- Hi guys, it's Capri from BirdTricks.
In today's video, you're gonna see a White Cockatoo
which, we all know my mom is afraid of,
so you guys are gonna love it.
(screen rumbling)
(child laughing)
(upbeat music)
- [Jamieleigh] Hey guys, meet Rocket,
the lesser sulphur-crested cockatoo.
He's about two years old, DNA sex: male,
and he's a little nervous about this spot.
So obviously, you can see he's fully flighted.
He has done a lot of flight and recall training with Cindy,
which we absolutely love to see.
So even in a brand new environment
where he's a little bit nervous,
he knows to come back to her, which is fantastic.
Now, Cindy is a long-time patron,
a long time follower of the Birdtricks community,
which is awesome.
So a lot of the foundational things are already in place,
and all she's really looking for in this masterclass
is for us to watch how she works with,
trains and interacts with Rocket.
As you can see, he knows a lot of tricks
and just, kind of, help her work through
when he might be getting frustrated,
or when things might not be going super well.
He knows tricks such as the spin that you saw,
the Eagle, which you just saw.
He's obviously recall trained,
and he does a lot of prop tricks as well.
And there's some frustration that comes along
with doing a lot of prop trick behaviors
because when the birds get it wrong,
they just become frustrated,
which can lead to being aggressive,
with the actual props and in and of themselves.
Now, unfortunately I lost audio on one of my cameras,
but the other one sufficed.
So, bear with me as I walk you guys through,
how we were able to help her,
how we were able to see how long until frustration builds,
how they work through Rocket,
not necessarily getting the correct behavior.
As you can see right here,
he put the red one on the yellow peg,
and it's supposed to be on the red peg.
So he's learning his colors.
He's learning how to correct mistakes.
And there's a certain limit with all birds
that's going to be different.
I will say generally with cockatoos,
you ride a much thinner line, than with other species
of birds of learning tricks.
They will get frustrated and just kind of quit on you.
Whereas other species,
you tend to be able to work through it a little bit more,
cockatoos will actually avoid training
or associate training very negatively,
where they won't ever wanna do it again.
So you have to be really mindful
about how you train a cockatoo
and always keep it fun for them.
Because again, they're very easily reinforced
by outside things that are outside of our control
a lot of the time,
and it can make it hard to find a reinforcement
that's stronger than that.
So, I hope you guys gain a lot of insight
from this video with Rocket.
I know I enjoyed the heck out of this bird,
and I know that's coming as probably a surprise
to a lot of you, since he is a white cockatoo,
but I have a bigger fear of umbrella cockatoos
than I do the the sulphurs. (laughs)
So let's get on to more of this video with Rocket.
- Okay. This one, you know this one.
So,
(nut rattles)
which one?
(claws rustling)
Good boy.
Give me, here you dingo.
You're gonna bring it to me?
You're not gonna do the whole trick.
All right.
Well, normally he has to also bring me the nut.
- [Jamieleigh] Okay.
- But he's being kinda, weirdo today.
So then I typically will move it around
and ask him to do it again.
- [Jamieleigh] So, the whole routing is,
pick the right cup, bring it to you,
like, flip it over and bring it to you.
- Yeah, see, he did it wrong.
And he's looking to me like,
where's my treat and he's not getting one.
But now at home,
he would've taken that cup and flipped it three more times
and thrown it off the table. (laughs)
- [Dave] So there's part of what your answer is,
go train somewhere else.
Whatever they're offering us, the best,
we'll train, we'll start there.
So if it's going crazy in your house,
definitely try a different room.
The other thing is, you,
have you always started with three cups?
- The instructions, said start with three cups,
but always start with it on one end,
and you keep them going to that end
and you've got the great big dot.
And then you get them go doing that consistently.
Then you start to move them.
So that's what I read,
from the instructions. - [Dave] Okay.
Yeah. So I would, like when we taught
this with playing cards,
we started with one playing card at the dot
and they just had to flip it over.
And then we added two playing cards
and it was always the same side.
It's with repetition, repetition, repetition.
And we switched it and he'd screw it up.
We'd have to like, okay, well think about it.
Okay. Let's try it again.
And he still screws up,
we might point to it and then it flips over,
cool, click, reward.
And then keep that one in the same spot for a while.
And then you might switch it back at one point.
And then when he's getting that really well,
then you add a third card and you,
but you wanna like keep it-
Is your foot okay?
- Whats it?
- Oh, you just holding it with anticipation.
