FROM BEIRUT FOR US. WE APPRECIATE IT.
>>> NOW, THE RAIDS TAKING OUT
ABU BAKR AL BAGHDADI, THE LEADER
OF ISIS, AS WE’VE BEEN TALKING
ABOUT WAS A SUCCESS IN PART
BECAUSE OF THE INTEL PROVIDED BY
U.S. ALLIES IN THE REGION.
AMY IS WITH ME NOW FOR A DEEPER
LOOK AT THE OPERATION AND WHAT
IT MEANS FOR THE REGION.
BASED ON WHAT MATT JUST TOLD US,
THE ROLE OF THE RUSSIANS AND
WHAT THEY ACTUALLY BELIEVE, HOW
DO YOU INTERPRET THAT, WHAT IS
THAT ABOUT?
THAT ABOUT? >> THE RUSSIANS ARE ACTUALLY
MAKING A PLAY, AS MATT WAS
SAYING, ALL THE COUNTRIES IN THE
REGION ARE TRYING TO CLAIM A
LITTLE VICTORY IN THIS, WHETHER
IT IS THE U.S. WITH THE MILITARY
OPERATION, WHICH OBVIOUSLY
CARRIED OUT THE RAID, HAVING
BEEN THE TIP OF THE SPHERE, SO
TO SPEAK, BUT THE COOPERATION OF
NEARBY COUNTRIES.
NEARBY COUNTRIES. THE TURKS AND RUSSIANS AND SYRIA
ALL SAYING WE ALLOWED THE U.S.
TO USE OUR AIR SPACE.
SDF SAYING WE HAD INTEGSLLIGENCE
ON THE GROUND.
IRAQI SAYING THEY FLIPPED SOME
SOURCES THAT LED TO THE
INFORMATION.
INFORMATION. AT THE END OF THE DAY, THE BIG
TAKEAWAY FOR THE UNITED STATES
TO CARRY ON AN OPERATION OF THIS
SORT, TO KILL THE WORLD’S MOST
WANTED TERRORIST, IT REQUIRED A
LOT OF HELP AND PLANNING, NOT
JUST HEROIC BRAVE MEN AND WOMEN
OF THE MILITARY BUT ALSO THE
HUMAN INTELLIGENCE GATHERING OF
SOME OF OUR ALLIES IN THE
REGION, WHICH IS IRONIC BECAUSE
THE PRESIDENT HAS SPOKEN ABOUT
SO MANY OF THESE COUNTRIES,
WHETHER MUSLIMS IN GENERAL OR
IRAQIS OR SYRIANS OR TURKS -- IN
SOMETIMES DISPARAGING LANGUAGE
OR HE BERATES THEM.
I THINK IT’S INTERESTING TO SEE
ALL OF THE RESOURCES PULLED
TOGETHER TO CARRY OUT AN
OPERATION LIKE THIS.
>> LET’S TALK ABOUT THE ACTUAL
OPERATION ITSELF.
OPERATION ITSELF. HOW WERE SPECIAL FORCES TABLE TO
PULL THIS OFF?
>> IT SEEMS IT ORIGINATED WITH
SOME RELIABLE AND CREDIBLE,
ACTIONABLE INTELLIGENCE.
ACTIONABLE INTELLIGENCE. WHAT THAT MEANS IS ONE OF THE
COUNTRIES, ONE OF THE RESOURCES
OR HUMAN INTELLIGENCE
CAPABILITIES THAT THE U.S. HAS
DEVELOPED THROUGH ALLIES OR
SPIES OR INFORMANTS ON THE
GROUND MANAGED TO IDENTIFY WHERE
AL BAGHDADI HIDES, RESIDES, AND
IN THIS CASE, WAS DEEP INSIDE
SYRIAN TESHT.
SYRIAN TESHT. THEY HAD TO GET ACCESS ON THE
GROUND.
GROUND. THEY HAD TO GET OVERSIGHT
CAPABILITY TO MONITOR THE
SITUATION TO FEEL CONFIDENT
ENOUGH THERE IS THE PRESENCE OF
AN INDIVIDUAL LIKE AL BAGHDADI
THERE.
THERE. SAME THING WE SAW IN THE BIN
LADEN RAID.
LADEN RAID. AFTER DOING SO, I THINK IN THIS
CASE, GIVEN THE NATURE OF HOW
FAST IT UNFOLDED FROM START TO
FINISH, WE UNDERSTAND IT BEGAN
IN SEPTEMBER AND HERE WE ARE AT
THE END OF OCTOBER, THAT’S A
RELATIVELY QUICK TURN-AROUND.
