>> Narrator: theCUBE presents KubeCon
and Cloud NativeCon Europe, 2022
brought to you by Red Hat,
the Cloud Native Computing Foundation
and its ecosystem partners.
>> Welcome to Valencia, Spain.
A coverage of
KubeCon,
Cloud NativeCon,
Europe, 2022.
I'm Keith Townsend.
Your host of theCUBE,
along with Paul Gillum,
Senior Editor Enterprise Architecture for Silicon Angle,
Enrico,
Senior IT Analyst
for GigaOm .
This has been a full day,
7,500 attendees.
I might have seen them run out of food,
this is just unexpected.
I mean, it escalated from what I understand,
it went from capping it off at 4,000 gold,
5,000 gold in it off finally at 7,500 people.
I'm super excited for...
Today's been a great dead coverage.
I'm super excited for tomorrow's coverage from theCUBE,
but first off,
we'll let the the new person on stage
take the
first question
of the wrap up of the day of coverage,
Enrico, what's different about this year versus other
KubeCons
or Cloud Native conversations.
>> I think in general, it's the maturity.
So we talk a lot about day two operations,
observability, monitoring,
going deeper and deeper in the security aspects
of the application.
So this means that for many enterprises,
Kubernetes is becoming real critical.
They want to get more control of it.
And of course you have the discussion around FinOps,
around cost control,
because we are deploying Kubernetes everywhere.
And if you don't have everything
optimized, control, monitored,
costs go to the roof
and think about deploying the Public Cloud .
If your application is not optimized, you're paying more.
But also in that,
on-premises if you are not optimized,
you don't have any clear idea what is going to happen.
So capacity planning become the nightmare,
that we know from the past.
So there is a lot of going on around these topics,
really exciting actually,
less infrastructure, more application.
That is what Kubernetes is in here.
>> Paul help me separate some of the signal from the noise.
There is a lot going on a lot of overlap.
What are some of the big themes of takeaways for day one
that Enterprise Architects, Executives,
need to take home and really chew on?
>> Well, the Kubernetes was a turning point.
Docker was introduced nine years ago,
and for the first three or four years
it was an interesting technology
that was not very widely adopted.
Kubernetes came along
and gave developers a reason to use containers.
What strikes me about this conference is that
this is a developer event,
ordinarily you go to conferences
and it's geared toward IT Managers, towards CIOs,
this is very much geared toward developers.
When you have the hearts and minds of developers
the rest of the industry is sort of pulled along with it.
So this is ground zero for the hottest area
of the entire computing industry right now,
is in this area building Distributed services,
Microservices based, Cloud Native applications.
And it's the developers who are leading the way.
I think that's a significant shift.
I don't see the Managers here,
the CIOs here.
These are the people
who are pulling this industry into the next generation.
>> One of the interesting things that I've seen
when we've always said,
Kubernetes is for the developers,
but we talk with
an icon from MoneyGram,
who's a end user,
he's an enterprise architect,
and he brought Kubernetes to his front end developers,
and they
rejected it.
They said, what is this?
I just want to develop code.
So when we say Kubernetes is for developers
or the developers are here,
how do we reconcile that mismatch of experience?
We have Enterprise Architect here.
I hear constantly that the Kubernetes is for developers,
but is it a certain kind of developer
that Kubernetes is for?
>> Well, yes and no.
I mean, so the paradigm is changing.
Okay. So, and maybe a few years back,
it was tough to understand
how make your application different.
So microservices, everything was new for everybody,
but actually, everything has changed to a point
and now the developer understands,
is neural.
So, going through the application, APIs,
automation,
because the complexity of this application is huge,
and you have,
724 kind of development
sort of deployment.
So you have to stay always on, et cetera, et cetera.
And actually, to the point of developers
bringing this new generation
of decision makers in there.
So they are actually decision,
they are adopting technology.
Maybe it's a sort of shadow IT at the very beginning.
So they're adopting it, they're using it.
And they're starting to use a lot of open source stuff.
And then somebody upper in the stack,
the Executive, says what are...
They discover that the technology is already in place
is a critical component,
and then it's
transformed in something enterprise,
meaning paying enterprise services on top of it
to be sure support contract and so on.
So it's a real journey.
And these guys are the real decision makers,
or they are at the base of the decision making process,
at least
>> Cloud Native is something
we're going to learn to take for granted.
When you remember back,
remember the Fail Whale in the early days of Twitter,
when periodically the service would just crash
from traffic,
or Amazon went through the same thing.
Facebook went through the same thing.
We don't see that anymore
because we are now learning
to take Cloud Native for granted.
We assume applications are going to be available.
They're going to be performant.
They're going to scale.
They're going to handle anything we throw at them.
That is Cloud Native at work.
