this video is specific advice for families on recovery
This video is specific advice for families in recovery.
We're gonna talk about the 10 things plus a bonus that you really need to stop saying to your loved one. Now
It's not because any of these things are bad.
in fact,
all of the things we're going to tell you are very natural, and I'm almost
certain that you've been saying them, or have said them, or at least been thinking them.
It's just that they're not productive and as you know.
This channel is all about helping you understand the psychology of
addiction, so that you can stay five steps ahead of it.
And honestly, it's all pretty predictable.
We know if you do or say these ten things (that I'm about to tell you),
This is really not going to get you anywhere.
And a lot of times, these things can take you in the absolute wrong direction. If you're new to this channel,
I'd like to invite you to subscribe, and I'll make sure you understand addiction
backwards and forwards. And that you are always 5 steps ahead of it.
If you've got a person in your family with a substance use disorder, you've probably got a little chaos going on in your house, right?
Maybe a lot of chaos. This video is all about the 10 things that family members (parents, spouses)
need to stop saying immediately. Amber: Right? Because these things are counterproductive.
They're not helpful. They're probably gonna damage a relationship. What are the other reasons? David:Well, they shouldn't say these things.
David: umm,
You could just make that person feel bad about themselves and honestly, a lot of them will use it as an excuse to go
drink or get high. Like when I was looking at this list and thinking back to when I was actively using,
I would have used a lot of this as an excuse. I'd think...
I can't believe she said that I'm about to get drunk.
Amber: You're so right because I think the most enabling things that families can do (is not the money)
it's playing the bad cop. That makes the person feel justified to make bad decisions.
They go use. They're just like forget it, you know. They'll say screw it, and I go out and use.
David: Yeah. Amber: okay. David: So
my name is Dave McNeese, and I'm with Greenville transitions (a founder here), and I've been working with
men that struggle with substance use disorder for about six years now. I've
worked with plenty of them. Amber: And,
I'm Amber Hollingsworth, Master Addiction Counselor and founder of Hope Hor Families Recovery Center.
And, this is the this is our top ten list of things families should stop saying. And, there's a bonus at the end.
So if you watch the whole thing,
there's a bonus. We're at Greenville transitions (a sober-living place), and
we're having this conversation about the video.
We were talking to guys and we were saying hey, what do you think should be on this list?
And one of the guys is like oh I got your whole list, right?
David: Well, I'm gonna call out some of these things of what not to say,and then Amber is gonna put a little spin on it.
(Maybe a way to reword it) Amber: or give you some alternatives or what to do instead. David: Yeah, okay
David: So here we go with #1. We've got.....
"Have you been drinking? " Amber: Who me? David: Yeah you.
Amber: I always say don't ask the question...."have you been drinking or have you been using?"
or "Are you High". Because
The person is going to lie to you immediately. It's like a reflex.
And here's what I say... If you live in the house with this person, and your gut says they're messed up.
They're messed up. Your gut is going to tell you pretty much straight. You may not know exactly what they've done,t but you know
know something's up.
If you just come right out and say.... "have you been drinking" or "Are you high". They're going to tell you no.
And then you're going to be really mad. You're going to be even madder that they lied to you,
then the fact that they used. So don't set yourself up to be lied to.
David: Yeah, and again
Going back to the days when I was using, I would have just been like did my mom really just ask me that?
I'm about to get messed up now. I'm gonna go buy a 24 pack right now.
Amber: Yeah, and so it's just the person up the person to be a victim.
It gives them another excuse to go use, and you set yourself up to be lied to. So,
I tell families.... if you have the gut feeling that something's up, then just say...."hey
I'm thinking you've been drinking" Or "You look like you've been drinking" Just make a statement,
versus a question. You may even want to wait until they're not intoxicated.
Like, if you think they're like really intoxicated,
just wait. Because you really aren't gonna get anywhere (if you're dealing with someone that's acutely intoxicated).
David: Yeah. Amber: you can say... Yesterday you came home.... You say it, and they weren't, they'll tell you. David: I like like the concerned approach. Amber: Yeah.
David: Hey, I'm concerned that you're drinking again.
Can we talk about that?
Amber: Another way you can do it is to say (and this is kind of like a brené Brown thing), the story I'm telling myself.
Sometimes I'll tell families, if you think it, and you're worried you're going be offensive, say..... "look, I know I am like the crazy
crazy, hyper-vigilant, mother, wife, husband.
But my mind going crazy telling me you've been drinking. I know I'm probably crazy. Convince me that you're not.
You can say it like that. If you really think that, maybe you're like, you know, you're hypersensitive.
