>> MORE AND MORE PEOPLE ARE SUFFERING THE CONSEQUENCES OF
THE ASHLEY MADISON LEAK, AND A REPORTER FOR ALTERNATE ACTUALLY
MADE A GREAT POINT ABOUT THE NUMBER OF USERS ON ASHLEY
MADISON WHO COME FROM COUNTRIES WHERE HAVING AN AFFAIR OR BEING
GAY COULD BE PUNISHABLE BY DEATH.
AND SO ALL OF A SUDDEN
YOU REALIZE THAT THIS IS MORE THAN4 A SALACIOUS STORY, IT IS
ACTUALLY HAVING REAL-LIFE CONSEQUENCES ON PEOPLE, AND WE
DO NOT KNOW WHETHER OR NOT THEY ARE ACTUALLY GOING TO BE
SENTENCED TO DEATH, BUT THEY WOULD BE PERSECUTED IN THE
COUNTRY THAT THEY ARE FROM.
ONE PERSON WRITES, AND THIS IS AN
ANONYMOUS GAY PERSON, HE WRITES, "I'M FROM A COUNTRY WHERE
HOMOSEXUALITY CARRIES THE DEATH PENALTY.
I STUDIED IN AMERICA
THE LAST SEVERAL YEARS AND USED ASHLEY MADISON DURING THAT TIME.
I WAS SINGLE, BUT USED IT BECAUSE I AM GAY; GAY SEX IS
PUNISHABLE BY DEATH IN MY HOME COUNTRY SO I WANTED TO KEEP MY
HOOKUPS EXTREMELY DISCREET.
I ONLY USE ASHLEY MADISON TO HOOK
UP WITH SINGLE GUYS.
MOST OF YOU ARE WESTERNERS IN COUNTRIES
THAT ARE RELATIVELY LIBERAL ON LGBT ISSUES."
IN THIS CASE, HE
IS NOT FROM A LIBERAL PLACE, HE
IS FROM SAUDI ARABIA, SO HE DOES NOT KNOW WHETHER OR NOT
SAUDI ARABIAN OFFICIALS ARE GOING TO DISCOVER THAT HE
WAS ON THE WEBSITE.
HE IS A PRIVATE CITIZEN, NOT A PUBLIC FIGURE, SO HOPEFULLY
THAT WILL PROTECT HIM SOMEWHAT.
BUT THIS WILL HAVE A REAL-LIFE CONSEQUENCES FOR PEOPLE.
>> THERE ARE 1200 USERS FROM SAUDI ARABIA ALONE.
IN QATAR
THERE ARE FIFTY-THREE ACCOUNTS, AND FORGET THE HOMOSEXUALITY
PART, ADULTERY IS PUNISHABLE BY 100 LASHES.
WHEN THE WOMAN IS
MUSLIM AND THE MAN IS NOT, THE
WOMAN COULD BE PUT TO DEATH.
THAT SEEMS RIDICULOUS.
IF YOU
ARE CHEATING WITH YOUR HUSBAND ON A MUSLIM MAN, OKAY.
A
NON-MUSLIM?
PUT THEM TO DEATH.
THIS IS THE KIND OF BARBARISM
THAT EXISTS IN SOME OF THE PLACES IN THE WORLD, INCLUDING
SAUDI ARABIA.
SO, THE PEOPLE
WHO THOUGHT IT WAS REALLY CUTE TO LEAK THIS, THEY THOUGHT
THEY WERE DOING SOME JUSTICE ñ
IF YOU CHEATED, YOU HAD IT COMING ñ YOU THINK THE
WOMAN WHO MIGHT GET WHIPPED 100 TIMES IN QATAR HAD IT COMING?
IT IS VERY RARE THAT THEY ACTUALLY CARRY OUT THIS
PUNISHMENT, BUT IT IS CERTAINLY POSSIBLE.
IF THAT HAPPENS, THAT IS ON YOUR CONSCIENCE.
ARE YOU OKAY WITH IT?
PROBABLY SHOULDN'T HAVE CHEATED, THATíS WHAT THEY KEPT SAYING,
THEY SHOULDN'T HAVE CHEATED.
>> THAT WASN'T CUTE, IT WASN'T FUNNY, YOU ARE NOT DOING
SOMETHING THAT IS MORE MORAL THAN ANYBODY ELSE.
