TO GET TO THE BOTTOM OF. >> HANS NICHOLS, I KNOW YOU’RE
CONTINUING TO DO REPORTING ON
THIS.
THIS. IN THE MEANTIME I WANT TO BRING
IN ALEXI McCAMMOND AND HOWARD
DEAN, MSNBC CONTRIBUTOR.
ALEXI, IT’S BEEN POINTED OUT FOR
A VERY LONG TIME THAT IF THE
PRESIDENT WANTED TO MAKE A
CHANGE, HE COULD GET SOMEONE AND
IT SEEMS LIKE HE IS WHO CAN DO
ALL THE THINGS THAT SCOTT PRUITT
WAS DOING IN TERMS OF
DISMANTLING REGULATIONS AT THE E
EPA AND NOT HAVE THIS AS A
DISTRACTION.
DISTRACTION. SO AGAIN I GO TO THE QUESTION
WHY NOW?
WHY NOW? IS IT BECAUSE HE WAS MAKING
DONALD TRUMP LOOK BAD?
IS IT BECAUSE THERE’S A NEW
COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR?
COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR? IS THE PRESSURE FINALLY
BUILDING?
BUILDING? BECAUSE WHEN YOU HAVE SOMEBODY
LIKE TREY GOWDY WHO HAS BEEN SO
MUCH IN THE PRESIDENT’S POCKET
SAYING SOMETHING IS WRONG HERE,
LAURA INGRAHAM SAYING GET RID OF
THIS GUY, IT JUST BECAME
UNTENABLE?
UNTENABLE? >> WELL, I THINK IF WE LOOK TO
SCOTT PRUITT’S RESIGNATION LATER
AND GET PAST THE SNARK IN THERE
WHERE HE’S BLAMING THE MEDIA
SAYING THE MEDIA HAS BEEN
UNFAIRLY ATTACKING HIM, THAT
SORT OF SIGNALS PERHAPS WHY NOW.
MAYBE SCOTT PRUITT AND THE
PRESIDENT HAVE SEEN THAT THEY
THINK THE MEDIA IS DOING TOO
GOOD OF A JOB BY REPORTING ON
THESE SCANDALS.
THESE SCANDALS. WE CAN LOOK BACK TO FEBRUARY OF
2017 WHEN SCOTT PRUITT WAS GOING
THROUGH HIS CONFIRMATION HEARING
AND DEMOCRATS ON THE HILL WERE
SAYING -- SENATOR WHITEHOUSE WAS
SAYING MY REPUBLICAN FRIENDS ARE
GOING TO RUE THE DAY WHEN THEY
JAMMED THROUGH THIS NOMINATION
OF SCOTT PRUITT BECAUSE THEY HAD
CONCERNS ABOUT HIS CONNECTIONS
TO OIL COMPANIES BACK THEN.
THEY HAD CONCERNS ABOUT
POTENTIAL CONTROVERSIES THAT
HADN’T COME UP BACK THEN AND
THAT WAS LAST FEBRUARY.
I THINK NOW WE’RE SORT OF SEEING
THE TROUBLING, THE MOUNTING
SCANDALS AND CONTROVERSIES
COMING FROM SCOTT PRUITT IN A
WAY THAT NOT ONLY WAS A
DISTRACTION FOR THE PRESIDENT
BUT A DISTRACTION FOR ALL THE
THINGS THAT THE EPA WAS MOVING
FORWARD ON THAT THE PRESIDENT IS
HAPPY ABOUT.
HAPPY ABOUT. AS YOU MENTIONED, HE’LL BE ABLE
TO DO THAT WITH THE NEXT MAN
WITHOUT ALL OF THESE
DISTRACTIONS BOTHERING HIM.
>> HOWARD, I WANT TO READ FROM
THIS TEXT OF A RESIGNATION
LETTER FROM SCOTT PRUITT AND
THIS IS WHAT I THINK WE’LL HEAR
THE MOST ABOUT.
HE SAYS IT WAS DIFFICULT FOR ME
TO SEE SERVING YOU IN THIS ROLE
BECAUSE I COUNTED AS A BLESSING
SERVING YOU IN ANY CAPACITY, BUT
ALSO BECAUSE OF THE
TRANSFORMATIVE WORK THAT IS
OCCURRING.
OCCURRING. HOWEVER, THE UNRELENTING ATTACKS
ON ME PERSONALLY, MY FAMILY, ARE
UNPRECEDENTED AND HAVE TAKEN A
SIZEABLE TOLL ON ALL OF US.
WHAT’S YOUR TAKE ON SCOTT PRUITT
BEING GONE?
BEING GONE? >> WELL, HE ACTUALLY HAS A LOT
IN COMMON WITH TRUMP.
NOT ONLY ARE THEY BOTH CROOKED,
BUT THEY ALSO HAVE AN INCREDIBLE
TENAIR ABOUT WHETHER PEOPLE
NOTICE THIS OR NOT.
