JOLENE, CAN THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THAT. EXCELLENT REPORTING IN ADDITION TO RISING GAS
FOR THAT. EXCELLENT REPORTING IN ADDITION TO RISING GAS PRICES. THERE‘S ALSO
IN ADDITION TO RISING GAS PRICES. THERE‘S ALSO CONCERN, RUSSIA‘S INVASION OF
PRICES. THERE‘S ALSO CONCERN, RUSSIA‘S INVASION OF UKRAINE
CONCERN, RUSSIA‘S INVASION OF UKRAINE AND A POTENTIAL BAN ON RUSSIAN
UKRAINE AND A POTENTIAL BAN ON RUSSIAN IMPORTS. COULD HAVE A DEEPER
AND A POTENTIAL BAN ON RUSSIAN IMPORTS. COULD HAVE A DEEPER IMPACT ON THE GLOBAL ECONOMY
IMPORTS. COULD HAVE A DEEPER IMPACT ON THE GLOBAL ECONOMY WRIT LARGE. IN FACT, ACCORDING
IMPACT ON THE GLOBAL ECONOMY WRIT LARGE. IN FACT, ACCORDING TO CNBC
WRIT LARGE. IN FACT, ACCORDING TO CNBC JUST THE DISCUSSION OF BANNING
TO CNBC JUST THE DISCUSSION OF BANNING RUSSIAN OIL HAD
JUST THE DISCUSSION OF BANNING RUSSIAN OIL HAD EUROPEAN STOCKS
RUSSIAN OIL HAD EUROPEAN STOCKS IN FREEFALL TODAY.
EUROPEAN STOCKS IN FREEFALL TODAY. IT‘S ALSO SPARKING CONCERN OF
IN FREEFALL TODAY. IT‘S ALSO SPARKING CONCERN OF STAGFLATION,
IT‘S ALSO SPARKING CONCERN OF STAGFLATION, WHICH IS A PERIOD OF SLOW
STAGFLATION, WHICH IS A PERIOD OF SLOW ECONOMIC GROWTH. COUPLED WITH
WHICH IS A PERIOD OF SLOW ECONOMIC GROWTH. COUPLED WITH HIGH UNEMPLOYMENT
ECONOMIC GROWTH. COUPLED WITH HIGH UNEMPLOYMENT AND HIGH INFLATION. AND
HIGH UNEMPLOYMENT AND HIGH INFLATION. AND JOINING ME NOW TO DISCUSS THIS
AND HIGH INFLATION. AND JOINING ME NOW TO DISCUSS THIS PROFESSOR KEN ROGOFF. HE‘S AN
JOINING ME NOW TO DISCUSS THIS PROFESSOR KEN ROGOFF. HE‘S AN ECONOMICS PROFESSOR
PROFESSOR KEN ROGOFF. HE‘S AN ECONOMICS PROFESSOR AT HARVARD UNIVERSITY AND
ECONOMICS PROFESSOR AT HARVARD UNIVERSITY AND PROFESSOR. I WANT TO PLAY SOME
AT HARVARD UNIVERSITY AND PROFESSOR. I WANT TO PLAY SOME SOUND FROM EARLIER TODAY,
PROFESSOR. I WANT TO PLAY SOME SOUND FROM EARLIER TODAY, SENATOR MARK WARNER OF
SOUND FROM EARLIER TODAY, SENATOR MARK WARNER OF VIRGINIA,
SENATOR MARK WARNER OF VIRGINIA, ON
VIRGINIA, ON MSNBC SAID THAT PRESIDENT
ON MSNBC SAID THAT PRESIDENT BIDEN
MSNBC SAID THAT PRESIDENT BIDEN MAY ENACT A BAN ON RUSSIAN OIL
BIDEN MAY ENACT A BAN ON RUSSIAN OIL AND JUST A MATTER OF HOURS.
MAY ENACT A BAN ON RUSSIAN OIL AND JUST A MATTER OF HOURS. TAKE A LISTEN.
AND JUST A MATTER OF HOURS. TAKE A LISTEN. HOW QUICKLY DO YOU THINK WE
TAKE A LISTEN. HOW QUICKLY DO YOU THINK WE ARE GOING TO SEE ACTION FROM
HOW QUICKLY DO YOU THINK WE ARE GOING TO SEE ACTION FROM THE BIDE ADMINISTRATION?
ARE GOING TO SEE ACTION FROM THE BIDE ADMINISTRATION? IF IT ULTIMATELY
THE BIDE ADMINISTRATION? IF IT ULTIMATELY ASSESSES THAT THE U.S. DOES
IF IT ULTIMATELY ASSESSES THAT THE U.S. DOES HAVE TO GO IT ALONE.
ASSESSES THAT THE U.S. DOES HAVE TO GO IT ALONE. COULD IT HAPPEN IN THE NEXT 24
HAVE TO GO IT ALONE. COULD IT HAPPEN IN THE NEXT 24 HOURS?
COULD IT HAPPEN IN THE NEXT 24 HOURS? I THINK IT COULD HAPPEN IN THE
HOURS? I THINK IT COULD HAPPEN IN THE NEXT 24. 36 HOURS.
