
But there's an even more important reason.
The Russians' number one goal, is to get our sanctions lifted off their oligarchs.
So we put sanctions on them, and it has affected their money.
Some of their money is frozen and they can't get it.
So, Putin deeply tied to the oligarchs, himself an oligarch you think that he might care about
that a little bit more than he cares about foreign policy?
Yeah, it's the money, Lebowski.
That's what they care the most about.
So, one of the things that they were pushing Trump to do is hey, get it some sort of deal
between the Ukrainian government and the Russian government.
So we could then say, hey, everything's solved so you can lift the sanctions and we can get
our money back.
So that's also playing behind the scenes here.
And so I hope the prosecutors keep digging I hope they find out who was on the Russian
side and what their motives were I mean, they are connected to Giuliani, but are they connected
to him in a way that is illegal?
And did Trump know who they are?
Does he know where that 325,000 came from?
Then we're gonna get to the problems in this story that are legal.
>> So real quick.
So they faced five years for three of the counts, for each facing four counts.
These two guys are, I don't know about the other two, but these two Giuliani associates,
three counts maximum five years for the first three counts, 20 years for the second count,
for the fourth count.
So, that's 35 years potentially I doubt they'd get that, but the hope is then and I'm not
a conspiracy theorist, as you know, but you know that the in general that, they would
be held without bail because as you point out, they're obviously flight risks and that
then they would start talking because they don't want to go to prison for any amount
of time.
But there is in these situations with talking the real possibility that his family would
be killed by- >> Yeah, you know what?
I hadn't considered that.
>> By Putin and his, and I mean, I say that like it sounds funny, but he's done it, right?
>> Yeah, look, if they are, in fact-
>> Is that crazy to say?
>> No, no, I don't think that's- >> No, I mean, people do turn up dead.
>> I hadn't thought of that at all, Ben.
But I now that you put that together I mean, yes, there's the Russian angle here.
Putin has killed people in Western countries before notably in the UK several times.
So whatever you do, do not put them in the same facility with the same guards that Jeffrey
Epstein was in.
And I'm not joking.
I mean, they better have double and triple guards on these guys, cuz I don't wanna hear
another story, golly gee, you'll never believe this!
>> I mean, look and the guards happened to be off-duty, they had but we're on a 15 hour
shift.
>> Which they're overworked >> Right?
And they happened to put sheets in there and they happened to take their roommates away,
and so.
>> And the thing is we said that after Epstein got into the brawl a couple of weeks before
the death.
So we can say it now, it's not necessarily gonna change anything, unfortunately.
One other sort of lighter part of this story, this is the first time I've seen this, but
Donald Trump has unleashed something that you can expect you'll see many times until
Donald Trump is out of office at least.
I told you that there were photos, everybody knows there's photos.
And so it wasn't long before people including Parker Molloy produced something like this.
Seriously no the Nickelback this.
>> It's gonna be used for every photo from now on so there you have Don Jr, it's the
two people who were arrested and also RNC co chair Tommy Hicks JR, but those two individuals
are also in photos there's one photo with Trump, Rence and Giuliani and those two again
being in a photo doesn't necessarily mean anything.
But that didn't stop Donald Trump from tweeting out what he tweeted out.
>> Here's the only thing that it means.
And then it gets to, I think maybe even the most problematic part that is actually legal.
So the reason that they're in all these pictures is because they're giving hundreds of thousands
of dollars to Trump's campaign, Trump's super PACs to Republican Congressman, not just Pete
Sessions but also to the Republican leader in the house, Kevin McCarthy.
So the problem is that if they weren't connected to foreign governments and they weren't using
fake names, it is actually perfectly legal to give $325,000 to Trump's SuperPAC.
Now do you think that might influence a politician?
All of Washington says no.
Supreme Court says no no, of course that wouldn't influence a politician.
$325,000, no they were going to vote the way they were going to and that doesn't matter.
By the way, it could be $3.25 million, it could be $30 million, and it has been $30
million.
NRA gave $30 million to Trump's super PACs, Sheldon Anderson has given $30 million to
individual politicians.
So does anyone in the country, conservative or progressive, or anywhere in the middle
Think that somebody giving $300,000 is not going to affect the politician, little $30
million.