THE OSAMA BIN LADEN RAID TOOK
PLACE OVER SEVERAL MONTHS.
THEY REBUILT THE COMPOUND, THEY
REHEARSED THE OPERATION ON A
SIMILAR COMPOUND HERE IN THE
U.S.
U.S. THIS WAS DIFFERENT.
IT SEEMS LIKE THEY GOT THE
INTELLIGENCE, QUICKLY EXECUTED A
PLAN AND THEN WENT IN FOR THE
RAID WITHIN A MATTER OF WEEKS
FROM START TO FINISH.
THAT IN ITSELF IS REMARKABLE.
IT DEFINITELY REQUIRED A LOT OF
WHAT THEY CALL HUMAN INTEL.
THAT IS PEOPLE ON THE GROUND
IDENTIFYING THE TARGET,
PROVIDING REAL-TIME INFORMATION
IN ADDITION TO CONFIRMATION OF
HIS PRESENCE.
HIS PRESENCE. >> THERE’S BEEN REPORTING THAT
THIS HAPPENED DESPITE PRESIDENT
TRUMP’S DECISION ON FOREIGN
POLICY.
POLICY. WHAT DO YOU THINK HAVING COVERED
THIS REGION SO EXTENSIVELY?
>> IT’S REALLY HARD TO EVALUATE
IF I DON’T HAVE ALL THE
INFORMATION.
INFORMATION. I CAN UNDERSTAND WHY "THE NEW
YORK TIMES" OBVIOUSLY IS BASING
THAT ON SOURCES THEY’VE TALKED
TO.
TO. I CAN UNDERSTAND WHY PEOPLE FEEL
THIS HAPPENED DESPITE NOT
BECAUSE OF PRESIDENT TRUMP.
THE REASON BEING WHEN YOU HAVE
SUCH STRONG ALLIES ON THE
GROUND, WHETHER IT’S THE SYRIAN
DEFENSE FORCES, THE TURKS, THE
IRAQI INTELLIGENCE AGENCIES,
THEY ARE ALL THERE WORKING TO
PROVIDE INTELLIGENCE-GATHERING
PROVIDE INTELLIGENCE-GATHERING CAPABILITIES FOR THEMSELVES AS
WELL AS FOR THE U.S.
THEY ARE REQUIRED -- THEY HAVE
TO SHARE THAT INFORMATION.
YOU CAN SHARE THAT INFORMATION
WHICH YOU HAVE GOOD RAPPORT,
WHEN YOU HAVE GOOD CHEMISTRY AND
RELATIONSHIP --
RELATIONSHIP -- >> TRUST.
>> TRUST. >> TRUST BETWEEN MILITARY
LEADERS, MILITARY TO MILITARY
LEADERS, GENERALS, BETWEEN
INTELLIGENCE AGENCIES.
INTELLIGENCE AGENCIES. THERE’S TWO TAKEAWAYS.
ON ONE HAND THAT TRUST EXISTS ON
AN INSTITUTIONAL LEVEL.
MEANING THE IRAQI INTELLIGENCE
HAS A GOOD RELATIONSHIP WITH THE
CIA TO PROVIDE THAT INFORMATION.
BUT IT SEEMS IF THE PRESIDENT IS
TALKING DISPARAGINGLY ABOUT
IRAQIS, IF HE SAYS HE WANTS TO
CUT LOOSE THE SYRIAN KURDS AND
LET THEM DEFEND THEMSELVES, IF
HE TALKS ABOUT THEM IN THIS
NEGATIVE WAY THAT IT WAS THREE
DAYS AFTER THE KURDS CAME INTO
THE MIX, AS HE WAS SAYING IN
SUNDAY, WHEN YOU GET THAT SENSE
THAT HE TALKS ABOUT THEM THAT
WEIGHED, YOU CAN SEE WHY
AMERICAN MILITARY PLANNERS,
INTELLIGENCE OFFICERS ARE
PROBABLY LOOKING AT THIS AND
SAYING, HEY, WE NEED TO QUICKLY
ACT ON THIS BEFORE WE LOSE OUR
ASSETS ON THE GROUND, BEFORE
THEY KIND OF GET UPSET WITH US
AND WALK AWAY FROM ANY KIND OF
INTELLIGENCE-SHARING MECHANISMS
INTELLIGENCE-SHARING MECHANISMS WE HAVE IN PLACE.
>> CAN THAT TRUST BE REBUILT?
