BACK.
BACK. AS
BACK. AS PARENTS WE ALL WANT TO PROTECT OUR CHILDREN FROM UGLY REALITIES AND AWARD WINNING
AUTHOR AND EDUCATOR DR.
JENNIFER HARVEY SAYS NOW IS
THE TIME TO TEACH RATHER THAN
SHIELD. SHE IS THE AUTHOR OF
RAISING WHITE KIDS BRINGING UP
CHILDREN IN RACIALLY UNJUST
AMERICA. DR. JENNIFER HARVEY
JOINS US LIVE NOW. DOCTOR,
WELCOME TO OUR SHOW. THANK YOU
SO MUCH FOR HAVING THIS
IMPORTANT CONVERSATION NOW. DR.
HARVEY IS AN AWARD WINNING
AUTHOR, EDUCATOR AND PUBLIC
SPEAKER. DOCTOR, YOUR WORK HAS
FOCUSED PRIMARILY ON RACIAL
JUSTICE AND WHITE ANTI-RACISM.
WHAT IS THE CONVERSATION WE
SHOULD BE HAVING WITH OUR
CHILDREN RIGHT NOW? WELL, I
BELIEVE THAT RAISING WHITE
CHILDREN NEED TO BE TALKING TO
OUR CHILDREN HONESTLY ABOUT
THE LEGACY'S POLICE BRUTALITY
AGAINST BLACK PEOPLE IN THIS
COUNTRY AND THE WAYS THAT BLACK
PEOPLE HAVE BEEN ORGANIZING FOR
DECADES TO TRY AND GET JUSTICE
AND TO MAKE SUCH VIOLENCE STOP
LOOKS DIFFERENT WITH DIFFERENT
AGES. BUT WE NEED TO BE HAVING
FRANK AND HONEST CONVERSATIONS
WITH THEM ABOUT WHAT'S GOING ON
AND WHY IT'S HAPPENING. SO MY
DAUGHTER IS THREE AND A HALF. I
WATCH HER. I KNOW SHE'S
COLORBLIND WHEN IT COMES TO
RACE. I SEE THE DOLL SHE PLAYS
WITH FOR HER BIRTHDAY. SHE'S
DRESSED AS PRINCESS TIANA. HOW
DO WE KEEP THAT COLOR BLIND
GOING? SHE'S THREE AND A HALF.
DO I HAVE CONVERSATION WITH HER
AT THIS AGE? SO YOU MIGHT BE
SURPRISED YOUR DAUGHTER
PROBABLY IS NOT ACTUALLY
COLORBLIND EVEN THOUGH IT MAY
APPEAR THAT WAY TO YOU AS AN
ADULT. WE HAVE COUNTLESS
STUDIES THAT SHOW BY THE AGES
OF 2, 3 AND 4 CHILDREN WE'RE
NOT ONLY RECOGNIZED DIFFERENCE
BUT BY FOUR THEY'RE STARTING TO
NOTICE THE WAY DIFFERENCES PLAY
OUT IN SOCIETY. AND SO I WOULD
ACTUALLY SAY YOU DON'T WANT TO
TRY AND KEEP HER COLORBLIND.
WHAT YOU WANT TO DO IS VALUE
AND ACKNOWLEDGE AND TALK ABOUT
DIFFERENCE WITH HER SO THAT AS
SHE BECOMES MORE AWARE OF
RACIAL INJUSTICE WHICH IS ALSO
IMPORTANT, RICHARD, THAT WE ARE
TEACHING OUR CHILDREN ABOUT
THOSE REALITIES THAT SHE CAN BE
BROUGHT ON BOARD IN
THE STRUGGLE FOR RACIAL JUSTICE
AND THE FLOURISHING OF ALL OF
US. SO I WOULD ENCOURAGE YOU TO
NAME DIFFERENCE WITH HER
BECAUSE IN FACT IT MIGHT LOOK
LIKE COLORBLINDNESS TO YOU BUT
NO STUDY BACKS UP THAT EVEN
THREE YEAR OLDS ARE ACTUALLY
COLORBLIND. THAT IS SO GOOD TO
KNOW. SO YOU SAY IT'S NEVER TOO
EARLY TO HAVE THAT CONVERSATION
ABOUT RACE. WHAT DOES THAT
CONVERSATION LOOK LIKE? WELL,
WE'RE VERY, VERY YOUNG CHILDREN
AND THIS IS ESPECIALLY WHERE
I'M REALLY TALKING ABOUT WHITE
FAMILIES BECAUSE BLACK FAMILIES
ARE ALWAYS HAVING THIS
CONVERSATION AND HAVE FOR
GENERATIONS BECAUSE THEY HAVE
NEEDED TO FOR THEIR CHILDREN'S
SURVIVAL. SO WHEN WHITE
FAMILIES OR THOSE OF PARENTING
WHITE CHILDREN YOUNG IT STOPS
IT LOOKS LIKE JUST NOTICING