I THINK IT COULD HAPPEN IN THE NEXT 24. 36 HOURS. THIS CLEARLY GOT A
NEXT 24. 36 HOURS. THIS CLEARLY GOT A ENORMOUS AMOUNT OF
THIS CLEARLY GOT A ENORMOUS AMOUNT OF BIPARTISAN SUPPORT.
ENORMOUS AMOUNT OF BIPARTISAN SUPPORT. I THINK THE ADMINISTRATION WAS
BIPARTISAN SUPPORT. I THINK THE ADMINISTRATION WAS MOVING
I THINK THE ADMINISTRATION WAS MOVING METHODICALLY ON THIS. I THINK
MOVING METHODICALLY ON THIS. I THINK WE
METHODICALLY ON THIS. I THINK WE ACCELERATED THAT.
WE ACCELERATED THAT. SO PROFESSOR BREAK THIS DOWN
ACCELERATED THAT. SO PROFESSOR BREAK THIS DOWN FOR US, IF THIS HAPPENS,
SO PROFESSOR BREAK THIS DOWN FOR US, IF THIS HAPPENS, ONCE THE POTENTIAL
FOR US, IF THIS HAPPENS, ONCE THE POTENTIAL IMPACT ON EVERYDAY
ONCE THE POTENTIAL IMPACT ON EVERYDAY AMERICANS.
IMPACT ON EVERYDAY AMERICANS. WELL, PRICES ARE GOING UP
AMERICANS. WELL, PRICES ARE GOING UP AS IT IS. THEY WERE GOING UP
WELL, PRICES ARE GOING UP AS IT IS. THEY WERE GOING UP BEFORE THE WAR IN THE UKRAINE
AS IT IS. THEY WERE GOING UP BEFORE THE WAR IN THE UKRAINE AND THE
BEFORE THE WAR IN THE UKRAINE AND THE WAR IN. THE UKRAINE HAS ADDED
AND THE WAR IN. THE UKRAINE HAS ADDED MORE
WAR IN. THE UKRAINE HAS ADDED MORE INFLATION,
MORE INFLATION, YOU KNOW, HOWEVER HIGH IT WAS
INFLATION, YOU KNOW, HOWEVER HIGH IT WAS COULD BE HIGHER AND IT‘S
YOU KNOW, HOWEVER HIGH IT WAS COULD BE HIGHER AND IT‘S CERTAINLY NOT GOOD FOR GROWTH.
COULD BE HIGHER AND IT‘S CERTAINLY NOT GOOD FOR GROWTH. THE TRUTH OF THE
CERTAINLY NOT GOOD FOR GROWTH. THE TRUTH OF THE MATTERS THAT WE DON‘T IMPORT
THE TRUTH OF THE MATTERS THAT WE DON‘T IMPORT VERY MUCH FROM RUSSIA.
MATTERS THAT WE DON‘T IMPORT VERY MUCH FROM RUSSIA. WE SHOULDN‘T IMPORT ANYTHING,
VERY MUCH FROM RUSSIA. WE SHOULDN‘T IMPORT ANYTHING, BUT COMPARED TO THE EUROPEANS,
WE SHOULDN‘T IMPORT ANYTHING, BUT COMPARED TO THE EUROPEANS, MAYBE A TENTH AS MUCH.
BUT COMPARED TO THE EUROPEANS, MAYBE A TENTH AS MUCH. SO IN TERMS OF THE WHOLE
MAYBE A TENTH AS MUCH. SO IN TERMS OF THE WHOLE GLOBAL MARKET, THE EFFECTS,
SO IN TERMS OF THE WHOLE GLOBAL MARKET, THE EFFECTS, NOT
GLOBAL MARKET, THE EFFECTS, NOT NOT SO BIG.
NOT NOT SO BIG. AND WHAT ONE OF THE
NOT SO BIG. AND WHAT ONE OF THE CORNERS ONE OF THE
AND WHAT ONE OF THE CORNERS ONE OF THE DIFFICULTIES FOR THE PRESIDENT
CORNERS ONE OF THE DIFFICULTIES FOR THE PRESIDENT IS A PRICES MIGHT BE GOING UP
DIFFICULTIES FOR THE PRESIDENT IS A PRICES MIGHT BE GOING UP ANYWAY,
IS A PRICES MIGHT BE GOING UP ANYWAY, AND IF HE
ANYWAY, AND IF HE AN AXE, THE SPAN, HE‘LL GET
AND IF HE AN AXE, THE SPAN, HE‘LL GET BLAMED, BUT THE MORAL CASE
AN AXE, THE SPAN, HE‘LL GET BLAMED, BUT THE MORAL CASE REALLY IS VERY COMPELLING
BLAMED, BUT THE MORAL CASE REALLY IS VERY COMPELLING WITH THE HORRIFIC
REALLY IS VERY COMPELLING WITH THE HORRIFIC SCENES, THAT YOU‘VE BEEN
WITH THE HORRIFIC SCENES, THAT YOU‘VE BEEN SHOWING THAT ARE GOING ON IN
SCENES, THAT YOU‘VE BEEN SHOWING THAT ARE GOING ON IN UKRAINE.