(all laugh)
Something you could do, like in this case,
is he's gonna be less confident coming to me at this end.
So that's gonna ensure that he's gonna get the right cup.
- Which one?
Good boy.
- [Jamieleigh] Yay!
- Bring me the cup instead.
You're changing the trick. (laughs)
All right. I will give you your treat though. Here.
I know, you know you did,
I'm gonna give you teeny tiny pieces.
(cup sliding across table)
(taps table) Which one?
Which one?
- Hi. I was here before too.
(Cindy laughs)
- [Jamieleigh] He's just like-
- He's like when did you get here?
(all laugh)
- Which one?
- Want me to back up?
- [Jamieleigh] Can you not watch please?
- Huh?
- [Jamieleigh] Can you please close your eyes?
(all continue laughing)
- All right, I'm not watching.
(Jamieleigh laughs)
- Good boy.
You're a good boy, I know you're a little afraid.
Here, which one?
- No. - There's water.
(Cindy laughs)
- [Jamieleigh] Are you gonna do, like a retraining,
in the right way?
Because if he already has a foundation,
then she could start with one cup.
- [Dave] Yes, exactly.
Yeah. So I would, I would do one cup,
one cup, one cup, and then.
And then add the second one. - And then add the second one,
that doesn't have the dot.
- [Jamieleigh] Yes, so that he can really understand
the difference between the two cups.
- [Dave] But keep it predictable.
Like keep it on the same side,
over and over and over and over and over.
- Yeah.
- [Dave] And then let him see you switch it
and then ask for the behavior and then don't reward.
And sometimes you might need to switch one of the cup,
with the dot back, reward that,
because you know, you have to play that threshold
that we were talking about of like, threat frustrated.
But also, and I know that environment's playing
a huge part in today, but have you noticed,
like the treats you're giving, are those for sure,
his hundred percent favorite or?
- Absolutely. - Okay.
- I did bring another one he likes,
in case that might,
he wants 'em.
- I think I mentioned this last time we were here,
but we need to bring a travel kit
of all the different treats for these.
- [Jamieleigh] I just keep them in my pockets, apparently,
because I just love filter seeds and sunflower seeds.
- Normally this is his prenup treat,
this is a mix of pecans and walnuts.
- Okay.
- And he just gets, whichever one comes out in my hand.
- I love it.
I love all the- I know.
This is just,
you guys make our jobs so much more fun,
when you already have the foundation.
- Which one?
- [Jamieleigh] A and B of listeners.
- Which one?
- [Dave] He's like, um, there is only one.
(all laugh)
- I don't know what you want me to do.
I just don't know what you want me to.
- [Jamieleigh] Cockatoo problems.
- [Dave] Cockatoo follows, you said?
- [Jamieleigh] The rest of you guys, just filling in stuff.
Oh my gosh, my shoulders, like, stuck.
- He says, I'm just kinda shut down today.
All right, I'm gonna give you a BAF for that
and see if that gets you.
- [Dave] So, one observation that I just noticed,
is you're asking for something, asking for something,
asking for something and you weren't getting it.
She asked for a step up and you clicked.
What that could do, is teach him that like,
Hey, I don't have to do that.
'Cause you're eventually gonna ask me to do something else
and I'll get a click.
(Jamieleigh laughs)
I like to think of the click,
as being reserved for the perfect rep.
So at the beginning it's like,
oh, that was closer to what we wanted.
And then once they get it, I try to reserve it for like,
I didn't click. You still did the trick,
but it wasn't perfect.
It was too slow or it wasn't the right one.
So in that case, when he stepped up,
I might have still given a treat,
but I definitely wouldn't have clicked.
- Okay.
- [Dave] I just, what it could have done is said,
Hey, we're learning a new trick.
And the new trick is you ignore this for three reps
and then you step up and you get a treat,
so that if that pattern continues, then it's a problem.
- Okay.
- [Jamieleigh] He isn't an aggressive cockatoo though.
- I do tend to, if he's,
if he's really struggling with something,
I fall back to something that he's confident in.
I don't necessarily always,
I even forget to click sometimes when I should.
So, but yeah, that's good.
No, I'll think about when I click on that.
- [Dave] Yeah. And that's really good that you are,
that you noticed, okay, so when he's struggling,
you go back to something easy, but be very careful,
because that's a dangerous pattern to establish,
because like you notice when we were working
with Caitlin's bird, he was like,
he was doing a great job, doing a job.
And I was like, "Hey, throw a weight in."