DIFFERENCE NAMING IT. TALKING
ABOUT IT. TALKING ABOUT SKIN
TONES USING THE LANGUAGE OF
AFRICAN-AMERICAN AND WHITE AND
LATINO AND LATINA AND AS IF
BECAUSE WE WANT OUR KIDS TO
KNOW THAT'S NORMAL GOOD THING
TO DO AND THEN VERY EARLY WE
START INVOLVING THEM AS WE GO
IN SPACES WHERE PEOPLE ARE
WORKING FOR RACIAL JUSTICE. WE
NEED TO BRING THEM INTO THAT
WORK EVEN IF THEIR LANGUAGE
DOESN'T YET KNOW WHAT HOW TO
UNDERSTAND WHAT'S GOING ON SO
THAT WE EARLY HELP THEM
UNDERSTAND THAT LIKE
AFRICAN-AMERICAN FAMILIES LIKE
LATIN X FAMILIES THEY TOO CAN
BE PART OF CREATING A MORE
RACIALLY JUST AMERICA. WE NEED
EVERYBODY IN THIS STRUGGLE AND
WHITE CHILDREN IN PARTICULAR
WHO ARE NOT GETTING THAT RIGHT
NOW. THOSE OF US WHO ARE
PARENTS CAN GIVE IT TO THEM AND
WE HAVE A MORAL RESPONSIBILITY
TO DO SO AND WE CAN. SO I'M
DOING SOMETHING RIGHT BECAUSE I
HAVE TAUGHT HER TO SAY I AM
LATINA. SHE KNOWS THAT. SHE
SAYS I AM LATINA. SO YOU SAY
IT'S OUR MORAL RESPONSIBILITY
TO RAISE A GENERATION OF
ANTI-RACIST CHILDREN, COMMITTED
WHITE CHILDREN AND WE BASICALLY
YOU SAY COMMIT TO THIS. WE CAN
WE CAN. WE CAN. I MEAN FOR
THOSE OF US THAT ARE WHITE,
IT'S IT'S A PIVOT BECAUSE MOST
OF US WERE RAISED IF NOT AN
EXPLICITLY RACIST HOUSEHOLD
RIGHT WHERE WE WERE TAUGHT THAT
WE WERE RAISED BEING TOLD WELL
WE'RE ALL EQUAL AND WE DON'T
REALLY NEED TO SEE DIFFERENCE.
AND SO WE'VE GOT TO INTERRUPT
AND RADICALLY RE LEARN A
LANGUAGE THAT WAS NOT GENERALLY
TAUGHT TO US. BUT IF WE START
TO DO IT WE REALIZE OH PART OF
LEARNING TO DO IT IS JUST DOING
IT. WHEN I MAKE MISTAKES I CAN
CORRECT THEM. I CAN REVISIT
WITH MY CHILD I CAN COME BACK
TO IT AND THERE'S ALL KINDS OF
RESOURCES OUT THERE. AND SO WE
CAN DO IT. WE CAN CHANGE
THE WAY OUR CHILDREN EXPERIENCE
AND UNDERSTAND RACE SO THAT MY
KIDS ARE DOING NOW WHAT I
DIDN'T LEARN TO DO UNTIL MY 20S
AND YOUR BOOK ADDRESSES THAT.
IT DOES ADDRESS THAT IN SOME
VERY CONCRETE SPECIFIC WAYS.
TALKING ABOUT RACE, TALKING
ABOUT RACISM AND TALKING ABOUT
AND MODELING ANTI-RACISM. SO IF
PEOPLE WHO ARE WATCHING OUR
SHOW WANT TO START SOMEWHERE,
THEY CAN JUST PICK UP YOUR
BOOK, RIGHT? I THINK THAT WOULD
BE A GREAT PLACE TO START.
THERE'S ALSO INCREDIBLE
AFRICAN-AMERICAN AUTHORS WHO
HAVE WRITTEN ABOUT THIS GENRE
OR LUO HER BOOK. SO YOU WANT TO
TALK ABOUT RACE IS A GREAT ONE
FOR ADULTS. AND DR. BEVERLY
DANIEL TATUM HAS BEEN WRITING
ABOUT THIS FOR DECADES. HER
BOOK WHY ARE ALL THE BLACK KIDS
SITTING TOGETHER IN
THE CAFETERIA IS A MUST READ
FOR ALL PARENTS WHITE KIDS AS
WELL. YOU'VE REALLY FOCUSED
YOUR LIFE'S WORK ON THIS.
YOU'VE BEEN DOING THIS FOR
ABOUT MORE THAN 20 YEARS. YOU
SAID I HAVE, YES. WELL, THANK
YOU SO MUCH. THANK YOU. DR.
JENNIFER HARVEY FOR JOINING US
THIS MORNING FOR HAVING THIS
VERY IMPORTANT