>>> THE FEDERAL INVESTIGATIONS HAVE ENSNARED MANY OF DONALD
TRUMP’S MOST SENIOR AIDES, AND
AS PROSECUTORS PROBE DEEPER INTO
THE REMAINING SENIOR AIDES, AS
WELL AS THE PEOPLE AT THE TRUMP
ORG, SOME OF THE NAMES THAT ARE
LEFT IN BOTH WORLDS ARE
OBVIOUSLY DONALD TRUMP’S OWN
FAMILY.
FAMILY. NOW MANY PROSECUTORS ARE
ACTUALLY ESPECIALLY CAUTIOUS
WHEN IT COMES TO SPLITTING
FAMILIES AGAINST EACH OTHER IN A
PROBE, BUT NOT THIS ONE.
THE "HARDBALL" FEDERAL PERUSE
ANDREW WEISSMANN, MANY CALL HIM
MUELLER’S LEGAL PIT BULL, AND
SOME OF TRUMP’S MOST
ENTHUSIASTIC LEGAL DEFENDERS
HAVE TOUGHER WORDS FOR WEISSMANN
THAN EVEN FOR HIS BOSS, BOB
MUELLER.
MUELLER. >> I’VE CALLED MR. WEISSMANN THE
POSTER BOY FOR PROSECUTORIAL
MISCONDUCT.
MISCONDUCT. >> HE HAS CHOSEN HIS JACK THE
RIPPER LIKE LEADER ANDREW
WEISSMANN.
WEISSMANN. >> GUESS WHAT?
WEISSMANN IS A LEGAL NIGHTMARE.
WEISSMANN, GUESS WHAT?
HE IS A LEGAL TYRANT.
>> ANDREW WEISSMANN IS A VERY,
VERY POWERFUL WEAPON IN THE
GOVERNMENT’S ARSENAL.
GOVERNMENT’S ARSENAL. I DON’T LIKE ANDREW WEISSMANN
HEADING THIS PROSECUTION.
>>THAT WAS TRUMP’S FORMER
LAWYER.
LAWYER. HE DOESN’T LIKE IT.
WELL, THAT BRINGS US TO
TONIGHT’S SPECIAL REPORT, THE
REASON WHY TEAM TRUMP FEARS
WEISSMANN, AND WHAT IT ACTUALLY
SAYS ABOUT THE FUTURE OF TRUMP’S
FAMILY AND HOW THE PROBE MAY
REPORTEDLY LOOK AT PEOPLE AS IT
DRAWS TO A POTENTIAL CLOSE.
SO LET’S GET INTO IT.
WEISSMANN KNOWN FOR TOUGH AND
SOMETIMES CONTROVERSIAL TACTICS.
LATELY TRUMP ALLIES HAVE SEIZED
ON, FOR EXAMPLE, THIS NEW FOOJ
OF ROGER STONE’S HOME RAGE TO
TRY TO IMPUGN THIS
INVESTIGATION.
INVESTIGATION. IT WAS A WEISSMANN THAT FIRST
DEPLOYED A PREDAWN RAID ON
MANAFORT’S HOME IN JULY 2017.
>> WITH ABSOLUTELY NO WARNING,
FBI AGENTS SHOWED UP BEFORE DAWN
TO SEARCH THE SUBURBAN
WASHINGTON, D.C. APARTMENT OF
PAUL MANAFORT.
PAUL MANAFORT. >> RAIDING A HOME IN THE MIDDLE
OF THE NIGHT IS AN INDICATION OF
A VERY SERIOUS CRIMINAL CASE AND
CRIMINAL INVESTIGATION.
CRIMINAL INVESTIGATION. >> THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT
GUIDELINES REQUIRE AGENTS TO
PURSUE EVIDENCE BY THE LEAST
OBTRUSIVE MEANS POSSIBLE.
SENDING ARMED AGENTS TO HIS DOOR
IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT IS
NOT THE LEAST OBTRUSIVE MEANS
POSSIBLE.
POSSIBLE. >> WEISSMANN HONED HIS HARDBALL
STRATEGY IN ONE OF THE MOST
FAR-REACHING, AGGRESSIVE AND
CONTROVERSIAL PROSECUTIONS IN
MODERN AMERICAN LAW, THE ENRON
INVESTIGATION.