SHOWING THAT ARE GOING ON IN UKRAINE. IN TERMS OF THE IMPACT ON THE
UKRAINE. IN TERMS OF THE IMPACT ON THE OVERALL GLOBAL
IN TERMS OF THE IMPACT ON THE OVERALL GLOBAL ECONOMY THAT‘S BEEN
OVERALL GLOBAL ECONOMY THAT‘S BEEN RECOVERING SLOWLY. BUT SURELY
ECONOMY THAT‘S BEEN RECOVERING SLOWLY. BUT SURELY IN THIS GLOBAL PANDEMIC. WHAT
RECOVERING SLOWLY. BUT SURELY IN THIS GLOBAL PANDEMIC. WHAT IMPACT WOULD BANNING RUSSIAN
IN THIS GLOBAL PANDEMIC. WHAT IMPACT WOULD BANNING RUSSIAN OIL HAVE ON THE GLOBAL
IMPACT WOULD BANNING RUSSIAN OIL HAVE ON THE GLOBAL PICTURE? AGAIN? WE‘RE SMALL
OIL HAVE ON THE GLOBAL PICTURE? AGAIN? WE‘RE SMALL PLAYERS IN THIS, LIKE, WE
PICTURE? AGAIN? WE‘RE SMALL PLAYERS IN THIS, LIKE, WE PRODUCE WHERE THE BIGGEST OIL
PLAYERS IN THIS, LIKE, WE PRODUCE WHERE THE BIGGEST OIL PRODUCER.
PRODUCE WHERE THE BIGGEST OIL PRODUCER. WE DON‘T IMPORT VERY MUCH,
PRODUCER. WE DON‘T IMPORT VERY MUCH, BUT WHAT WE IMPORTANT
WE DON‘T IMPORT VERY MUCH, BUT WHAT WE IMPORTANT FROM RUSSIA AND MAYBE EIGHT
BUT WHAT WE IMPORTANT FROM RUSSIA AND MAYBE EIGHT PERCENT OF OUR OIL NEEDS OR
FROM RUSSIA AND MAYBE EIGHT PERCENT OF OUR OIL NEEDS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, SO,
PERCENT OF OUR OIL NEEDS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, SO, IT‘S MORE OF A
SOMETHING LIKE THAT, SO, IT‘S MORE OF A GESTURE WE
IT‘S MORE OF A GESTURE WE DOING IT IN PART. TO TELL THE
GESTURE WE DOING IT IN PART. TO TELL THE EUROPEANS LOOK, WE‘VE DONE IT,
DOING IT IN PART. TO TELL THE EUROPEANS LOOK, WE‘VE DONE IT, YOU DO IT. BUT FOR THE
EUROPEANS LOOK, WE‘VE DONE IT, YOU DO IT. BUT FOR THE EUROPEANS
YOU DO IT. BUT FOR THE EUROPEANS COMPLETELY CUTTING OFF OIL AND
EUROPEANS COMPLETELY CUTTING OFF OIL AND GAS
COMPLETELY CUTTING OFF OIL AND GAS IS VERY, VERY PAINFUL,
GAS IS VERY, VERY PAINFUL, BUT
IS VERY, VERY PAINFUL, BUT I DON‘T KNOW WHAT THEY‘RE
BUT I DON‘T KNOW WHAT THEY‘RE GOING TO DO NEXT. I MEAN WE
I DON‘T KNOW WHAT THEY‘RE GOING TO DO NEXT. I MEAN WE HAVE DONE REALLY
GOING TO DO NEXT. I MEAN WE HAVE DONE REALLY INCREDIBLE SANCTIONS. I SEE
HAVE DONE REALLY INCREDIBLE SANCTIONS. I SEE THE RUSSIA AND PAYMENT
INCREDIBLE SANCTIONS. I SEE THE RUSSIA AND PAYMENT SYSTEM IS CONCEIVABLY
THE RUSSIA AND PAYMENT SYSTEM IS CONCEIVABLY COLLAPSING IN THE NEXT FOUR
SYSTEM IS CONCEIVABLY COLLAPSING IN THE NEXT FOUR WEEKS WITH JUST THE FINANCIAL
COLLAPSING IN THE NEXT FOUR WEEKS WITH JUST THE FINANCIAL SANCTIONS. WE PUT ON WITH ALL
WEEKS WITH JUST THE FINANCIAL SANCTIONS. WE PUT ON WITH ALL THE TECHNOLOGY, WE‘VE TAKEN
SANCTIONS. WE PUT ON WITH ALL THE TECHNOLOGY, WE‘VE TAKEN AWAY THESE ARE
THE TECHNOLOGY, WE‘VE TAKEN AWAY THESE ARE BRUTAL
AWAY THESE ARE BRUTAL UNPRECEDENTED SANCTIONS THAT
BRUTAL UNPRECEDENTED SANCTIONS THAT WE PUT ON RUSSIA ALREADY
UNPRECEDENTED SANCTIONS THAT WE PUT ON RUSSIA ALREADY BUT TIME IS SHORT FOR THE
WE PUT ON RUSSIA ALREADY BUT TIME IS SHORT FOR THE UKRAINIANS. AND
BUT TIME IS SHORT FOR THE UKRAINIANS. AND AGAIN FOR THE U.S. THERE‘S A
UKRAINIANS. AND AGAIN FOR THE U.S. THERE‘S A VERY STRONG MORAL CASE FOR
AGAIN FOR THE U.S. THERE‘S A VERY STRONG MORAL CASE FOR DOING THIS
VERY STRONG MORAL CASE FOR DOING THIS YOUR PREVIOUS.