Or maybe, you jump to conclusions. Say that, because it makes the person less defensive. David: Mm-hmm. I do that a lot around here
Amber: Yeah? How do you say it?
David: I mean with different things. I'll just take the approach doubting myself first, because it makes them less
defensive. It kind of takes their guard down. Amber: It leaves room for error. David: Awesome.
So #2. Did you go to a meeting? Amber, Ohhhh, good one. Why do you think they shouldn't ask that? Again for me,
It's just like one of those things that would make me want to show them, back when I was using.
Of course, I would have gone to that mentality, and secondly, it's like not their business.
I feel like those two questions set the dynamic up immediately.
Like, boss and subordinate, or probation officer and parolee, or her like I'm the good one and you're in trouble
I don't know... It sets the dynamic up I like, I'm over you kind of way which immediately puts a person a little defensive.
David: Mm-hmm. Amber: you know like principal's office kind of situation. David: Yeah, definitely. Yes
I think if you worded that a little different, to say like you know, how are the meetings going for you?
Amber: Yeah or, do you like your meetings? Or, what's your favorite meeting? Or, are there any of them that you don't like?
Ask something out of curiosity, like you really care. Like how's it going? Do you hate them? Do you like them?
like
ask something that curiosity. But, the thing I usually say about it is if someone's going to meetings, they usually bring it up on their own.
David: Yeah. Ambe: and if they're not actively bringing it up, that's a pretty good clear that they're not going
David: Yeah. Amber: cuz they usually want you to know. David: Oh, they want everyone to know they won't until they like at my meeting today....
It's almost like name-dropping. Yeah, you know, they like drop it in there. So if they're not saying it. There's your answer.
You don't even have to ask it. David: So for #3, we've got...What did you talk about in your counseling session?
Amber: Oh my gosh, I see so many husbands. I usually see these alcoholic dudes.
One of the first things I'm prep them for is..
I Say,
when you go home from the session, your wife is gonna either say (and if she doesn't say she's gonna be thinking...
What did you talk about in your session? David: Did you talk about me?
That's a big part of their worry.
Yeah, it is because they especially for married people it's weird, you know.
Especially if it's your husband. He's going talk to some other woman, and so they worry if the husband is talking about them. This even happens with kids and parents.
They (parents) Worry and think... What are they saying about me? If it's a kid and parents, they're probably saying crap stuff. about you
But don't worry. We don't believe it! So don't you don't worry about it. We know what's up.
David: So what would you say as an alternative way to approach that?
I think usually there are two things families are really after with that question.
They're worried that you're talking about them. ( Even if it's not even addiction counseling)
It's just like your spouse or your kids going to counseling. It's a worry that you have.
So they're either worried about that, or they're just wondering if it's working.
David: Yeah. Amber: It's not even so much like they want to know everything you said.
It's more of like them wondering... Is this working? Are you getting anything out of it. And so, I think that's a better question to ask. David: Yeah.
What do you think about counseling? Is it any good? They don't want all the details.
They just want to know is it helpful. David: Yeah that's awesome. Let's, move on to #4. Why did you use?
Or...Why did you drink? Amber: This one's especially happens after a relapse?
David: Yeah, it's a big one then, and man
that's a tough one to hear. For someone that did they use , or did the drinking, I would know.
Amber: What do you thinking if you've had a relapse, and the loved one asks you why did you drink?
Why did you use one to get high? What goes through your head? David: I mean my first
response would be to play the victim and just blame it on... because I have a problem. Do you not understand all that
I'm going through. What's wrong with me as a person?
Do you know how fast my brain is working ? And the anxiety? So I would start pointing fingers in other places?
Amber: I guess so they could be a victim of the question.
Like you're saying, or they could use something else like ..I'm just too stressed out at work. Or,
you're on my case. They're gonna have some kind of
victim statement and you don't want to.... Like in counseling you never want to put someone in a position
to say something opposed to what you want them to think.
Because, if you make them say it. it gets even more ingrained in their head.
David: Yeah, I mean if you have... if you know that they used ...the approach that comes to my mind
Is like... hey, how can we support you around this? Do we need to increase counseling?
Do we need to like look into sober living options?
It's coming out of a place of concern, not like a boss or someone over you.
Amber: t's just changing that right. David: That's the deal with most of these questions is like...when you approach it from
with a legitimate concern, it just comes across in a much better way to the person,. Amber: And sometimes, depending on
what happened in the relapse, or how it came out? I usually try to find some silver lining in the situation.
Even if it's a little
something. It's sort of the opposite of what I said before. You don't want them to say something negative that you don't want them to
think. So don't make something say or think something you don't want them to think.
Like if you want them to think something though, you can say.... But, you know what?