INVESTIGATION. THAT PROBE WAS HIGH STAKES
BECAUSE PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH
HAD DEEP TIES TO THAT TEXAS
ENERGY COMPANY.
ENERGY COMPANY. SO HIS DOJ TRIED TO SHOW THERE
WOULD BE NO FAVORITISM.
SO THEY APPOINTED A SPECIAL TASK
FORCE RUN BY THE FBI DIRECTOR AT
THE TIME BOB MUELLER.
THAT WAS BUSH’S PROOF THIS WAS
GOING TO BE A TOUGH PROBE.
AND THEN MUELLER NEEDED A POINT
MAN TO SHOW IT WAS GOING TO BE A
TOUGH PROBE, AND HE CHOSE
WEISSMANN TO LEAD A, QUOTE,
ELITE TEAM OF FBI AGENTS AND
FEDERAL PROSECUTORS TO
INVESTIGATE AND PROSECUTE ANY
CRIMES RELATED TO ENRON.
NOW WHAT WAS TRUE THEN IS VERY
RELEVANT NOW IN THE MUELLER
PROBE.
PROBE. PICKING WEISSMANN MEANT YOU
WOULD GET VERY TOUGH PROSECUTION
AND MAYBE CONTROVERSIALLY SO,
BECAUSE HE IS WIDELY KNOWN FOR
BEING EFFECTIVE AND
CONTROVERSIAL.
CONTROVERSIAL. AND THAT IS BASED ON THREE MAJOR
TACTICS.
TACTICS. KEEP AN EYE OUT FOR THESE AS WE
SEE WHERE THIS WHOLE THING GOES.
ONE, HE SUPERSIZES EVEN
SEEMINGLY SMALL OFFENSES TO PLAY
HARDBALL.
HARDBALL. TWO, HE HAS MANAGED TO FLIP EVEN
HARDENED CRIMINALS INTO
COOPERATING WITNESSES AND HE
TARGETS ENTIRE CORPORATIONS OR
DEFENDANTS’ OWN FAMILY MEMBERS.
I REPEAT, DEFENDANTS’ OWN FAMILY
MEMBERS.
MEMBERS. NOW THOSE FIRST TWO TACTICS ARE
PRETTY WIDELY USED.
THE THIRD, AS YOU MAY KNOW,
ISN’T.
ISN’T. AND DURING THE TIME THAT THIS
ENRON PROSECUTION WAS GOING ON,
THERE WAS A TOP DOJ OFFICIAL
JAMES COMEY, SOMEONE OF COURSE
WHO IS RELEVANT NOW IN THE
RUSSIA PROBE AS A DOJ OFFICIAL
WHO STOOD UP TO TRUMP WHICH WE
KNOW THE PRESIDENT DIDN’T LIKE.
>> JAMES COMEY WAS UNFAIR TO THE
PEOPLE OF THIS COUNTRY.
I THINK WHAT HE DID WAS A
DISGRACE.
DISGRACE. I THINK HE GOES DOWN AS THE
WORST FBI DIRECTOR IN HISTORY BY
FAR.
FAR. THERE IS NOBODY CLOSE.
>> DIRECTOR COMEY WAS VERY
UNPOPULAR WITH MOST PEOPLE.
HE HAD THE VERY POOR PERFORMANCE
ON WEDNESDAY.
ON WEDNESDAY. THAT WAS A POOR, POOR
PERFORMANCE.
PERFORMANCE. >> HE WAS GRANDSTANDING ALL OVER
THE PLACE.
THE PLACE. HE IS A SHOWBOATER.
>> THAT SAME COMEY THAT THE
PRESIDENT DIDN’T LIKE, HISTORY
HAS STRESSED HIM INTO THE PROBE
WHERE WEISSMANN WORKS.
AND COMEY WAS QUITE PUBLIC AT
THE TIME IN HIS PRAISE FOR
WEISSMANN.
WEISSMANN. >> I’D LIKE TO THANK ANDREW
WEISSMANN, DEPUTY DIRECTOR OF
THE ENRON TASK FORCE WHO IS
STANDING AROUND THE ROOM SOME
PLACE.
