ADMINISTRATION, WE WILL TAKE TOUGH ACTIONS WHICH RAISE THE
COST FOR RUSSIAN MALIGN
ACTIVITY, AND WE’LL CONTINUE TO
DO THAT.
DO THAT. >> WITH ME NOW, AMBASSADOR
MICHAEL McFAUL, FORMER U.S.
AMBASSADOR TO RUSSIA, AND MSNBC
INTERNATIONAL AFFAIRS ANALYST.
AND ROBERT ANDERSON, FORMER
EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT DIRECTOR FOR
THE FBI.
THE FBI. THANK YOU BOTH FOR BEING WITH
US
US AMBASSADOR, LET ME START WITH
YOU.
YOU. I GUESS I’M JUST CURIOUS
FIRST OF ALL, WHAT DO YOU THINK
OVER IN MOSCOW RIGHT NOW PUTIN,
LEADERS IN THE RUSSIAN
GOVERNMENT JUST WATCHING -- IT’S
THE MIDDLE OF APRIL OF 2019, AND
HERE’S THE UNITED STATES, THE
ENTIRE POLITICAL SYSTEM RIGHT
NOW IS CONSUMED BY DISSECTING
THE MUELLER REPORT ABOUT WHAT
RUSSIA, AT ITS HEART, ABOUT WHAT
RUSSIA’S ROLE IN OUR 2016
CAMPAIGN
CAMPAIGN WHAT IS THE REACTION TO THAT
HOW IS THAT RECEIVED AND
REGARDED
REGARDED REGARDED, DO YOU THINK AMONG
PUTIN AND HIS INNER CIRCLE
>> WELL, A COUPLE YEARS AGO,
THEY WERE DISAPPOINTED THAT
PRESIDENT TRUMP DIDN’T ENGAGE
WITH THEM ON CONCESSIONS, THINGS
HE HAD TALKED ABOUT DURING THE
2016 PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION THAT
THEY THOUGHT WERE COMING AFTER
HE WOULD WIN
AND ON THE TOP OF THAT LIST WAS
SANCTIONS RELIEF
SANCTIONS RELIEF BUT OVER TIME, THEY’RE CONTENT
TO WATCH THIS.
THEY OF COURSE DENIED.
THEY HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH IT
THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED
STATES HAS NEVER CRITICIZED
THEM, AND IT’S GREAT THAT THE
SECRETARY OF STATE DOES.
BUT WHEN THE PRESIDENT OF THE
UNITED STATES CHOOSES NOT TO DO
SO, THAT’S A SIGNAL TO MOSCOW.
AND MORE GENERALLY, THEY LIKE
THE FACT THAT WE’RE POLARIZED,
DIVIDED, FIGHTING AMONGST
OURSELVES, AND NOT ENGAGING IN
THE WORLD.
THE WORLD. THAT’S A WIN FOR PUTIN
>> SO, MICHAEL, IN TERMS OF THE
PREPARATION FOR 2020 IN THIS
COUNTRY TO PREVENT RUSSIA FROM
DOING ANYTHING LIKE IT DID IN
2016, WHERE DOES THAT STAND
RIGHT NOW?
RIGHT NOW? >> WELL, THAT WAS TO ME, RIGHT
I WOULD SAY A COUPLE OF THINGS
ONE IS I WANT TO EMPHASIZE THE
MUELLER REPORT IS NOT LIKE THE
911 COMMISSION THAT WE HAD AFTER
SEPTEMBER 11th
SEPTEMBER 11th ITS SCOPE WAS MORE LIMITED, AND
THERE ARE MANY OTHER -- SOME
ASPECTS OF THE CAMPAIGN THAT
RUSSIA DID AGAINST US THAT ARE
NOT EVEN TREATED THERE
SAY WHAT RUSSIA TODAY DID, WHAT
SPUTNIK DID.
SPUTNIK DID. WE STILL KNOW VERY LITTLE ABOUT
WHAT THEY DID ON OUR ELECTORAL
INFRASTRUCTURE
INFRASTRUCTURE I THINK THERE’S ONLY TWO
PARAGRAPHS IN THERE.
AND I STILL WANT TO KNOW MORE
ABOUT THE MONEY.