YOU ARE STEALING INFORMATION.
BUT FOR THE PEOPLE WHO WILL NOT GET LASHES, OR EXECUTED
BECAUSE OF THEIR BEHAVIOR ON ASHLEY MADISON, THEY HAVE
TO WORRY WHETHER OR NOT PEOPLE WILL BLACKMAIL THEM WITH
THE INFORMATION THAT WAS LEAKED.
>> THAT ANOTHER LAYER OF THAT.
IN SAUDI ARABIA ñ LIKE YOU SAID, IN
SAUDI ARABIA, MAYBE IF THEY ARE NOT FAMOUS MAYBE IT WILL PROTECT
THEM, BUT THERE'S GOING TO BE AN ENTIRE BLACK MARKET FOR
INFORMATION.
THERE ARE GOING TO BE PEOPLE SYSTEMATICALLY GOING
ONE BY ONE AND BLACKMAILING
PEOPLE.
SO WHEN YOU HIT SAUDI ARABIA WITH YOUR TREASURE TROVE
OF 1200 NAMES, AND YOU KNOW THAT PEOPLE IN SAUDI ARABIA ARE
OUTRAGEOUSLY RICH, PERFECT TARGET FOR BLACKMAIL.
AND YOU
KNOW THAT SOME OF THEM ARE GAY, AND CAN BE EXECUTED FOR BEING
GAY, THERE ARE GOING TO BE SOME BAD PEOPLE IN THE WORLD WHO
THINK, BINGO, I JUST GOT RICH.
SO FOR THE PEOPLE WHO LEAKED THE
INFORMATION, DO YOU STILL FEEL
PROUD?
YOU JUST ALLOWED A PERSON TO MAKE MONEY FROM BLACKMAILING.
>> WHAT WAS THE REASON FOR LEAKING THE INFORMATION?
>> THEY THINK THEY ARE MORE MORAL THAN OTHERS, THEY SAID IT
IS AN AMORAL WEBSITE AND YOU SHOULD SHUT IT DOWN.
IF YOU
DON'T SHUT IT DOWN, YOU HAD IT COMING.
YOU DON'T GET TO TELL
PEOPLE HOW TO SHUT DOWN THEIR WEBSITE, COST THEM HUNDREDS OF
MILLIONS OF DOLLARS.
OF COURSE THEY ARE NOT GOING TO SHUT DOWN
THE WEBSITE.
WELL YOU DIDN'T DO IT, IT'S NOT ME, THEY SHOULD
HAVE PROTECTED IT BETTER.
IT'S
LIKE SAYING, I BROKE INTO YOUR HOUSE BY THROWING A ROCK THROUGH
YOUR WINDOW, BUT YOUR WINDOW, IT TURNS OUT IT CAN BE BROKEN.
THAT'S NOT ON ME, YOU SHOULD HAVE GOTTEN ROCK PROOF WINDOWS ñ
SUCKER.
THAT'S NOT AN EXCUSE FOR STEALING AND RUINING
PEOPLE'S LIVES.
THEY THINK THEY ARE IN THE RIGHT, ALL THE SNARKY
LANGUAGE ABOUT, IF YOU ARE A MAN WHO'S CHEATING ON YOUR WIFE, YOU
THOUGHT YOU COULD GET AWAY WITH
IT, HA-HA, RIGHT?
WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO SAY TO THAT GUY WHEN
THE SAUDI ARABIAN GOVERNMENT COMES FOR HIM?
HA HA?
THE MORAL DISTINCTIONS WE MAKE ñ SO, PLENTY OF PEOPLE ON
THIS WEBSITE ARE INVOLVED IN, I PRESUME, SOME OF THEM IN
GOOD MARRIAGES, SOME OF THEM IN TERRIBLE MARRIAGES.
>> OBVIOUSLY THAT IS A SIGN OF A PROBLEM IN A MARRIAGE,
FUCKING AROUND ON ASHLEY MADISON.
>> I DON'T KNOW, NOT UNIVERSALLY, NOT 100 PERCENT OF THE TIME.
MAYBE THEY DON'T CARE, MAYBE ONE PERSON IS CHECKED OUT.
>> MAYBE THEY HAVE AN OPEN MARRIAGE.
>> BUT WE ARE MAKING A DECISION THAT IT'S THE MOST IMPORTANT
THING HAPPENING IN THEIR MARRIAGE.