PLACE. I WANT TO THANK AND CONGRATULATE
ANDREW WEISSMANN, LET ME THANK
THE ENRON TASK FORCE, IN
PARTICULAR ANDREW WEISSMANN, T
HEAD OF THE ENRON TASK FORCE.
HE AND HIS BRILLIANT TEAM WERE
IN HOUSTON TODAY WHERE THEIR
HARSCH HARD WORK CONTINUES.
>> YOU CAN YOU SEE WEISSMANN OFF
TO THE SIDE WHILE COMEY TALKS.
HE OFTEN AVOIDED THOSE
MICROPHONES.
MICROPHONES. THAT HARD WORK AS COMEY PUT IT
LED TO SOME HARD CALLS LIKE
WHETHER PROSECUTORS SHOULD
SINGLE OUT JUST BAD EMPLOYEES OR
INDICT ENTIRE COMPANIES.
NOW THAT’S CONTROVERSIAL BECAUSE
IF IT SENDS THE COMPANY TO JAIL,
WELL, YOU CAN THINK ABOUT IT.
IT’S LIKE THE COMPANY GOES OUT
OF BUSINESS AND INNOCENT PEOPLE
LOSE THEIR JOBS.
BUT WEISSMANN’S TEAM DECIDED
THAT THE EVIDENCE OF A CRIMINAL
EVIDENCE IN THE CASE OF ENRON
WAS SO STRONG, FORGET ABOUT IT.
THEY WOULD INDICT THE ENTIRE
ACCOUNTING FIRM, THAT SERVED
ENRON, AND THEY WON.
>> THE AUTHOR OF THE ENRON
ACCOUNTING FIRM WAS FOUND GUILTY
OF OBSTRUCTING JUSTICE IN THE
ENRON INVESTIGATION.
ENRON INVESTIGATION. >> THIS CASE WAS REALLY ABOUT A
SIMPLE PRINCIPLE, WHICH IS WHEN
YOU EXPECT THE POLICE DON’T
DESTROY EVIDENCE.
DESTROY EVIDENCE. >> NOW THAT ACTUAL INDICTMENT
WAS CONTROVERSIAL FOR THE VERY
REASONS CRITICS WARNED ABOUT.
THOUSANDS OF EMPLOYEES DID LOSE
THEIR JOBS WHEN THE COMPANY
SHUTTERED, AND AFTER THAT
CONVICTION, ULTIMATELY THE
SUPREME COURT UNANIMOUSLY
OVERTURNED IT.
OVERTURNED IT. A LEGAL RULING THAT PART OF THE
STRATEGY JUST WENT TOO FAR,
INDICTING ENTIRE CORPORATIONS IS
ONE THING.
ONE THING. INDICTING DEFENDANTS’ FAMILIES
IS ANOTHER.
IS ANOTHER. NOW IN GENERAL, FEDERAL
GUIDELINES DO DISCOURAGE
PROSECUTORS TO USE TRICKS TO PIT
FAMILY AGAINST EACH OTHER.
THERE IS ALSO A SPOUSAL
PRIVILEGE WHICH GENERALLY
PROTECTS A SPOUSE FROM BEING
FORCED TO TESTIFY AGAINST THEIR
PARTNER.
PARTNER. NOW WEISSMANN DIDN’T BREAK THOSE
EXPLICIT RULES, BUT HE TOOK AN
AGGRESSIVE STANCE BY INDICTING
THE WIFE OF CHIEF FINANCIAL
OFFICER ANDREW FASTOW ON A
MISDEMEANOR WHEN FASTOW WAS
RESISTING PRESSURE TO PLEA.
>> TODAY THE ENRON TASK FORCE’S
CONTINUING INVESTIGATION HAS LED
TO THE UNSEALING OF THREE NEW
CRIMINAL INDICTMENTS AND A
SIX-COUNT INDICTMENT AGAINST LEE
FASTOW.
FASTOW. AS THE INDICTMENT CHARGES, SHE
AND HER HUSBAND AND OTHERS WERE
PART OF A CONSPIRACY TO MAINTAIN
CONTROL OF AN ASSET THAT ENRON
HAD BUT COULDN’T KEEP IN NAME.
>> NOW THAT WAS HARDBALL.
MS. FASTOW WASN’T EXACTLY
RUNNING ENRON.