I'm really glad you're admitting it. Or you're getting ahold of it really quick, or you seem to have a lot of
Insight into it. You can shift the thinking by
finding something. David: Yeah. Amber: say...at least we called it before you hit a bottom.
Find something positive in that . That will e trigger them to think .
David: So going to #5:
Do you love drugs more than this family? Amber: What is the addict or alcoholic thinking when they get asked that? Because, that's like super common, right?
David: Yeah, man, I don't even know that's a tough one. Amber: Are they ever thinking like...
Yeah, I think I do love drugs more than this family? . David: Yeah, I think I did think that before.
Yeah.
Amber: Especially you might not have thought it , but when once you got asked that question, it makes you defensive and then you do think ...
You know what, I think do.
David: Yeah, yeah, my best friend. Amber: Right. David: Drugs and alcohol, right?
Amber: It's way better than you are. Yeah, I think when someone uses, it's not what they're thinking though.
They may think that thought defensively when you ask the question, but that's not why someone is using.
David: Yeah. Amber: the thing that thinking is... they're thinking... I'm not hurting anyone else. I'm hurt myself.
They're thinking that, or they're thinking I'm just gonna do it this one time and it's not gonna hurt anybody but me. Or, they're (the family) is not
going to know. They're telling themselves some kind of lie. That whatever they're doing isn't going to bleed over and affect
the other people. Somehow they have a fantasy they can do it without hurting everybody else.
So in their mind, it's not a question of either/or. And in the family's mind, It's either this or that.
David: Yeah, I mean honestly thinking about a little more... At first out have been defensive, and secondly,, I would have just gotten really down on
myself and internalized that. And think, wow!
What is my problem? Why do I love these drugs more than my family? When I'm not receiving any help,
I would have made me want to use more to cover up those feelings of depression. and everything that comes with that.
Amber: I just say ... Your addiction will play whatever it needs play. Like for example.. The first card
it will play, is it'll play is... something like ...You're a grown-ass man.
You can do what you want.
And then once you do it, and then you feel bad about it, like what you're saying...
Then the next thing your disease will tell you is like....You're a low down sorry sac of
crap. Your family would be better if you just left them. It's just telling you any lie
to try to get you to use, and that's why I think...
Understanding the psychology of the addict is so important. If you a(s a family member) can understand what's going to trigger certian thoughts.
That's what these videos are all about.
You can circumvent. You can get five steps ahead of the disease. These things are pretty predictable.
Like, if you say this, they're going to say that. Almost immediately. David: Yeah. Amber: So what's our next one?
David: So #6.... (it's kind of close to number five
But don't you care about your future,e or family or career? Mmm-hmm?
Are you willing to just throw all of that away for drugs?
And I think you said you hear that more with spouses. Amber Um hmmhmm.
Yeah, and I think that goes back to... in the family's mind,: You're choosing this, which means you're not choosing this.
It's one or the other, and there is usually some level of truth to that.
Because, in the long run, you can't have both. But in the addict or alcoholics mind, they're trying to have both.
David: Yeah. Amber: they're not thinking... Hey, if I smoke all this weed,
I'm not gonna have a career. lThey're telling themselves like...., oh, I'm gonna do it. It's part of that self
denial thing. David: I can make this work. Yeah. All right #7. Have you deleted the contacts off of your phone or social media?
And, I feel like this one's more popular for the parents.
Amber: Oh, yeah. David: The kid
trying to control and also just trying to control their friend groups. Like ..hey Jimmy's doing really well.
You should hang out with him more. Or like Suzy,, she's not doing so hot. So maybe you should just steer clear of her.
Watch out for trying to control the
Contacts. Amber: Mm-hmm. What's the person thinking when the family member says that. David: oh, I'm just going against it.
Amber: it's like ... eye roll immediately in my head.
Immediately like... David: You're trying to play the boss of me and my life, and I'll show you. That's
the mentality that I would take over a statement like that, right?
Have you deleted those contacts? Have you stopped hanging out with Julie?
It's that I'll show you mentality, and I'll hang out with who I want. You're not the boss of me.
Amber: To me it goes back to trying to control the problem externally. Because you think it's this one bad friend. It's the girlfriend.
It's that one bad coworker. You can run that person off, but there's gonna be another one, and another one, and another one.
You cannot control this problem externally. I know it's hard, because, you think... oh my gosh, it's that one boyfriend.
He's the reason for all this. If I can get rid of him...
But it doesn't work that way . David: No. Amber: And for all you know, your loved one is the ringleader, you know?
And usually, that's the case what the ones I see the families always think oh, it's that other one, but it's yours.
David: Yeah. Amber: So running the friend off is not going to do you any good.