MAYBE THEY ARE VERBALLY
ABUSIVE TO EACH OTHER EVERY DAY, MAYBE THEY DISREGARD
EVERYTHING THE OTHER PERSON WANTS AND NEEDS, MAYBE THEY ARE
ABUSIVE, BUT THIS IS THE THING WE HAVE DECIDED TO FOCUS ON.
I'M NOT CONDONING NOR AM I UN-CONDONING THIS, I DON'T CARE.
IíVE
GOT MY MARRIAGE, I WORRY ABOUT
MINE, JIMMY CAN WORRY ABOUT HERS.
>> HIS.
>> THE
ASSOCIATED PRESS WROTE A REALLY GREAT ARTICLE, THEY DID
NOT OUT ANY NAMES, WHICH I APPRECIATED, BUT THERE WERE MANY
GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS, NOT
ELECTED OFFICIALS, BUT GOVERNMENT WORKERS WHO WERE IN
THIS LEAK.
THEY HAD A LOT OF
INTERESTING SCREEN NAMES, AND ONE OF THEM THAT I CAN REMEMBER
OFF OF MY HEAD WAS SEXLESSMARRIAGE.
WE DON'T UNDERSTAND THE DYNAMIC OF THE RELATIONSHIP, AND IT
IS UNFAIR TO JUDGE.
>> THANK YOU ANA, YOU SAID IT MUCH BETTER THAN I DID.
THAT
MIGHT BE A PROBLEM IN THE MARRIAGE, BUT IT IS NOT A SIGN
THAT THE MARRIAGE SHOULD BE
SABOTAGED AND HUMILIATED.
THEY MIGHT'VE DECIDED, WE HAVE A
GREAT MARRIAGE, GREAT KIDS, IF
THIS SOLVES THE PROBLEM OF ME WANTING TO HANG OUT WITH YOU,
MAYBE THEY DECIDED WOULD HELP.
BUT ITíS THE NOTION THAT WE HAVE DECIDED THAT THIS DEFINES
MORALITY.
THERE WAS A WOMAN ASKING WHY JENNIFER ANISTON HAD
HOWARD STERN GIVING A SPEECH AT HER WEDDING, BECAUSE HE HAD BEEN
THROUGH A DIVORCE.
WHO ARE YOU?
WHO HASN'T BEEN THROUGH
A
DIVORCE?
OTHER THAN ME AT THE TABLE.
THIS IS NOT A WOMANIZER,
BUT THIS NOTION THAT SOMEHOW
THAT, THAT SHE WAS COMFORTABLE ON TELEVISION PASSING THIS
QUICK, ARBITRARY MORAL JUDGMENT.
THAT IS WHAT IS MOST DISAPPOINTING TO ME, THAT
WE DECIDED THAT THIS IS SOMETHING WE ARE COMFORTABLE
RIDICULING PEOPLE FOR.
>> AND FINALLY, YOU CANNOT UNDO IT.
ONCE YOU RELEASE THE DEMONS
OUT OF THE PANDORA'S BOX, JUST AS WITH GEORGE BUSH WITH IRAQ,
YOU CANNOT PUT THE DEMONS BACK IN THE BOX.
SO NOW ALL OF THE
NAMES ARE OUT, AND YOU'RE LIKE,
OH SHIT, I DIDN'T THINK ABOUT GAY PEOPLE THE MIDDLE EAST.
TOO
LATE, THEY HAVE THE NAMES, THE CREDIT CARDS, THE EMAILS.
THEY
DID NOT USE GOVERNMENT EMAILS, THEY USED THEIR OWN EMAILS, BUT
THE ASSOCIATED PRESS WAS ABLE TO DO IT ñ AND IF THEY ARE ABLE TO DO
IT, THE BLACKMAIL GUYS CAN DO IT AS WELL.
THEY PIECED IT TOGETHER
WHEN THEY USED THEIR GOVERNMENT COMPUTERS, BECAUSE THEY HAVE THE
IP ADDRESS, THEY CONNECTED IT TO THEIR CREDIT CARD ACCOUNTS AND
FIGURED OUT WHO THEY ARE.
IF THEY CAN DO IN AMERICA, THEY CAN
DO IT IN SAUDI ARABIA.
