- Hello, I'm Pete Williams in for Gwen Ifill
and this the Washington Week Extra.
Phil, I wanna start you with something that
we didn't get to during the broadcast,
a name that we haven't heard much in
this campaign nationally, Evan McMullin.
Who is he and why might he make a difference?
- Well he's an independent candidate for President,
he's actually a republican, he's 40 years old,
former CIA operative and congressional staffer.
Nobody really knows who he is but he's from Utah,
born there and he's really trying to win that state.
That single state.
It's a state where Donald Trump is struggling mightily.
Mitt Romney won it 73 percent to 25 percent in 2012.
And yet Trump is either tied or
losing right now in the polls.
McMullin thinks if he can win in Utah, somehow deny
either Hillary Clinton or Donald Trump the majority
in the electoral vote, through the 12th amendment
he can kick the results over to the congress
and maybe he could get elected President that way.
- The 12th amendment, as loyal viewers of
the show would know, is the one that says
if nobody has a majority in the electoral college
then the House decides who the President is.
That's the one you're talking about.
- [Phil] That's exactly right.
- But why is he so popular in Utah?
Or perhaps the inverse is why is Trump so unpopular in Utah?
- Well McMullin is popular in Utah because
his name is not Donald Trump.
I mean, he's somebody different, he's a conservative,
he gives republicans in Utah who are very uneasy
with Trump especially Mormons there who just cannot
handle some of the vulgarity that comes from Trump's
campaign, gives them an option.
Somebody other than Hillary Clinto to vote for.
McMullin really came out of the Never Trump movement.
He is funded by a lot of Never Trump donors.
Bill Crystal, the editor of the Weekly Standard
who's been a critic of Trump's, has really recruited him
and groomed him as a candidate.
- Could he win Utah, Jeanne?
And could he win any other state?
- No, he can't win any other state but can win Utah.
I mean, he is a Mormon, he went to Brigham Young University.
He reflects the values.
I think that the level of Mormon participation or
voter registration stages like in the 70s or low 70s.
So he's one of them, he reflect their values.
Their values matter to them.
Utah is the state with the highest percentage
of people who go to church every week.
So he's tailor made for them.
And many of those voters, they can't do Trump
and they just can't do Hillary either.
Although Hillary, her campaign is trying.
They do have a little rump group up there,
trying to stir up some support for her.
Maybe steal one. But I think that this is it.
And that would be the first time a third party
candidate won a state since 1968.
- [Pete] How many electoral votes?
- Six. Two more than New Hampshire.
- Someone described it to me as a civilized protest vote.
- Jeff, I wanna ask you about Bloomberg.
That's out with an interesting new poll
of likely republican voters, about who they see as
the future of the party.
They were asked "who do you want to
be the face of the party, nationally?"
27 percent said Mike Pence. Trump was at 24.
Followed by Ted Cruz, Paul Ryan and John Kasich.
So, if Trump doesn't win the election,
what does this say about his future in the republican party?
Is there one?
- I think very, very limited future in the republican party.
I mean, basically there will be a free-for-all
after the election on November 9th,
the morning after, inside the republican party.
The divisions will exist until someone heals them.
Mike Pence is at the top of the list
here at 27 percent in a Bloomberg poll.
He has had this high-wire act really for the last
several months to, you know, be a loyal Vice Presidential
candidate but not stray from his principles
as a potential 2020 Presidential candidate.
And I think, overall, he's done better than
most people in his position would be able to.
He's had few places where, you know, he's cleaned up
and he's had to sort of change his answer
to fit what Donald Trump said.
But look, I think that Mike Pence will emerge
as the heir apparent, I guess, with the leader of
the national party for a moment.
But, boy, once the congressional session
begins again in January, Paul Ryan
will be very visible, Speaker Ryan.
Now he has potential trouble on his right flank here
because some conservatives in the house,
a rabble rousing group to be sure, say that
they will challenge him for the speakership.
Mark Meadows, the congressman who gave John Boehner
a hard time is saying he'll challenge him.
But what this shows is the republican
party will be leaderless.
Mike Pence will be the leader but not standing very tall.
- And of course, who knows what Donald Trump wants to do?
- [Jeff] Right.
- We said during the broadcast that Donald Trump had
a lot of people watching the debate and we noticed
this week that the eight million people were watching
the debate on a Donald Trump Facebook page.
So, could his future be on some
kind of television channel, do you think?
Is that maybe something he's thinking about?
- It is something that they are thinking about.
His son-in-law met recently with one of the biggest
investors in these kinds of start
up new channel television networks.
So, we know it's an option that they've kicked around
inside when they've thought about the future.
It makes a lot of sense.
His good friend Roger Ailes from Fox, recently departed
from Fox News with no doubt a grudge, wouldn't mind
probably starting up another channel.
- He's still on Rupert Murdoch's payroll though, isn't he?
- Well, that doesn't mean over, you know,
a ham sandwich at Mar-A-Lago there can't
be conversations between friends.
And Roger Ailes has successfully done this before.
So, you know, it seems a natural fit.
Its funny, when he got in the campaign last August,
all's he talked about was ratings.
It was all he talked about for like a month and a half.
And at that time I thought, "maybe he just is after
a career course correction."
Because he's done with The Apprentice
but all he talks about is ratings.
Maybe he wants a show, you know, maybe he wants
like a show on Fox or what I was thinking at the time,
not an independent network.
But it would be a natural play for him.
- He has really built his empire by
leveraging his brand to make profit.
And no better way to leverage to the Presidential race
after he loses, if he loses, than to create a network.
- Well, during the broadcast we noted that the speeches
at the Al Smith dinner were unusually stinging this year.
But there were some lines, to be fair,
that got big laughs.
- The media is even more biased this year than ever before.
Ever.
Michelle Obama gives a speech and everyone
loves it, it's fantastic.
My wife Melania gives the exact same speech
(laughs) and people get on her case.
- People say, and I hear them, I know.
They say I'm boring compared to Donald.
But I'm not boring at all.
In fact, I'm the life of every party I attend.
And I've been to three! (laughs)
- So, Jeanne, did either of them show that
they have what it takes to be the Comedian in Chief
for those times when we call upon
the President to make us laugh?
- Well, I think tone is important.
And knowing your audience is important.
And I don't think Donald met those standards very well.
I was a little surprised that Hillary Clinton
showed a little sense of timing, she seemed pretty relaxed.
She is up tight and that's just her way.
She does sweat the details, as she says.
So I think, you know, she did arguably better for the night.
But I don't think that's what many
voters will base their vote on.
- I went back to look at some of the reels
of the previous speeches to do a story for the
broadcast last night and was struck by
how funny George W. Bush was and Al Gore was.
And they talked at one another--
- [Pete] And Mitt Romney!
- And Mitt Romney certainly in 2012.
John McCain, very funny and self deprecating.
I think that's one thing that was
really missing from last night.
Not much self deprecation at all.
Really from either side but certainly
from Donald Trump's side and making fun of
Melania there, making her the butt of the joke.
- Well Hillary Clinton had the funny line about
how grateful they should all be because normally
she charges a lot of money to give speeches like this.
- Everybody made that trip there, I think.
Well, thank you all.
When you're online, check out the Washington Week
weekly news quiz to check your knowledge
of current events in the news.
That's, of course, at PBS.org/WashingtonWeek.
I'm Pete Williams for all of us here. Goodnight.
(smooth jazz music)