DOING THIS YOUR PREVIOUS. GENERAL, YOU HAD ON POINTED TO
YOUR PREVIOUS. GENERAL, YOU HAD ON POINTED TO PUTIN‘S ON STABLE
GENERAL, YOU HAD ON POINTED TO PUTIN‘S ON STABLE STATE. HE ALREADY
PUTIN‘S ON STABLE STATE. HE ALREADY CONSIDERS THE SANCTIONS THAT
STATE. HE ALREADY CONSIDERS THE SANCTIONS THAT WE HAVE AN ACT OF WAR.
CONSIDERS THE SANCTIONS THAT WE HAVE AN ACT OF WAR. WHAT IF THIS IS CONSIDERED
WE HAVE AN ACT OF WAR. WHAT IF THIS IS CONSIDERED EVEN WORSE?
WHAT IF THIS IS CONSIDERED EVEN WORSE? IS THERE ANY PRECEDENT FOR A
EVEN WORSE? IS THERE ANY PRECEDENT FOR A BAN ON IMPORTING RUSSIAN OIL?
IS THERE ANY PRECEDENT FOR A BAN ON IMPORTING RUSSIAN OIL? AND IF SO, WHAT HAPPENED
BAN ON IMPORTING RUSSIAN OIL? AND IF SO, WHAT HAPPENED THEN?
AND IF SO, WHAT HAPPENED THEN? THERE‘S LOTS OF
THEN? THERE‘S LOTS OF PRECEDENTS FOR TRADE BANDS.
THERE‘S LOTS OF PRECEDENTS FOR TRADE BANDS. WE‘VE DONE THAT A LOT WITH
PRECEDENTS FOR TRADE BANDS. WE‘VE DONE THAT A LOT WITH SMALLER COUNTRIES, I
WE‘VE DONE THAT A LOT WITH SMALLER COUNTRIES, I THINK THE
SMALLER COUNTRIES, I THINK THE SITUATION‘S DOING THIS ON TOP.
THINK THE SITUATION‘S DOING THIS ON TOP. OF EVERYTHING ELSE. WE‘VE DONE
SITUATION‘S DOING THIS ON TOP. OF EVERYTHING ELSE. WE‘VE DONE WE HAVE DONE
OF EVERYTHING ELSE. WE‘VE DONE WE HAVE DONE UNPRECEDENTED FINANCIAL
WE HAVE DONE UNPRECEDENTED FINANCIAL SANCTIONS ON RUSSIA AT LEAST
UNPRECEDENTED FINANCIAL SANCTIONS ON RUSSIA AT LEAST FOR A LARGE COUNTRY LIKE
SANCTIONS ON RUSSIA AT LEAST FOR A LARGE COUNTRY LIKE THIS. AND IT‘S HAVING
FOR A LARGE COUNTRY LIKE THIS. AND IT‘S HAVING JUST A BRUTAL EFFECT,
THIS. AND IT‘S HAVING JUST A BRUTAL EFFECT, BUT THE THING IS THE
JUST A BRUTAL EFFECT, BUT THE THING IS THE GOVERNMENT
BUT THE THING IS THE GOVERNMENT REALLY DEPENDS ON THESE
GOVERNMENT REALLY DEPENDS ON THESE OIL REVENUES. I THINK IT GETS
REALLY DEPENDS ON THESE OIL REVENUES. I THINK IT GETS 40 PERCENT OF ITS REVENUES
OIL REVENUES. I THINK IT GETS 40 PERCENT OF ITS REVENUES AND OIL
40 PERCENT OF ITS REVENUES AND OIL IS REALLY
AND OIL IS REALLY MORE IMPORTANT THAN GAS TO THE
IS REALLY MORE IMPORTANT THAN GAS TO THE SOVIET ECONOMY.