RUNNING ENRON. SHE WASN’T CONSIDERED A MAJOR
PLAYER.
PLAYER. LAWYERS REPORT THAT WEISSMANN
WAS TRYING TO GAIN LEVERAGE FROM
INDICTING THE WIFE IN THAT CASE.
EVENTUALLY FASTOW DID PLEAD
GUILTY, TURNING OVER DOCUMENTS
THAT DID PROVE ENRON WAS
PARTICIPATING IN AN ACCOUNTING
FRAUD, AND THAT THE CEO KNEW
ABOUT IT.
ABOUT IT. IN OTHER WORDS, WEISSMANN AND
MUELLER, THE FOLKS PLAYING
HARDBALL, THEY WOULD ORDER THEY
GOT WHERE THEY NEEDED TO GO.
AND THOSE DOCUMENTS WERE CRUCIAL
TO THE CASE.
WEISSMANN HAD NO RESERVATIONS
ABOUT PURSUING SOMEONE THAT HE
THOUGHT WAS GUILTY AND COULD
HELP THE CASE.
FORMER U.S. ATTORNEY BARBARA
McQUADE SAYS MUELLER’S TEAM MAY
ALSO BE LOOKING AT STATUTES THAT
MAY BE USED AGAINST MOB BOSSES
TO SWEEP UP POTENTIALLY FAMILY
MEMBERS INVOLVED IN A CONSPIRACY
IF THEY ARE.
IN OTHER WORDS, RACKETEERING
POTENTIALLY AGAINST TRUMP’S
FAMILY.
FAMILY. WEISSMANN DID SOME OF THAT KIND
OF PROSECUTION WITH ENRON.
HE IS ALSO KNOWN FOR DANGLING
THE THREAT OF EVEN MORE JAIL
TIME TO KEEP PEOPLE IN CHECK,
AND CASTING A WIDE NET.
114 PEOPLE HE NAMED AS
UNINDICTED CO-CONSPIRATORS.
UNINDICTED CO-CONSPIRATORS. BUT THEN AGAIN, CRITICS POINT TO
THE SUPREME COURT’S REBUKE OF
WEISSMANN
WEISSMANN WEISSMANN.
WEISSMANN. IF THIS HARDBALL WERE TO POINT
AGAINST YOU OR YOUR FAMILY
MEMBERS, YOU MIGHT THINK IT WAS
PRETTY UNFAIR.
PRETTY UNFAIR. ON THE OTHER HAND, WEISSMANN’S
DEFENDERS SAY THIS IS WHAT THEY
HAVE TO DO.
THEY’RE NOT DEALING WITH NORMAL
PEOPLE WHO ARE COMPLYING.
THEY’RE ONLY USING THESE TACTICS
WITH PEOPLE WHO SYSTEMATICALLY
COMMIT ALLEGED CRIMES AND THEN
COMMIT NEW ALLEGED CRIMES TO
HIDE THEIR OLD CRIMES, A KIND OF
RABBIT HOLE BLIZZARD OF CRIMES
AND COVER-UP DESIGNED TO DEFEAT
THE ONE LAWFUL FORCE THAT WOULD
CATCH THEM.
CATCH THEM. AND FACED WITH THAT, WEISSMANN,
WHO AT THE TIME WAS WORKING
UNDER MUELLER’ SERVICE, HIS
ARGUMENT IS LOOK, WE’RE GOING TO
COME HARD AT THE COVER-UP JUST
AS WE’VE COME HARD AT THE
ORIGINAL CRIME.
ORIGINAL CRIME. WEISSMANN WAS ARGUING HE WAS
BASICALLY UP AGAINST A CRIMINAL
ENTERPRISE.
ENTERPRISE. WHETHER HE FACES ONE TODAY OF
COURSE IS AN OPEN QUESTION.
WE’RE NOT REPORTING THAT
TONIGHT.
TONIGHT. BUT HE IS ALREADY PART OF A TEAM
THAT HAS INDICTED PEOPLE ON
OBSTRUCTION CRIMES AND COVER-UP
THAT INCLUDE, AS YOU KNOW, THE
PRESIDENT’S CAMPAIGN CHAIR,
NATIONAL SECURITY, LONG-TIME
LAWYER AND LONGEST SERVING
POLITICAL ADVISER, MANY ON
SIMILAR COVER-UP STYLE CRIMES.