WE STILL KNOW VERY LITTLE ABOUT
THAT
THAT NUMBER TWO, THEY DIDN’T
SCRUTINIZE WHAT THE OBAMA
ADMINISTRATION DID AND DID NOT
DO
DO I THINK THAT WOULD -- THAT’S
WHAT WE DID AFTER SEPTEMBER
11th
11th WE HAVEN’T DONE THAT
AND AS YOU SAID, THERE’S NO
PRESCRIPTIONS IN THE REPORT AT
ALL, AND THAT I THINK WE NOW
NEED TO PIVOT HARD TO THAT
WHAT DO WE NEED TO DO IN 2020?
TO ME, THERE ARE THREE BIG
BUCKETS.
BUCKETS. ONE, HOW DO WE DEAL WITH THE
MEDIA PART
MEDIA PART SOCIAL MEDIA AS WELL AS
BROADCAST MEDIA FROM RUSSIA.
TWO, ENHANCED CYBERSECURITY.
AND THEN, THREE, JUST NORMS, IF
THEY’RE NOT LAWS, ABOUT
TRANSPARENCY ABOUT CONTACTS WITH
FOREIGN GOVERNMENTS, INCLUDING
BUSINESS RELATIONSHIPS THAT
PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATES MIGHT
HAVE WITH FOREIGN GOVERNMENTS.
I THINK THE AMERICAN PEOPLE
SHOULD HAVE THE KNOWLEDGE THAT
THESE THINGS ARE HAPPENING
DURING THE CAMPAIGN, NOT JUST
AFTER IT
AFTER IT >> YEAH.
>> YEAH. AND, BOB, I GUESS IT RAISES THE
QUESTION TOO HOW POLICEABLE IS
SOME OF THIS
THE IDEA THERE, THE QUESTION OF
SOCIAL MEDIA
SOCIAL MEDIA WE’VE LOOKED AT ALL THESE THINGS
THAT LANDED ON FACEBOOK OR
SOMEHOW GOT -- YOU KNOW, GOT
THROUGH ON THE INTERNET.
YOU KNOW, WE KIND OF LIVE IN A
WORLD WHERE AT A CERTAIN LEVEL,
SOME OF THAT CAN’T BE STOPPED,
CAN IT
CAN IT >> WELL, IT’S TOUGH.
I THINK IT’S A GREAT QUESTION,
BUT I THINK THERE NEEDS TO BE A
BETTER PRIVATE SECTOR/GOVERNMENT
SECTOR BONDING WHEN IT COMES TO
NATIONAL SECURITY OF THE UNITED
STATES
STATES YOU BOTH HIT ON REALLY GOOD
POINTS, AND I CAN TELL YOU
RUSSIA IS LIKE THE ANGRY KID ON
A PLAYGROUND
A PLAYGROUND THEY’RE NOT GOING TO STOP DOING
WHAT THEY’RE DOING WITHOUT
SEVERE REPERCUSSIONS FROM THE
UNITED STATES.
UNITED STATES. THE GRU, AND THEIR MILITARY
INTELLIGENCE, I CAN GUARANTEE
YOU ARE ALREADY MAKING PLANS TO
TARGET OUR POLITICAL
INFRASTRUCTURE AGAIN IN 2020
I THINK AS THE AMBASSADOR
BROUGHT UP A LITTLE EARLIER, I
REALLY THINK WE NEED TO BE
FOCUSING ON THAT, AND NOT JUST
THE PEOPLE THAT ARE IN POWER BUT
ANYBODY THAT’S GOING TO
CURRENTLY BE RUNNING FOR THE
PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES
>> IN TERMS OF RELATIONS GOING
FORWARD, AMBASSADOR, THIS
ADMINISTRATION AND RUSSIA, YOU
MENTIONED THIS TOO, THE IDEA
THAT -- I THINK YOU HAD USED THE
TERM A BIT OF A PARADOX BETWEEN
SOME OF THE OFFICIAL
ADMINISTRATION ACTIONS THE LAST
COUPLE YEARS AND CERTAINLY THE
PUBLIC POSTURE OF THIS PRESIDENT
TOWARDS PUTIN.