MORE IMPORTANT THAN GAS TO THE SOVIET ECONOMY. SO IF WE REALLY, REALLY
SOVIET ECONOMY. SO IF WE REALLY, REALLY WANTED TO BRING THEM TO THEIR
SO IF WE REALLY, REALLY WANTED TO BRING THEM TO THEIR KNEES AND WE‘RE REALLY SERIOUS
WANTED TO BRING THEM TO THEIR KNEES AND WE‘RE REALLY SERIOUS ABOUT IT. WE WOULD INDEED
KNEES AND WE‘RE REALLY SERIOUS ABOUT IT. WE WOULD INDEED PUT OIL SANCTIONS ON BUT
ABOUT IT. WE WOULD INDEED PUT OIL SANCTIONS ON BUT I‘M SURE
PUT OIL SANCTIONS ON BUT I‘M SURE PRESIDENT BIDEN AND HIS
I‘M SURE PRESIDENT BIDEN AND HIS ADVISERS ARE ASKING THE
PRESIDENT BIDEN AND HIS ADVISERS ARE ASKING THE SKIN, YOU KNOW, HOW
ADVISERS ARE ASKING THE SKIN, YOU KNOW, HOW FAR ARE WE WILLING TO GO? IT‘S
SKIN, YOU KNOW, HOW FAR ARE WE WILLING TO GO? IT‘S NOT JUST ABOUT GAS AT THE
FAR ARE WE WILLING TO GO? IT‘S NOT JUST ABOUT GAS AT THE PUMP. IT‘S NOT JUST ABOUT
NOT JUST ABOUT GAS AT THE PUMP. IT‘S NOT JUST ABOUT HEAT IN EUROPE. IT‘S ALSO
PUMP. IT‘S NOT JUST ABOUT HEAT IN EUROPE. IT‘S ALSO ABOUT FACING
HEAT IN EUROPE. IT‘S ALSO ABOUT FACING THAN VERY UNSTABLE
ABOUT FACING THAN VERY UNSTABLE LEADER IN RUSSIA. AND
THAN VERY UNSTABLE LEADER IN RUSSIA. AND WHERE ARE YOU HOW
LEADER IN RUSSIA. AND WHERE ARE YOU HOW YOU‘RE TRYING TO GIVE THEM AN
WHERE ARE YOU HOW YOU‘RE TRYING TO GIVE THEM AN OFF-RAMP? BECAUSE ONCE WE DO
YOU‘RE TRYING TO GIVE THEM AN OFF-RAMP? BECAUSE ONCE WE DO THIS THE
OFF-RAMP? BECAUSE ONCE WE DO THIS THE ECONOMY‘S ALREADY COLLAPSING
THIS THE ECONOMY‘S ALREADY COLLAPSING AND THIS WOULD BLOW UP THE
ECONOMY‘S ALREADY COLLAPSING AND THIS WOULD BLOW UP THE GOVERNMENT BUDGET.
AND THIS WOULD BLOW UP THE GOVERNMENT BUDGET. SO IT‘S A DRAMATIC
GOVERNMENT BUDGET. SO IT‘S A DRAMATIC STUFF, BUT YOU KNOW, HE MAY
SO IT‘S A DRAMATIC STUFF, BUT YOU KNOW, HE MAY NOT STOP OTHERWISE, SO
STUFF, BUT YOU KNOW, HE MAY NOT STOP OTHERWISE, SO I CERTAINLY UNDERSTAND WHY
NOT STOP OTHERWISE, SO I CERTAINLY UNDERSTAND WHY EVERYONE‘S TALKING ABOUT
I CERTAINLY UNDERSTAND WHY EVERYONE‘S TALKING ABOUT IT.
EVERYONE‘S TALKING ABOUT IT. ONE OF THE THINGS YOU TOLD
IT. ONE OF THE THINGS YOU TOLD FORTUNE RECENTLY, IS THAT
ONE OF THE THINGS YOU TOLD FORTUNE RECENTLY, IS THAT RUSSIA MAY BE SERIOUSLY HURT
FORTUNE RECENTLY, IS THAT RUSSIA MAY BE SERIOUSLY HURT FROM SANCTIONS, BUT IT
RUSSIA MAY BE SERIOUSLY HURT FROM SANCTIONS, BUT IT WILL NOT RUN OUT OF CASH
FROM SANCTIONS, BUT IT WILL NOT RUN OUT OF CASH FAST ENOUGH TO SAVE UKRAINE. I
WILL NOT RUN OUT OF CASH FAST ENOUGH TO SAVE UKRAINE. I MEAN BREAK THIS DOWN FOR US
FAST ENOUGH TO SAVE UKRAINE. I MEAN BREAK THIS DOWN FOR US HOW REALISTIC IS IT FOR US,
MEAN BREAK THIS DOWN FOR US HOW REALISTIC IS IT FOR US, TO SORT OF BUY INTO THIS
HOW REALISTIC IS IT FOR US, TO SORT OF BUY INTO THIS NARRATIVE
TO SORT OF BUY INTO THIS NARRATIVE THAT THESE
NARRATIVE THAT THESE ECONOMIC SANCTIONS SOMEHOW
THAT THESE ECONOMIC SANCTIONS SOMEHOW WILL BANKRUPT THE
ECONOMIC SANCTIONS SOMEHOW WILL BANKRUPT THE RUSSIAN MILITARY AND THEY
WILL BANKRUPT THE RUSSIAN MILITARY AND THEY WON‘T BE ABLE TO CARRY
RUSSIAN MILITARY AND THEY WON‘T BE ABLE TO CARRY OUT.
WON‘T BE ABLE TO CARRY OUT. WHATEVER GOAL.