David: So moving on to #8. Scare tactics. Amber: Ohhhhhhh David: and I'll let you cover this one. Amber: I hate scare tactics.
David: Yeah, I didn't have much experience with this. Amber: Oh your family' didn't do scare tactics? David: Not really not too much.
Amber: Families will actually call and try to do these scare tactics through me. They'll call me and be like, Amber,
Did you tell him that' smoking could we can do this your lungs?
You know. They'll be doing it at home and then they'll want me to... David: I definitely get it at work.
I don't think my mom did that so much.
Scare tactics just don't work.
It's just a logical thing because you're thinking. that if they knew this bad thing that could happen to them, they wouldn't do it.
But, That's what addiction is.
Addiction is doing it despite the fact I know that these bad things can happen to me. Early on, you tell yourself
that could n't happen, or that would never happen to me. And then later on, when you're really addicted,
you think I don't really care. It's worth the risk.
David: Yeah. Amber: , so it just doesn't work either way. David: and if you get to a really bad place,
It's like... I want something bad to happen to me,
So bring it on. Just in a slow steady way like, you know, I wanted to smoke cigarettes.
I wanted to take pills because you know, I wanted something to happen. I wanted this madness to end. Amber: It's what I call like passive suicidality.
It's not like an active plan.
t's just like.... I'm living reckless and I don't really care if I wake up tomorrow.
David; You know, let's speed this process up. So I definitely got to that state of mind. Amber: Yes.
David: Alright, so #9. We have comparisons: like with siblings, or friends.
We kind of brought that up with controlling contacts. But I mean we've definitely seen that around our program.
It's like man,
Why can't you be more like... Why can't he be more like his brother or her sister? Amber: I think there are comparisons that way.
Like,... Why can't you be more like________. And then there are comparisons like in the scare tactic way.
Somebody said, like... You've always got that one uncle
who
did LSD once, and he's been crazy ever since. So you can compare that way and especially
When you do either one of those., the obvious response is like.... eye rolll...the person is gonna immediately
disqualify everything you say. Because they're like, oh my god, like they don't get it.
They're just going to think you're such an idiot . David: all right # 10.
These are statements ... As long as you're not doing drugs in this house,. Or,
if I find drugs in this house, I'm calling the cops on you.
Amber: Okay, you know I put this on the list David? David: I'd love to know.
Because this is what families do, especially parents. Once they feel like it's gotten like pretty far, and they've lost control.
They'll say something like oh, I better not find it in this house. David: Mm-hmm
Amber: Let me tell you something ....if your kid has an addiction to drugs, they' ARE doing it in your house!
They have it on them all the time. They're not going on these long extensive time (days and nights) , and not doing drugs. So
Don't lie to yourself. Don't think, they're not bringing it in the house. If they're really not bringing it in the house,
they're probably not an addict. Or, we've had some kids (who get told that),
They have it like literally buried in the backyard.
And they're standing in the backyard. They're loop-holing you.
David: Yeah, and it's like another form of a scare tactic. Like, if I found drugs in this house,I will have you arrested.
And then boy, do you look bad when you do find drugs in the house (and they don't get arrested).
Most parents don't call the cops.
Amber: because most of the time people, aren't really prepared to do that, and they think
if I say that, they're gonna know I mean business, and they're definitely not going to. I knew that if you are dealing with an addict or alcoholic
They are going to do it. They are gonna do it in your house. I'm not saying you don't call the cops.
You can totally call the cops.
I'm just saying, you don't have to threaten it first. Because you might or you might not.
Sometimes parents think they would and they don't. David: yeah, and you don't want to have to go back on that, right?
Amber: It's not telling you can't. Just saying don't put the threat out there.
David: Hmm, so that wraps up the ten. Bonus: Knowing when to tap out of these conversations.
David: do you want to explain that a little bit?
Amber: Yeah.
When we were having this conversation,.... We were in group the other day,
and the group did this. (Families do this too)
But, this person was making a decision that the group didn't like, and the rest of his peers were like...
on him and on him. There was just nothing
he could say that it's gonna be right. But, the group just kept pressing it. This happens in families a lot.
It's like you get locked into this argument. You keep saying the same thing. They keep saying the same thing.
The whole thing is escalating. You gotta know when to just step out . David: yeah, there's no winning that conversation.
You've got to know and you've just hit the wall.
It's not productive, and when you feel yourself
escalating, and you feel them escalating, you need to step out immediately because all you're doing is causing more damage to the relationship.
And, in the end
the relationship is the only power that you have to be able to affect any change. And, so it's like you just
Give away all your superpowers when you do that. David: Mm-hmm
Amber:So, know when to hold em, know when to fold them. David: That's right.