AND THERE IS ONE THING THAT
WEISSMANN’S CRITICS AND ALLIES
AGREE ON, WE ALL KNOW THIS.
THIS PIT BULL PROSECUTOR THAT
MR. MUELLER TAPPED AND HIS TEAM,
THEY’RE NOT EVEN DONE SIFTING
THROUGH THE RUBBLE.
>> THE ENRON TASK FORCE IS
CONTINUING TO SIFT DILIGENTLY
THROUGH THE RUBBLE THAT WAS
ENRON PIECE BY PIECE, SCHEME BY
SCHEME, AND LIE BY LIE.
>> I AM NOW JOINED BY ACCLAIMED
BUSINESS JOURNAL BETHANY McLANE,
A CONTRIBUTING EDITOR AT "VANITY
FAIR," AUTHOR OF "THE SMARTEST
GUYS IN THE ROOM: THE AMAZING
RISE AND SCANDAL LOUIS FALL OF
ENRON."
ENRON." YOU’VE BEEN AT THIS FROM THE
START.
START. THANKS FOR BEING HERE.
>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.
>> IN YOUR VIEW, WHERE THE LONG
EYE OF HISTORY, WHAT DID MUELLER
AND WEISSMANN LEARN THROUGH THE
HARDBALL TACTICS OF THE ENRON
PROBE?
PROBE? >> WELL, I THINK THAT IN SOME
CASES, THEY’RE NECESSARY AND
HELPFUL.
HELPFUL. OF COURSE NECESSARY AND HELPFUL
AS YOU POINTED OUT DEPEND ON
WHICH SIDE OF THE AISLE YOU’RE
SITTING ON.
SITTING ON. BUT IT REALLY TURNED OUT TO BE
PIVOTAL IN THE CASE OF ENRON,
THE ABILITY TO CONVICT JEFF
SKILLING RESTED ON ANDY FASTOW’S
TESTIMONY.
TESTIMONY. AND IF FASTOW HADN’T COOPERATED
EVENTUALLY WITH THE
INVESTIGATION, HISTORY WOULD
HAVE BEEN DIFFERENT.
>> AND THAT’S A LOT OF HISTORY.
YOU’RE SAYING, THOUGH, FASTOW’S
COOPERATION WAS A PRODUCT OF
WEISSMANN GOING AFTER FAMILY?
>> WELL, FASTOW HAD BEEN
INDICTED AND WAS REFUSING TO
PLEA UNTIL WEISSMANN INDICTED
HIS WIFE IN A SUPERSEDING
INDICTMENT THAT BROUGHT
ADDITIONAL CHARGES AGAINST
FASTOW AND OTHERS BUT ALSO
INCLUDED HIS WIFE.
GIVEN THAT THE COUPLE HAD YOUNG
CHILDREN AT THIS TIME, IT COULD
HAVE MEANT THAT THEY WERE BOTH
AWAY IN JAIL WITH NO ONE HOME TO
CARE FOR THEIR CHILDREN.
IT’S INDISPUTABLE THAT AFTER
THAT ANDY FASTOW DID PLEAD
GUILTY.
GUILTY. AND WHEN HE PLEAD GUILTY, THIS
DOCUMENT TURNED UP THAT WAS ONE
OF THE CLEAREST INDICATIONS OF
ACCOUNTING FRAUD AT ENRON AND A
KEY LINK TO SHOWING THAT JEFF
SKILLING KNEW ABOUT THE
ACCOUNTING FRAUD.
ACCOUNTING FRAUD. AND UNTIL THAT POINT, THE
DOCUMENT HADN’T TURNED UP.
THE ONLY COPY OF IT WAS IN A
SAFE DEPOSIT BOX THAT FASTOW
SAID HE AND HIS WIFE FOUND WHEN
THEY VISITED THEIR BANK AFTER HE
HAD PLEAD.
HAD PLEAD. >> WHAT YOU’RE SAYING IS ON THE
ONE HAND, THIS WAS KEY TO
SECURING A CONVICTION THAT MANY
LEGAL EXPERTS AND CERTAINLY
PEOPLE CONCERNED ABOUT CORPORATE
FRAUD THOUGHT THOUSANDTH WAS A
VERY GOOD THING AND THE HARDBALL
GOT THEM THAT.