OUT. WHATEVER GOAL. HOOTON HAS FOR THEM IN
WHATEVER GOAL. HOOTON HAS FOR THEM IN UKRAINE.
HOOTON HAS FOR THEM IN UKRAINE. SO THERE‘S VERY LITTLE
UKRAINE. SO THERE‘S VERY LITTLE PRECEDENT FOR THE
SO THERE‘S VERY LITTLE PRECEDENT FOR THE EXTREME WHAT WE‘VE BEEN
PRECEDENT FOR THE EXTREME WHAT WE‘VE BEEN DOING TO THEM
EXTREME WHAT WE‘VE BEEN DOING TO THEM AND THAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT
DOING TO THEM AND THAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT THE FINANCIAL SANCTIONS THAT
AND THAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT THE FINANCIAL SANCTIONS THAT WE‘VE DONE SO FAR, BUT THE
THE FINANCIAL SANCTIONS THAT WE‘VE DONE SO FAR, BUT THE RUSSIAN GOVERNMENT‘S GETTING
WE‘VE DONE SO FAR, BUT THE RUSSIAN GOVERNMENT‘S GETTING OIL. LIKE CREPE. THEY PUMP
RUSSIAN GOVERNMENT‘S GETTING OIL. LIKE CREPE. THEY PUMP OIL. THEY GOT THEIR REVENUE
OIL. LIKE CREPE. THEY PUMP OIL. THEY GOT THEIR REVENUE FROM OIL. THE PRICE IS
OIL. THEY GOT THEIR REVENUE FROM OIL. THE PRICE IS UP FROM
FROM OIL. THE PRICE IS UP FROM $75 TO
UP FROM $75 TO 120. PLUS DOLLARS TODAY.
$75 TO 120. PLUS DOLLARS TODAY. THEY‘RE MAKING MORE MONEY THAN
120. PLUS DOLLARS TODAY. THEY‘RE MAKING MORE MONEY THAN THEY WERE BEFORE. THEY HAVE
THEY‘RE MAKING MORE MONEY THAN THEY WERE BEFORE. THEY HAVE LOTS OF MONEY.
THEY WERE BEFORE. THEY HAVE LOTS OF MONEY. AND IF YOU REALLY WANT TO CUT
LOTS OF MONEY. AND IF YOU REALLY WANT TO CUT OFF THE MONEY, THAT FUELS
AND IF YOU REALLY WANT TO CUT OFF THE MONEY, THAT FUELS THIS WAR THAT
OFF THE MONEY, THAT FUELS THIS WAR THAT GOT THE
THIS WAR THAT GOT THE PERMANENT. IT IS THE OIL.
GOT THE PERMANENT. IT IS THE OIL. IT‘S VERY PAINFUL FOR EUROPE.
PERMANENT. IT IS THE OIL. IT‘S VERY PAINFUL FOR EUROPE. THEY
IT‘S VERY PAINFUL FOR EUROPE. THEY IMPORT
THEY IMPORT TEN TIMES AS MUCH AS WE DO.
IMPORT TEN TIMES AS MUCH AS WE DO. THEY IMPORT THE
TEN TIMES AS MUCH AS WE DO. THEY IMPORT THE GAS THERE REALLY WOULD BE
THEY IMPORT THE GAS THERE REALLY WOULD BE SWITCHING OFF THE LIGHTS. AND,
GAS THERE REALLY WOULD BE SWITCHING OFF THE LIGHTS. AND, YOU KNOW, TAKING THEIR
SWITCHING OFF THE LIGHTS. AND, YOU KNOW, TAKING THEIR FACTORIES OFFLINE IF THEY
YOU KNOW, TAKING THEIR FACTORIES OFFLINE IF THEY START, STOP COMPLETELY,
FACTORIES OFFLINE IF THEY START, STOP COMPLETELY, BUT
START, STOP COMPLETELY, BUT CERTAINLY FOR RUSSIA.
BUT CERTAINLY FOR RUSSIA. THAT‘S THE BIG SOURCE OF
CERTAINLY FOR RUSSIA. THAT‘S THE BIG SOURCE OF REVENUE, BUT WILL IT STOP THE
THAT‘S THE BIG SOURCE OF REVENUE, BUT WILL IT STOP THE WAR?