MAYBE THE HACKERS ARE AT HOME SAYING,
THAT'S NOT ON ME, THE SAUDI GOVERNMENT SHOULDNíT DO THAT.
WE KNOW THAT, BUT YOU CANNOT CHANGE THE SAUDI GOVERNMENT.
IT'S ON YOU ñ
>> ITíS ON YOU, YOU STARTED IT.
YOU BEGAN A PROCESS THAT WASN'T THAT HARD TO FIGURE OUT HOW
THE PROCESS WENT.
>> DOESN'T THIS MAKE THE CASE FOR AN ANONYMOUS YAHOO!
EMAIL?
YOU BUY THE BURNER PHONE, YOU GET
THE CREDIT CARD AT TARGET THAT IS PREPAID ñ
>> HAVING TO CHEAT ON YOUR SPOUSE SHOULDNíT ONLY BE FOR THE WEALTHY ñ
>> BY THE WAY, THAT'S WHAT THE GOVERNMENT GUYS DID.
ALMOST ALL OF THEM USED A TEMPORARY CREDIT CARD, AND
ALMOST ALL OF THEM WERE TRACKED ñ
>> BECAUSE OF THE IP ADDRESS.
>> BY THE WAY, I DON'T KNOW IF THE PEOPLE WHO DID THIS ARE
LIBERAL OR CONSERVATIVE, IF I HAD TO GUESS I WOULD GUESS
THEY ARE THE LEFT RATHER THAN THE RIGHT.
>> WHY WOULD YOU GUESS THAT?
>> BASED ON THE WAY THEY EXPRESS THEIR MORALITY.
THAT IS THE
SENSE I GOT.
YOU JUST BURNED A
COUPLE HUNDRED PEOPLE INSIDE THE OBAMA ADMINISTRATION.
SO IF YOU
WERE LIBERAL, OOPS.
AND YOU'VE SEEN FAMOUS RIGHT-WING PEOPLE
THAT HAVE BEEN BURNED.
SO WHATEVER SIDE OF THE POLITICAL
SPECTRUM YOU'RE ON, OOPS, CATS OUT OF THE BAG.
>> IT'S SO JUDGMENTAL.
>> DID YOU GET GOT?
>> NO ñ
>> USE THAT LIBRARY COMPUTER.
>> I'M ALSO THINKING, PEOPLE WHO WORK SIXTY HOURS A WEEK, THEY
GET TO USE THE GOVERNMENT COMPUTERS.
FOR WHATEVER THEY WANT.
>> THE GOVERNMENT ALLOWS YOU TO USE YOUR COMPUTER FOR A LITTLE
BIT OF PERSONAL REASONS, SOMETIMES YOU HAVE TO CHECK IF
YOUR WIFE IS OKAY ON EMAIL.
THEYíVE GOT THESE ARE STRICT RULES
FOR MOST PURPOSES, BUT IT DOESN'T MATTER.
IF ANY OF THEIR NAMES
ACTUALLY LEAKED INTO THE PRESS OR THE PUBLIC, THEY ARE GONERS.
YOU COULD HAVE BEEN BLACKMAILED, INAPPROPRIATE USE OF
GOVERNMENT RESOURCES.
GET RID OF THEM.
>> IT WOULD BE FUNNY, IT WOULD ALL BE WORTH IT IF WE FOUND
OUT BILL CLINTON WAS ON THERE.
>> WE DON'T SPEAK OF NAMES ON THE SHOW.
>> THE REASON WHY I'M SO ANGRY ABOUT IT, AND WE ALL ARE,
IT HAS THIS COMMUNIST HUNT ASPECT TO IT.
>> YES, NO DOUBT.
>> WE'VE MADE A LIST, AND YOU ARE EVIL AND YOU'RE ON THE LIST.
EVEN PEOPLE WHO HAVE NOTHING TO FEAR EXCEPT THEIR SPOUSE, OF WHICH
I SUSPECT IS OBVIOUSLY THE OVERWHELMING MAJORITY OF PEOPLE
ON THE LIST ñ MOST PEOPLE DON'T DO THAT WITH THEIR SPOUSEíS
COMPLIANCE, JUST GUESSING, AND MOST PEOPLE AREN'T IN GOVERNMENT
JOBS.
THIS HAPPENED, AND THEY POINTLESSLY ARE LIVING IN
TERROR, FOR NOTHING.
FOR NO REASON AT ALL