John: Tonight, there's violence
and unrest across the globe,
from the Middle East to western
Africa to the caribbean, which
is where we begin.
In Haiti, the situation seems to
be getting progressively worse.
Gangs control half the country's
territory and most of the
capital, port au prince.
Just this past week, an American
nurse working for a Christian
humanitarian group and her
daughter were reported
kidnapped.
And the state department has
ordered non-emergency workers
and the families of all U.S.
Government employees to leave as
soon as possible because it
wasn't safe.
But for many Haitians, leaving
is not an option.
They had sought refuge in the
courtyard of the U.S. Embassy in
port-au-prince, dozens of
families fleeing the gangs that
have overrun their
neighborhoods.
Melanie: We don't have anywhere
to stay.
The bandits kicked us out of our
home.
They rape us even if we are old,
even the little ones they rape
them also, I had to run to come
here last night.
I had a fever, I was trembling I
never experienced anything like
this.
We are in misery.
Resident: I don't know the
reason for the violence.
The gangs just shoot and they
ask for control of the area.
They took our house and we're in
the street.
We want help to go back home.
John: On Wednesday, they fled
again -- this time from the
police, who used tear gas to
force them to leave.
More than 160,000 Haitians have
been displaced by violence.
Many are now living with family
members or crowding into
makeshift shelters.
Joseph: This is an extremely
catastrophic situation.
It is misery.
Nobody comes to check on us.
We live in misery, we can't find
food, there is no drinking
water.
We don't live like humans, we
are humiliated.
John: Haitian police and
security forces are outnumbered
and outgunned.
They have struggled to contain
the gangs since president
jovenel Moise was assassinated
two years ago, plunging the
country deeper into chaos.
The current prime minister,
Ariel Henry, has repeatedly
postponed elections.
There is not a single elected
official in the government.
In port-au-prince, protests
often turn violent.
The international community is
scrambling for a solution.
Earlier this month, U.N.
Secretary general Antonio
guterres renewed a call for a
multinational force to curb gang
violence -- something Haitian
prime minister Henri has been
asking for since October.
Sec. Gen. Guterres: We cannot
forget the Haitian people.
The world must step up.
John: The U.N. Security council
has given guterres until
mid-august to come up with
options for combating Haiti's
gangs.
Gary Pierre Pierre is the
founder and publisher of the
Haitian times, an English
language weekly newspaper.
Gary, we've gone from crisis to
crisis, cascading crises in
Haiti for a while.
Does this time feel different?
Have we entered into a new
phase, do you think?
Gary: Well, absolutely, John,
and thanks for having me.
I mean, the situation has gone
from bad to worse.
Now, the clip that you played,
people are desperate.
They're going to the U.S.
Embassies, courtyard and front
doors, thinking that they'll be
safe there.
So this is where we are.
And while the U.N. Security
council decide what to do.
John: How long can Haiti endure
this?
Gary: Well, it hasn't been able
to endure it for the last three
years yet.
It continues to endure because
the situation is complex,
because since 1994, we've had
two interventions in Haiti and
one by the U.S. And then one by
the U.N. And they haven't gone
very well.
So right now, a lot of people
are skittish and nervous about
what to do because no one wants
to have another failed
intervention of some kind.
That really doesn't solve the
problem.
And so now people want to make
sure that whatever it is that
needs to be done will be
something that works for the
Haitian people and for the
international community, because
we just cannot have a repeat of
the same old, same old again.
John: Given that legacy and
shadow of previous
interventions, would an
international security force
work?
Would it would it be an answer
to this?
Gary: The question is not
whether it will work.
What is a long term strategy?
How do you make sure that the
gangs are reintegrated into
society and they're not just
waiting out whatever force that
comes in?
And then when that force
inevitably leaves because it has
to leave?
What happens next?
Mid to long-term situation in
Haiti?
Are we going to be back ten
years later to to try to again
pacify the situation?
No one wants that.
John: Given again, the memories
of the the Marines landing in 94
and the U.N. Force going in
after the earthquake, would the
Haitian people welcome that an
international force coming in?
Gary: Well, it depends.
I mean, people in Haiti, yes,
the diaspora, Haitian Americans
are very, very skeptical about
the international community's
motives when it comes to Haiti,
whether they have the right
policy, whether they really care
about helping Haiti, or is it
something that they're going to
pour billions of dollars that
really doesn't help the
situation at all?
And one can understand the
skepticism.
John: Why hasn't prime minister
Henri held elections?
Gary: The situation is
untenable.
People are not safe in their
home.
And so I don't know how he's
going to organize elections, to
be quite honest.
First of all, you need to
pacify, return the country to
normalcy, then organize
elections.
And we're not being honest about
the situation of elections.
I think the United States
government, think that election
is what constitutes a democracy.
In the case of Haiti, it
doesn't.
We need to build in institutions
first and foremost.
And then you can have a climate
for elections and then you can
have a real democracy.
You can hold elections anytime
you want.
But it doesn't mean that it's
going to hold together.
John: What's the short term
prognosis, do you think?
What are things getting worse?
Are they getting better or
staying the same in Haiti right
now?
Gary: Well, it depends who you
talk to.
Some of my sources in the U.N.
Have told me that they have been
controlling the gangs.
One of the things that they are
doing is squeezing them out of
the ammunitions.
But, you know, the Haitian
people on the ground in Haiti,
the clip that you played is very
clear what they want.
They want help.
And that help cannot be done
through diplomacy because it
-- they are being abused, they
are being raped, they are being
killed by these gangs.
And it's not even, you know, a
war because the other side is
dead -- the other side, there's
not any weapon to fight against
the gangs.
The police are inept, you said,
outgunned and they are outgunned
because the gang members, the
gang leaders have better weapons
than the police.
John: At the risk of sounding
frivolous, I want to ask you
about the world cup.
The Haitian women's soccer team
is in the world cup for the
first time and doing better than
expected.
Is anyone there paying attention
to that?
Gary: Well, absolutely.
I mean, thank you for that
question, because it's been a
really breath of fresh air for
Haiti.
Haitians all over the world.
These women, young ladies, have
made us very proud.
And I think also this is a
metaphor for Haiti and what
Haitians can do if we put
ourselves together and decide
what we want to do, because the
government and the Haitian
federation have invested
millions into this team to make
sure that they are performing,
they are where they are.
And by the way, John, they are
the youngest team in the
competition, very inexperienced
to some extent, but they are
playing well despite having lost
two matches.
It's been close.
We've been competitive.
And so, yeah, this is something
that's a welcome distraction, if
you will.
And it's not vain at all
because, as you know, sports is
really something that brings joy
to the world.
And right now, all are riveted
with the world cup.
The women are great.
All the other teams are doing
well, and I'm really enjoying
it.
The time difference
notwithstanding, it's great.
John: Gary Pierre Pierre, the
founder and publisher of the
Haitian times, thank you very
much.
Gary: Thank you, John.
♪♪