And I think we forget sometimes how refreshing it is
to have an internet that really works for you.
>> Yeah, I think we're much earlier in the journey.
We had Microsoft on,
the Xbox team talked about
22,000
pods
running Linkerd some of the initial problems
and pain points around those challenges.
Much of my hallway track conversation
has been centered around
as we talk about the decision makers,
the platform teams.
And this is what I'm getting excited
to talk about in tomorrow's coverage.
Who's on the ground doing this stuff.
Is it developers
as we see or hear or told?
Or is it what we're seeing from the Microsoft example,
the MoneyGram example,
where central IT is getting it.
And not only are they getting it,
they're enabling developers
to simply write code,
build it,
and Kubernetes is invisible.
It seems like that's become the Holy Grail
to make Kubernetes invisible and Cloud Native invisible,
and the experience is much closer to Cloud.
>> So I think that, it's an interesting,
I mean, I had a lot of conversation in the past year
is that it's not that the
original
traditional IT operations are disappearing.
So it's just that traditional IT operation
are giving resources to these new developers.
Okay, so it's a sort of walled garden,
you don't see the wall, but it's a walled garden.
So they are giving you resources
and you use these resources like an internal Cloud.
So a few years back, we were talking about private Cloud,
the private Cloud as let's say
the same identical paradigm
of the Public Cloud is not possible,
because there are no infinite resources
or well, whatever we think are infinite resources.
So what you're doing today
is giving these developers enough resources
to think that they are unlimited
and they can do automatic operationing
and do all these kind of things.
So they don't think about infrastructure at all,
but actually it's there.
So IT operation are still there providing resources
to let developers be more free and agile and everything.
So we are still in a,
I think an interesting time for all of it.
>> Kubernetes and Cloud Native in general,
I think are blurring the lines, traditional lines
development and operations always were separate entities.
Obviously with DevOps,
those two are emerging.
But now we're moving
when you add in shift left testing, shift right testing,
DevSecOps,
you see the developers become much more involved
in the infrastructure
and they want to be involved in infrastructure
because that's what makes their applications perform.
So this is going to cause,
I think IT organizations
to have to do some rethinking about
what those traditional lines are,
maybe break down those walls
and have these teams work much closer together.
And that should be a good thing
because the people who are developing applications
should also have intimate knowledge
of the infrastructure they're going to run on.
>> So Paul,
another recurring theme that we've heard here
is the impact of funding
on resources.
What have your discussions been around founders and creators
when it comes to sourcing talent
and the impact of the markets on just their day to day?
>> Well, the sourcing talent
has been a huge issue for the last year, of course,
really, ever since the pandemic started.
Interestingly, one of our guests earlier today said that
with the meltdown in the tech stock market,
actually talent has become more available,
because people who were tied to their companies
because of their stock options
are now seeing those options are underwater
and suddenly they're not as loyal to the companies
they joined.
So that's certainly for the startups,
there are many small startups here,
they're seeing a bit of a windfall now
from the tech stock bust.
Nevertheless, skills are a long term problem.
The US educational system is turning out about
10% of the skilled people
that the industry needs every year.
And no one I know,
sees an end to that issue anytime soon.
>> So Enrico, last question to you.
Let's talk about what that means to the practitioner.
There's a lot of opportunity out there.
200 plus sponsors I hear,
I think is worth the projects is 200 plus,
where are the big opportunities as a practitioner,
as I'm thinking about the next thing that I'm going to learn
to help me survive the next 10 or 15 years of my career?
Where you think the focus should be?
Should it be that low level Cloud builder?
Or should it be at those levels
of extraction that we're seeing and reading about?
>> I think that
it's a good question.
The answer is not that easy.
I mean, being a developer today, for sure,
grants you a salary at the end of the month.
I mean, there is high demand,
but actually there are a lot of other technical figures
in the data center,
in the Cloud,
that could really find easily a job today.
So, developers is the first in my mind
also because they are more, they can serve multiple roles.
It means you can be a developer,
but actually you can be also
with the new roles that we have,
especially now with the DevOps,
you can be somebody that supports operation
because you know automation,
you know a few other things.
So you can be a sysadmin of the next generation
even if you are a developer,
even if when you start as a developer.
>> KubeCon 2022,
is exciting.
I don't care if you're a developer, practitioner,
a investor,
IT decision maker,
CIO,
CXO,
there's so much to learn and absorb here
and we're going to be covering it for the next two days.
Me and Paul will be shoulder to shoulder,
I'm not going to say you're going to get sick of this
because it's just,
it's all great information,
we'll help sort all of this.
From Valencia, Spain.
I'm Keith Townsend,
along with my host Enrico Signoretti,
Paul Gillum,
and you're watching theCUBE,
the leader in high tech coverage.
(upbeat music)