TOWARDS PUTIN. WHERE DOES IT GO FROM HERE
>> I HOPE IT DOESN’T GO
ANYWHERE
ANYWHERE I THINK THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION
HAS A PRETTY SOUND POLICY
TOWARDS RUSSIA
TOWARDS RUSSIA I THINK THERE’S A LOT OF
CONTINUITY, IN FACT, WITH THE
OBAMA ADMINISTRATION, AND THEY
DON’T LIKE IT WHEN I SAY THAT,
AND OBAMA FOLKS DON’T LIKE WHEN
I SAY THAT
BUT PUSHING BACK ON RUSSIA,
SANCTIONING RUSSIA, BUILDING UP
NATO AND SUPPORTING UKRAINE,
THOSE ARE THE THREE PILLARS AS
YOU MOVE FORWARD
THE PROBLEM OF COURSE IS THERE’S
ONE PERSON IN THE TRUMP
ADMINISTRATION THAT DOESN’T
ALWAYS AGREE WITH THAT POLICY,
AND HE HAPPENS TO BE THE
PRESIDENT.
PRESIDENT. AND WHAT I DON’T KNOW IS NOW
THAT THIS INVESTIGATION IS DONE,
WILL THAT SOMEHOW EMBOLDEN
PRESIDENT TRUMP TO SAY, I GOT
THIS NOW
THIS NOW I’M GOING TO REACH OUT TO DO
WHAT I’VE ALWAYS WANTED TO DO
WITH VLADIMIR PUTIN, AND THAT’S
WHAT THEY’VE BEEN HOPING FOR
IN THE KREMLIN, IF YOU LOOK AT
THE PRESS, THEY’VE BEEN HOPING
FOR THIS MOMENT TO TRY ONE MORE
TIME TO BOND WITH THE PRESIDENT,
AND THAT’S WHY THEY WANT -- THEY
DON’T WANT HIM WITH HIS
ADVISERS, RIGHT?
ADVISERS, RIGHT? THEY DON’T WANT NOTETAKERS
BECAUSE THEY THINK THEY CAN PULL
HIM IN THEIR DIRECTION
I HOPE IT DOESN’T HAPPEN, BUT WE
SHOULD WATCH TO SEE IF THEY TRY
TO DO SO
TO DO SO >> YEAH, AND, BOB, JUST IN TERMS
OF YOU MENTIONED ALL THE
CANDIDATES RUNNING
CANDIDATES RUNNING YOU KNOW, WE’VE GOT, WHAT, 28 OF
THEM ON THE DEMOCRATIC SIDE
RIGHT NOW.
RIGHT NOW. WHAT WOULD YOU LIKE TO SEE THEIR
CAMPAIGNS DOING?
CAMPAIGNS DOING? >> WELL, I THINK ONE OF THE
THINGS -- I MEAN IT DOESN’T
SURPRISE ME OR ANYBODY THAT’S
WORKED IN THE UNITED STATES
INTELLIGENCE COMMUNITY AGAINST
OUR ADVERSARIES WHEN IT COMES TO
COUNTERINTELLIGENCE, ESPIONAGE,
COUNTERINTELLIGENCE, ESPIONAGE, OR POLITICAL INFLUENCE LIKE
RUSSIA HAS TRIED TO DO
ONE OF THE THINGS IS EDUCATION
PEOPLE NEED TO UNDERSTAND -- AND
I THINK THERE IS A LULL IN THIS
IN THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION, AT
LEAST WHEN HE WAS RUNNING AND
THEN WHEN HE FIRST GOT INTO
OFFICE -- THAT A LOT OF THE
STUFF THAT WE’RE TALKING ABOUT
IS REAL.
IS REAL. AND THE TECHNIQUES THAT RUSSIA,
CHINA, AND OTHER NATION STATES
ARE GOING TO USE TO TRY TO
ACQUIRE INFORMATION AGAINST OUR
POLITICAL CANDIDATES IS VERY
SOPHISTICATED.
SOPHISTICATED. AND I THINK THEY NEED TO BE
EDUCATED ABOUT HOW THEY’RE GOING
TO ATTACK THEM BECAUSE I
GUARANTEE YOU THEY WILL.
LOOK, THE RUSSIAN INTELLIGENCE
SERVICES, IT’S NUMBER ONE,
NUMBER TWO, AND NUMBER THREE
PRIORITY IS THE UNITED STATES.
AND I DON’T THINK THAT ANYBODY
CAN SAY IT ANY BETTER THAN THAT.
AND I THINK WE NEED TO LOOK AT
MAKING SURE OUR CANDIDATES IN