That the intent is not to, obviously bribed the politician,
>> Right.
I mean, there there there are probably examples where they gave $300,000 and didn't get what
they wanted, right?
Or the politician said, no, I'm not gonna do it.
But you're right.
The intent is obvious and I would say that most times probably works pretty effectively.
>> Yeah we have this order.
>> Overwhelming majority of the time it works excellently.
>> We have a version in this story, so Pete Sessions the congressman that was mentioned.
>> He's a former Congressman- >> Former Congressman-
>> He lost in 2018 but he's running again.
>> Yeah.
>> Now in a different district.
>> Yeah, maybe this will help him.
So Pete Sessions was approached by his individuals and they wanted him to put pressure to get
that, the diplomat taken out, you know Yonovovitch and they raised $20,000 for him And he wrote
a letter to Pompeo complaining about her and saying she's biased against Trump.
And that was the hand over $20,000.
And he does what they want.
I mean, there's no more direct.
It's just a bribe.
>> By the way, again, if they hadn't used fake games and it wasn't foreign money, that
would be legal.
They you can give them $2,700 for his election, and then you can give the rest to a super
PAC that's helping him win the election.
And in our insane, incredibly corrupt system in America, they say no, that doesn't influence
the politician at all.
>> Even though he did it.
>> Even though he wrote the letter after he got $20,000 they're like, no, don't believe
your lying eyes.
That is not a bribe.
>> Let me read a story here from the Texas Tribune from a week ago, six days ago from
October 3.
When Peter Sessions announced his campaign to replace Bill Flores who's retiring, so
he's not running in his old district.
As I said he's running in a different district and that's causing some unease among local
republicans.
Sessions, quote my goal is to work together, to restore the Republican majority in the
House and maintain our control of the Senate and White House.
Sessions said in the news release Thursday afternoon.
My support for President Trump is unwavering and I will dedicate my time in office to help
enact his conservative.
>> Yeah that's because you're both legally bribed by the same guys.
And it's okay, I piece that one together.
>> Yeah, we're, we're co-conspirators, so I'm with it.
>> Yeah.
>> Look, wolf-pac.com/join.
Because if you don't get the money out, again, not using fake names, totally legal to bribe
any politician in the country and completely and utterly own them to get them to write
any letter, fire any ambassador, take any action that you want.
In fact, if you're a company or an individual, it's a little crazy not to bribe the politicians,
because your competitor might bribe them.
And and it gives you an unbelievable advantage to bribe these politicians.
>> Our best case scenario is that a company especially as you say, companies that make
hundreds of millions of dollars like it's not worth half a million dollars for you to
try this?
And like our best case scenario is that company x that wants to drill gives $500,000 and company
y which doesn't want to drill but wants to get a nuclear power plant also gives $500,000,
and then we're, ideally, reset to 0, that's- >> But, of course, what they're gonna do is
somebody is gonna give 600, the other one is gonna give 700,000.
What does that sound like?
It sounds like an auction, right?
Cuz that what it is.
>> No- >> It's not a democracy.
>> And I don't think even that way, that's not, cuz yours was not involved in any of
that people.
>> People, yeah.
>> That's right, that's right, that's why you gotta get the money out.
Wolf-Pac's trying to get the money out.
And there is some progressive candidates running for president or trying to get the money out.
Until you get the money out, this corruption is going to continue unabated forever.
And reporters that don't concentrate on that don't understand politics at all, politicians
who don't understand that that's the cancer in the system, don't understand politics at
all and will get nothing accomplished.
>> You know, I just don't understand why in my scenario, that sort of grassroots, activists
concerned about global warming, they need to give half a million dollars to even the
playing field, and if they just do that then we're fine.
>> This is the absurdity of the American system.
So that's why you've got foreign actors coming in.
And a lot of times this is dark money.
You're not even allowed to find out where the money came from.
So how would we know if it's a foreign government or not a foreign government, a foreign actor
or not a foreign actor?
A lot of times you can't even ask.
This is absurd, the American government is for sale.
We shouldn't be surprised that some of the bidders are foreign governments.
>> Yeah.
>> They're like if you're for sale, I'll buy you.