And it was before he was struggling,
the way I looked it is like,
do algebra, do algebra do algebra.
Okay, what's two plus two?
All right. Algebra, algebra.
And so that like builds the confidence in the middle
as opposed to like, I can't do algebra.
That's fine, Let's just do addition.
Be careful of that pattern.
- Yeah.
Yeah.
- [Dave] So when we're teaching,
we're really like, we're teaching tricks
that they're struggling with,
which isn't necessarily a really complex trick,
but if we're teaching something that they're like,
hmm, not quite getting this, throw an easy one in,
like every fourth rep or something.
So that it's on your terms.
- Yeah.
- Well, and how many reps do you do?
'Cause I tend to keep the reps of one trick,
like three or four at the most.
And then I do something different anyway.
- Yeah. So I think it depends species to species,
you know, with the Continuit's case-
- [Jamieleigh] 1 million.
- looks like he swallowed a golf ball over there now.
(Cindy and Jamieliegh laugh)
But you know, in a, in a masterclass setting,
we, we push harder than we ever would at home,
for the most part. - Right.
- With free flight or indoor flight,
I limit it to five perfect repetitions,
of whatever the skill is.
And so they do two sessions a day,
they get 10 perfect repetitions.
And this isn't like, you know, stamp,
sealed, delivered, like, every single person.
But for the most part, that's where I'm going.
Because those repetitions you're,
you're paying so much attention,
if you know, you're only getting five reps,
that they have to be perfect.
You pay attention to all
of the why, the what, the how, the what if,
and you set up the situation to be flawless
from the beginning.
Whereas normally in trick training,
when we say three to five minutes,
if you're finding, especially, you know,
if you find he's got a short attention span,
you just do like four or five perfect reps.
That might be all that he wants to do anyway, so.
- Yeah.
(all laugh)
Yeah, I don't think so.
Well, he actually demands to train at home.
He will fly to the chair that I sit in,
and hello, I'm here. I'm ready to train.
- [Jamieleigh] Ah. That's cool, he loves it so much.
- So yeah, he, he, he loves to train.
I would say,
when he was younger, he like,
he just wanted to keep going.
It's really hard to get him to stop,
but now we're probably,
I would probably say five minutes would be an average.
- Yeah. It's hard, when the species
is self reinforced, by a behavior.
It could be biting, it could be the sound
of items falling off the top of the fridge
during the free flight class.
It could be flinging the cup to the floor.
You know, there's some things
that are just intrinsically motive,
self-motivating or self-reinforcing,
and that's hard to beat.
So I would think of like paying attention to,
is it the act of throwing it? That's more exciting.
If so, use a heavier cup.
Is it the sound it makes when it hits the table?
Then put a blanket down.
You don't strike me as somebody
who's emotionally agitated most of your life.
- [Jamieleigh] No.
(Dave laughs)
- I can get really intense.
(laughing continues)
- She whispers.
- It does. It does take quite a bit, but I do actually,
I don't not with animals, their animals,
they don't speak our language.
We don't speak theirs you know,
you can't blame them for not understanding English.
(laughing)
- [Jamieleigh] You're not paying attention.
- [Cindy] I got one.
I got one.
Okay, give me a wave?
- [Jamieleigh] Huh?
- [Cindy] Wave. (clicks tongue) There you go.
All right, yeah.
- [Jamieleigh] Thank you.
(Cindy laughs)
- He's definitely, there you go.
- [Dave] So I would say,
about one out of every 10 birds we encounter,
which is significantly higher
than I ever expected a decade ago,
I'd say probably one out of 10 birds
does better after a meal.
- [Jamieleigh] Or after like, a half meal.
- [Dave] Yeah.
- [Jamieleigh] It doesn't have to be a full one,
but like Comet, he does so much better
after I fed him a bit, but Tusa,
I wouldn't get anything done with him, so.
- Yeah.
And at home at five, he's ready to, he's ready to train.
I mean, he's asking for it.
- If I feed Jamie first, I can't get anything out of her.
- Yeah. Can you spin?
- [Dave] The failures are probably,
more important than constant successes.
That's like, I feel like it's an, it's an under,
an under understood principle in the training, so.
- Yeah. Well, I mean, when he, when he does one wrong
and he literally comes and stands right in front of me,
like you're supposed to treat me now,
and I don't give him one.
I mean, he really does think about that.
- [Dave And Jamieleigh] Yeah.
- [Dave] Yeah, you can see their gear shift a little bit,
and like, yeah.