ARE YOU CONCERNED ABOUT THAT
TRUST BEING SO ERODED THAT THE
NEXT TIME THIS NEEDS TO HAPPEN
AND THERE’S SUCH AN IMPORTANT
MISSION THAT THE U.S. WILL BE IN
A DISADVANTAGE TAJ YOUS
POSITION?
POSITION? >> OF COURSE.
THE KEYWORD IS TRUST AND YOU
KNOW YOU HAVE PARTNERS THAT WILL
PROVIDE YOU INFORMATION AND DO
THE SAME IF THEY NEED
INFORMATION FROM YOU.
ULTIMATELY, A LOT OF THIS IS
BUILT ON PERSONAL RELATIONSHIPS.
THAT’S NOT TO SAY THAT THERE
AREN’T PEOPLE WHO ADMIRE
PRESIDENT TRUMP’S LEADERSHIP
STYLE.
STYLE. FOR THE MOST PART PEOPLE IN THE
REGION FEEL THE WAY HE TALKS,
THE POLICIES HE’S DONE, THE FACT
HE’S CUT LOOSE THE SYRIAN KURDS
WHO WERE FIGHTING WITH US
ALONGSIDE US, I THINK, IS GOING
TO SEND A CHILL DOWN THE SPINES
OF MANY OF OUR ALLIES.
LIKE, HOLD ON, WE’RE NOT GOING
TO BE ABLE TO DEPEND ON THIS
LEADER -- THE LEADERSHIP OF THE
UNITED STATES GOING FORWARD.
IT’S SOMETHING THE PRESIDENT OF
IRAQI TOLD HIMSELF WHERE HE SAID
REPEATEDLY THAT THE UNITED
STATES IS JUST NOT AS RELIABLE
AS IT ONCE WAS SO HE HAS
RESERVATIONS ABOUT HOW LONG THAT
TRUST, THAT CORNERSTONE OF THE
REGION CAN BE PRESERVED.
THIS IS A PRESIDENT OF IRAQI
WHO’S VERY PRO-WESTERN,
PRO-AMERICAN, VERY MUCH
CONNECTED TO THE UNITED STATES.
>> PRESIDENT TRUMP IS TRYING TO
TALK ABOUT THE END OF THE ISIS
CALIPHATE.
CALIPHATE. ARE WE AT THE END OF THE ISIS
CALIPHATE?
CALIPHATE? >> I THINK IF YOU’RE TALKING
ABOUT IT AS A TERRITORIAL PIECE
OF LAND, INTEGRITY, CONTINUITY,
YES, THAT’S PROBABLY IT.
BUT I DON’T NECESSARILY THINK
THAT’S A HELPFUL WAY TO THINK OF
TERRORISM.
TERRORISM. I WOULD LOOK AT IT MORE AS AN
IDEOLOGY AND NOT AN
ORGANIZATION.
ORGANIZATION. WHAT WE’VE SEEN SINCE, LET’S
SAY, THE BEGINNINGS AND THE
BIRTHS OF AL QAEDA, WHICH WAS
PROBABLY ONE OF THE MOST PENNED
TERRORIST ORGANIZATION, YOU KILL
OSAMA BIN LADEN, YOU DESTROY THE
ACTUAL TERRITORY THEY OWNED IN
AFGHANISTAN.
AFGHANISTAN. WHAT HAPPENS?
WHAT HAPPENS? YOU GET SPLINTER GROUPS.
YOU GET AL QAEDA IN IRAQ WHICH
PRODUCED ZARQAWI WHICH LED TO
ISIS AND THEN YOU GET ABU BAKR
AL BAGHDADI.
AL BAGHDADI. I GET ALL OF THAT TO SAY IS YOU
GET SPLINTER GROUPS THAT BECOME
IN THEMSELVES MORE HARDENED,
MORE EXTREME THAN THEIR PARENT
ORGANIZATIONS.
ORGANIZATIONS. DON’T FORGET, YOU HAVE TERRORIST
GROUPS LIKE AL SHABAB AND BOCA
THAT RAM IN SYRIA.
YOU MAY HAVE DESTROYED ISIS AS A
CALIPHATE AND YOU’VE KILLED THE
LEADERSHIP, BUT IN REALITY
YOU’VE ALSO -- HAVE NOT DONE
MUCH TO COMBAT THE EXTREMIST
IDEOLOGY.
IDEOLOGY. THERE’S A PRO FACTOR AND PUSH
FACTOR.
FACTOR. BOTH ARE AT PLAY IN THE REGION,
REGARDLESS IF YOU KILL ONE