REVENUE, BUT WILL IT STOP THE WAR? THERE‘S NOT A LOT OF
WAR? THERE‘S NOT A LOT OF OPTIMISM IN THE HISTORY OF
THERE‘S NOT A LOT OF OPTIMISM IN THE HISTORY OF SANCTIONS OF THESE THINGS,
OPTIMISM IN THE HISTORY OF SANCTIONS OF THESE THINGS, STOPPING THE WAR. I THINK THE
SANCTIONS OF THESE THINGS, STOPPING THE WAR. I THINK THE HOPE
STOPPING THE WAR. I THINK THE HOPE HOPE MIGHT
HOPE HOPE MIGHT HE THAT IT CAUSED SOME
HOPE MIGHT HE THAT IT CAUSED SOME REACTION INSIDE RUSSIA, THAT
HE THAT IT CAUSED SOME REACTION INSIDE RUSSIA, THAT PUSH PUTIN OUT, BUT HE‘S
REACTION INSIDE RUSSIA, THAT PUSH PUTIN OUT, BUT HE‘S SITTING THERE IN SOME MOUNTAIN
PUSH PUTIN OUT, BUT HE‘S SITTING THERE IN SOME MOUNTAIN IN THE URALS, YOU KNOW,
SITTING THERE IN SOME MOUNTAIN IN THE URALS, YOU KNOW, VERY SECURITY-CONSCIOUS
IN THE URALS, YOU KNOW, VERY SECURITY-CONSCIOUS PROTECTED FROM ANYONE. SO,
VERY SECURITY-CONSCIOUS PROTECTED FROM ANYONE. SO, WE HAVE TO PLAY THIS VERY
PROTECTED FROM ANYONE. SO, WE HAVE TO PLAY THIS VERY CAREFULLY JUST AS, WITH
WE HAVE TO PLAY THIS VERY CAREFULLY JUST AS, WITH THE NO-FLY ZONE,
CAREFULLY JUST AS, WITH THE NO-FLY ZONE, I THINK THE NO TRADE
THE NO-FLY ZONE, I THINK THE NO TRADE ZONE. YOU ALSO HAVE TO PLAY
I THINK THE NO TRADE ZONE. YOU ALSO HAVE TO PLAY VERY
ZONE. YOU ALSO HAVE TO PLAY VERY CAREFULLY AND US AND WE HAVE
VERY CAREFULLY AND US AND WE HAVE TO TAKE IT STEP BY STEP.
CAREFULLY AND US AND WE HAVE TO TAKE IT STEP BY STEP. ANNING RUSSIAN OIL FOR THE
TO TAKE IT STEP BY STEP. ANNING RUSSIAN OIL FOR THE UNITED STATES IS NOT
ANNING RUSSIAN OIL FOR THE UNITED STATES IS NOT THE KILLER MOVE FOR THEM. IT‘S
UNITED STATES IS NOT THE KILLER MOVE FOR THEM. IT‘S A, IT‘S A MORAL
THE KILLER MOVE FOR THEM. IT‘S A, IT‘S A MORAL MORAL STATEMENT.
A, IT‘S A MORAL MORAL STATEMENT. BECAUSE WE‘RE NOT THAT BIG.
MORAL STATEMENT. BECAUSE WE‘RE NOT THAT BIG. WE‘RE MAKING A GESTURE OR
BECAUSE WE‘RE NOT THAT BIG. WE‘RE MAKING A GESTURE OR SAYING TO THE EUROPEANS. LOOK,
WE‘RE MAKING A GESTURE OR SAYING TO THE EUROPEANS. LOOK, YOU‘RE PAYING FOR THIS.
SAYING TO THE EUROPEANS. LOOK, YOU‘RE PAYING FOR THIS. YOU‘RE THE ONES REALLY GIVING
YOU‘RE PAYING FOR THIS. YOU‘RE THE ONES REALLY GIVING THEM THE MONEY. WHAT ARE YOU
YOU‘RE THE ONES REALLY GIVING THEM THE MONEY. WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO?
THEM THE MONEY. WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO? IN TERMS OF SOME OF THE
PREPARED TO DO? IN TERMS OF SOME OF THE ASYMMETRIC NATURE OF
IN TERMS OF SOME OF THE ASYMMETRIC NATURE OF WHAT‘S GOING ON HERE.
ASYMMETRIC NATURE OF WHAT‘S GOING ON HERE. CERTAINLY PEOPLE ARE TALKING
WHAT‘S GOING ON HERE. CERTAINLY PEOPLE ARE TALKING ABOUT
CERTAINLY PEOPLE ARE TALKING ABOUT ESCALATION IN THE TRADITIONAL
ABOUT ESCALATION IN THE TRADITIONAL MILITARY SENSE, BUT YOU‘VE
ESCALATION IN THE TRADITIONAL MILITARY SENSE, BUT YOU‘VE TALKED ABOUT A CYBER ATTACK
MILITARY SENSE, BUT YOU‘VE TALKED ABOUT A CYBER ATTACK AS RETALIATION FOR SOME,
TALKED ABOUT A CYBER ATTACK AS RETALIATION FOR SOME, NOT JUST SOME OF THESE
AS RETALIATION FOR SOME, NOT JUST SOME OF THESE ECONOMIC SANCTIONS, BUT
NOT JUST SOME OF THESE ECONOMIC SANCTIONS, BUT ANYTHING
ECONOMIC SANCTIONS, BUT ANYTHING SEEN AS
ANYTHING SEEN AS ESCALATION FROM PUTIN‘S
SEEN AS ESCALATION FROM PUTIN‘S PERSPECTIVE,
ESCALATION FROM PUTIN‘S PERSPECTIVE, I DIDN‘T PACK FOR US. WHAT
PERSPECTIVE, I DIDN‘T PACK FOR US. WHAT THAT COULD LOOK LIKE
I DIDN‘T PACK FOR US. WHAT THAT COULD LOOK LIKE POTENTIALLY.