So the other rule of thumb is,
if you are starting to experience failure,
you pushed too far too fast,
go back to what was last working well
and slowly rebuild it from there.
And so with the supplies for indoor flight,
outdoor flight, card tricks, cup tricks,
you know, retrieves, any of that,
even like flipping upside down,
like if we held that too long,
and then you click and treat,
you probably aren't even gonna get near as close,
the next time, it will have to in essence, start over.
And so, you know, Jamie mentioned like,
"oh, maybe, maybe it's just retrain it."
And as much as like, that sounds horrible,
the retraining process, takes a 10th of the time
because you've already done the work.
You're just like going through
and cleaning it up again and refreshing.
- [Jamieleigh] Yeah, it'll be quick.
- Yeah, so the retraining phrase, like go through the steps,
but just, it's not gonna take the same amount of time.
- [Jamieleigh] Yeah. Also like,
it kinda rebuilds his confidence too,
because it's just like starting easy, two plus two,
like sign me up for that math.
I feel better about myself.
(all laugh)
So I think that that would really help build his confidence,
make the training fun again,
instead of a new tone for you guys to be like,
Hey, let's rework this.
I would have to do that with the male walks,
If I had to, like, if I got Bondi
to a point where she just refused,
I would have to be like, all right,
how do I make this fun again?
How do I isolate it to just one behavior?
Simplify.
- [Dave] We see it with like flying on the corner.
She kinda mentioned some flight stuff.
And if we do flying around the corner and I go too far,
too fast and the bird doesn't make it to the right spot,
they like relapse and I have to rebuild the confidence.
And so I, with, with flight skills
and I would say it's the same for, for any trick,
is you wanna build the confidence first,
and the skills will follow.
If you're focused so much on the skills,
like exceedingly going around the corner.
And you're like going far, too fast to work on that skill,
that's where you make a mistake and the confidence drops
and your timeline starts over and you have to rebuild it.
- I would love to do free flight.
But again, I can't hike. I can't run.
There's so many things I can't do.
So that's a whole nother conversation,
but I do a lot of indoor flight with him
because it keeps him very healthy.
- [Jamieleigh] Mm-mm.
- So he,
I have like,
from my family room to my living room is longer than this,
and he'll fly that back and forth
and back and forth
and back and forth.
Then he'll go around the corner and go into my office,
'cause there's usually a treat in there and stuff like that.
He's not quite good at making four corners
to get into his bedroom yet,
he kinda lands and walks in.
(all laugh)
- [Jamieleigh] Such a common thing to do.
- [Dave] We just press stop.
- But, but yeah, so I mean, I haven't played,
I heard somebody say he finding,
hide and seek with them, to get them to come fine you.
- [Dave] Oh my gash, I've got to dig out this footage,
from the cruise ship days.
It was unbelievable. We, Jamie would hide like,
anywhere in the chairs and then I would take bandit out
and you'd hear like, woo-woo,
and he's like, huh, and he'd like,
go search all the chairs and then find her like under one.
And then we do this outside on cliffs
and he would literally go through all the trees
and then he went straight up the cliff
and found her at the top.
Do you feel like you've got some direction and?
- Yeah. Yeah.
Definitely different on how I handle the failures
and let him have a little more time to think about it
and stuff like that.
And then also, watch when I'm,
queuing an easier behavior,
do it before he's too frustrated or whatever.
So that we reset before he's really getting frustrated.
- [Dave] Cool.
- He does enjoy training.
So, usually.
- [Jamieleigh] Ah.
- [Dave] No, I don't think he enjoyed it here.
He just, you know, and actually,
it was impressive to see him in this environment knowing,
knowing how a uncertain he was,
that he still was like, heck yeah.
You know, training is that mental misdirection,
where rather than focusing on,
you know, let's go back to the bird outdoors, right?
Instead of being fearful of being stuck 80 feet in a tree,
they're like, Hey, that target stick,
I know that trick, let me go down.
You know, and it kinda redirects your mind.
I think trick training indoors does the same thing,
by just like saying, okay, I don't know my environment,
but I, I know that you can give me food, water, and shelter,
and I'm gonna look for that and I'm going to,
what, how to way around, you know?
And it was neat to see Rocket kinda work through that.
And, and he's, he's great.
He doesn't look super confident,
but he doesn't look just distraught either.
- Yeah.
- [Dave] Yeah, I think you're doing
a really good job with them.
- [Jamieleigh] Yeah. I agree.
(upbeat music)