ON THE OTHER, YOU’RE TALKING
ABOUT TACTICS THAT TO MANY
PEOPLE, IF YOU KNEW THOSE FOLKS,
WERE FRIENDS WITH THEM, YOU’RE
TALKING ABOUT THE LEGAL
EQUIVALENT OF ORPHANING THEIR
CHILDREN.
CHILDREN. >> RIGHT.
>> RIGHT. IT’S UNQUESTIONABLE A HARDBALL
TACTIC.
TACTIC. I DON’T THINK LEE FASTOW WOULD
HAVE BEEN CHARGED IF IT HADN’T
BEEN FOR THE POSSIBLE BENEFIT
SHE COULD BRING IN PUTTING
PRESSURE ON HER HUSBAND.
HER WRONGDOING WAS MINIMAL,
ESPECIALLY IN THE SCOPE OF WHAT
HAPPENED AT ENRON.
SO IT WAS CLEARLY A TACTIC.
>> BEFORE I LOSE YOU, I WANT TO
PLAY ONE MORE THING.
THIS IS WHY SOME OF TRUMP’S
ALLIES ARE SO OBSESSED WITH
WEISSMANN.
WEISSMANN. DONALD TRUMP’S LONGEST SERVING
LAWYER, JAY GOLDBERG WHO SERVED
BEFORE COHEN TOLD US ON THIS
SHOW THEY HAD SOME SORT OF
SPECIAL ARRANGEMENT.
SPECIAL ARRANGEMENT. TAKE A LISTEN TO THIS.
>> MUELLER HAS AGREED NOT TO
HAVE WEISSMANN INVOLVED IN ANY
INVESTIGATION OF THE PRESIDENT.
THAT’S A LITTLE KNOWN SECRET,
BUT I FOUND THAT OUT.
>> WHO TOLD YOU THAT?
>> SOMEBODY ON THE PRESIDENT’S
STAFF.
STAFF. >> THAT WAS A WHITE HOUSE LAWYER
OR STAFF MEMBER?
>> A WHITE HOUSE LAWYER.
>> WAS IT TY COBB?
>> WELL, YES.
>> A LITTLE DEPOSITION TACTIC
THERE.
THERE. WE DON’T KNOW IF THAT’S TRUE, WE
JUST KNOW FORMER LAWYER JAY
GOLDBERG ASSERTED IT.
DOES THAT SOUND LIKE SOMETHING
WEISSMANN WOULD AGREE TO BASED
ON HIS RECORD?
>> NO, THAT DOES NOT SOUND LIKE
IT WOULD BE TRUE TO ME.
JUST TO PUT THIS IN BROADER
CONTEXT, THESE CRIES OF
PROSECUTORIAL MISCONDUCT,
PROSECUTORIAL MISCONDUCT, PROSECUTORIAL OVERREACH THAT.
>> HAPPEN IN EVERY SINGLE TRIAL.
THIS ONE AND THE ENRON CASE ARE
JUST A LOT MORE HIGH PROFILE
THAN MOST TRIALS.
BUTS UNOT LIKE IT’S NEW.
PEOPLE IN THE DEFENSE SEATS ARE
ALWAYS SCREAMING THAT THE
PROSECUTION IS OVERREACHING.
BY NO MEANS IS THIS SOME KIND OF
FRESH ACCUSATION.
FRESH ACCUSATION. >> BETHANY, YOU MAKE SUCH A
GREAT POINT WHICH MANY, MANY
CRIMINAL DEFENSE LAWYERS TRY TO
PUT THE REST OF THE SYSTEM ON
TRIAL BECAUSE THEY CAN, AND IT
DOESN’T INVOLVE DEALING WITH THE
EVIDENCE AGAINST THEIR CLIENT,
AS YOU SAY.
VIEWERS AREN’T COVERING EVERY
TRIAL IN THE COUNTRY.
DOES THIS ONLY HAPPEN WITH
MUELLER AND ENRON AND RUSSIA?
AS YOU SAY, NOT REALLY.
YOU WERE THERE FROM THE START.