THAT COULD LOOK LIKE POTENTIALLY. AND YOU KNOW, HOW MUCH
POTENTIALLY. AND YOU KNOW, HOW MUCH HOW WHAT‘S THE LIKELIHOOD THAT
AND YOU KNOW, HOW MUCH HOW WHAT‘S THE LIKELIHOOD THAT THAT IS?
HOW WHAT‘S THE LIKELIHOOD THAT THAT IS? GOING TO HAPPEN.
THAT IS? GOING TO HAPPEN. TO BE HONEST, I‘M SURPRISED
GOING TO HAPPEN. TO BE HONEST, I‘M SURPRISED THEY HAVEN‘T TAKEN SOME
TO BE HONEST, I‘M SURPRISED THEY HAVEN‘T TAKEN SOME GESTURES ALREADY BECAUSE THE
THEY HAVEN‘T TAKEN SOME GESTURES ALREADY BECAUSE THE FINANCIAL SANCTIONS WE PUT ON
GESTURES ALREADY BECAUSE THE FINANCIAL SANCTIONS WE PUT ON THEM, HAVE BEEN SO HARSH
FINANCIAL SANCTIONS WE PUT ON THEM, HAVE BEEN SO HARSH BUT THE RUSSIANS ALMOST
THEM, HAVE BEEN SO HARSH BUT THE RUSSIANS ALMOST CERTAINLY HAVE SOME
BUT THE RUSSIANS ALMOST CERTAINLY HAVE SOME PENETRATION
CERTAINLY HAVE SOME PENETRATION INTO OUR ELECTRIC GRID
PENETRATION INTO OUR ELECTRIC GRID OUR FINANCIAL
INTO OUR ELECTRIC GRID OUR FINANCIAL INFRASTRUCTURE. WE DON‘T KNOW
OUR FINANCIAL INFRASTRUCTURE. WE DON‘T KNOW EXACTLY WHAT I THINK
INFRASTRUCTURE. WE DON‘T KNOW EXACTLY WHAT I THINK THE BIG RISK FOR THEM IS JUST
EXACTLY WHAT I THINK THE BIG RISK FOR THEM IS JUST LIKE WITH NUCLEAR WE CAN DO
THE BIG RISK FOR THEM IS JUST LIKE WITH NUCLEAR WE CAN DO WORSE TO THEM.
LIKE WITH NUCLEAR WE CAN DO WORSE TO THEM. SO THEY‘RE NOT GOING TO
WORSE TO THEM. SO THEY‘RE NOT GOING TO LIGHTLY
SO THEY‘RE NOT GOING TO LIGHTLY UNDERTAKE CYBER, BUT IT PUTIN
LIGHTLY UNDERTAKE CYBER, BUT IT PUTIN THINKS HE‘S GETTING OUT OF
UNDERTAKE CYBER, BUT IT PUTIN THINKS HE‘S GETTING OUT OF POWER
THINKS HE‘S GETTING OUT OF POWER AND HE‘S WILLING TO PULL OUT
POWER AND HE‘S WILLING TO PULL OUT ALL THE STOPS
AND HE‘S WILLING TO PULL OUT ALL THE STOPS CYBERS A
ALL THE STOPS CYBERS A VERY NATURAL PLACE TO GO. YOU
CYBERS A VERY NATURAL PLACE TO GO. YOU CAN ALSO TRY TO HIDE IT.
VERY NATURAL PLACE TO GO. YOU CAN ALSO TRY TO HIDE IT. OH, IT WASN‘T ME. ALTHOUGH,
CAN ALSO TRY TO HIDE IT. OH, IT WASN‘T ME. ALTHOUGH, THAT‘S KIND OF HARD TO BELIEVE
OH, IT WASN‘T ME. ALTHOUGH, THAT‘S KIND OF HARD TO BELIEVE IF IT‘S COMING OUT OF RUSSIA
THAT‘S KIND OF HARD TO BELIEVE IF IT‘S COMING OUT OF RUSSIA NOW.
IF IT‘S COMING OUT OF RUSSIA NOW. IMPORTANT CONTEXT AND I KEEP
NOW. IMPORTANT CONTEXT AND I KEEP AN EYE ON THE CYBER STUFF
IMPORTANT CONTEXT AND I KEEP AN EYE ON THE CYBER STUFF BECAUSE I WORK FOR HILLARY
AN EYE ON THE CYBER STUFF BECAUSE I WORK FOR HILLARY CLINTON IN 2016.
BECAUSE I WORK FOR HILLARY CLINTON IN 2016. LITTLE OBSESSED WITH IT,
CLINTON IN 2016. LITTLE OBSESSED WITH IT, PROFESSOR, KEN ROGOFF. THANK
LITTLE OBSESSED WITH IT, PROFESSOR, KEN ROGOFF. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR BEING HERE.
PROFESSOR, KEN ROGOFF. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR BEING HERE. TONIGHT,
YOU SO MUCH FOR BEING HERE. TONIGHT, AND FOR HELPING US UNDERSTAND
TONIGHT, AND FOR HELPING US UNDERSTAND ALL OF THIS,