THE STUFF PRUITT WAS DOING WAS
STUNNING AND HE EVIDENTLY DIDN’T
CARE.
CARE. >> HE ALSO FOUND THAT HE KEPT
GETTING AWAY WITH IT OVER AND
OVER AND OVER AGAIN, WHEN IT
BECAME 5 AND THEN 10 AND THEN 12
DIFFERENT INVESTIGATIONS GOING
ON.
ON. >> HE DID, BECAUSE OF COURSE THE
REPUBLICANS ARE COMPLETELY --
WHO RUN BOTH HOUSES OF CONGRESS,
HAVE NO -- THEY DON’T SERVE THE
COUNTRY, THEY SERVE TRUMP.
SO THEY WEREN’T -- THEY WERE
RELUCK TANGTKCTANT
RELUCK TANGTKCTANT RELUCTANT.
RELUCTANT. SCOTT PRUITT IS A CROOK.
HE’S COST TAXPAYERS MILLIONS AND
MILLIONS OF DOLLARS.
>> WHAT DO YOU THINK THE CHANCES
OF THAT ARE?
IS THIS OVER?
HE RESIGNS AND IT’S OVER OR DO
YOU THINK THERE’S LEGAL JEOPARDY
FOR HIM?
FOR HIM? >> I THINK THERE’S LEGAL
JEOPARDY.
JEOPARDY. THERE’S CERTAINLY LEGAL
JEOPARDY.
JEOPARDY. DOES A POLITICIZED JUSTICE
DEPARTMENT FOLLOW UP OR WILL
THERE BE AN INDEPENDENT
INVESTIGATION OF SOME KIND?
THERE COULD HAVE.
HE’S DAMAGED THIS COUNTRY
ENORMOUSLY.
ENORMOUSLY. HE’S JUST BEEN SO BLATANT ABOUT
HIS DISREGARD FOR THE LAW, AS
TRUMP IS AS WELL.
SO I THINK TRUMP -- I THINK WHAT
REALLY HAPPENED IS THAT HE
SHOULD HAVE BEEN FIRED IN.
IN A NORMAL ADMINISTRATION HE
WOULDN’T HAVE BEEN APPOINTED.
BUT EVEN IN THIS ADMINISTRATION
HE SHOULD HAVE BEEN FIRED MONTHS
AGO BUT HE SEES HIMSELF IN
PRUITT.
PRUITT. HE LIKES THE SWASH BUCKLING,
TAKE WHAT THE HELL YOU WANT AND
WHO GIVES A DAMN WHAT THE PUBLIC
SAYS.
SAYS. THEY’RE BOTH A GREAT VICTIMS
PLAYER.
PLAYER. THEY CAUSE THEMSELVES TROUBLE
AND THEN BLAME SOMEBODY ELSE.
>> THERE WAS ALSO THE WHOLE
QUESTION RAISED BY HANS NICHOLS
WHICH HAS TO DO WITH WHETHER OR
NOT THIS IS ABOUT JUST A NEW
COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR, BILL
SHINE, COMING IN AND SAYING, YOU
KNOW WHAT, WE’VE GOT OTHER STUFF
THAT WE NEED TO BE WORRIED
ABOUT, LET’S START WITH THE
SUPREME COURT.
SUPREME COURT. LET’S START WITH THE MIDTERM
ELECTIONS.
ELECTIONS. WE CAN’T BE DEALING WITH THIS.
I WONDERING IF THIS IS ANYTHING
INDICATIVE OF THE WAY THE WHITE
HOUSE IS GOING TO BE LOOKING AT
THINGS.
THINGS. YOU OBVIOUSLY HAVE HAD ETHICAL
QUESTIONS RAISED ABOUT RYAN
ZINKE, ABOUT BEN CARLSON.
YOU COULD ALSO ARGUE THAT
COMPARED TO SCOTT PRUITT THEY
WERE AMATEUR HOUR, BUT DOES THIS
BODE FOR SOMETHING ELSE THAT
MIGHT HAPPEN IN THE FUTURE?
>> I THINK THAT WOULD BE A
SIGNAL OF BILL SHINE HAVING AN
IMMENSE AMOUNT OF POWER ON I
GUESS HIS FIRST OFFICIAL DAY,
MAYBE HIS FOURTH OFFICIAL DAY
THIS WEEK.
THIS WEEK. I WOULDN’T PUT IT PAST HIM AND
THE ADMINISTRATION TO MAKE THAT
HAPPEN.
HAPPEN. I THINK THE MIDTERM ELECTION
ANGINA ’EM IS SIGNIFICANT.
GOVERNOR HOWARD DEAN JUST
MENTIONED THIS A LITTLE BIT.
IF DEMOCRATS TAKE BACK THE HOUSE
OR THE SENATE, EITHER CHAMBER OF
CONGRESS, IT WILL BE A LOT
HARDER FOR THE HEAD OF THE EPA
TO MOVE FORWARD ON DISMANTLING
THE OBAMA ADMINISTRATION’S
ENVIRONMENTAL AGENDA BECAUSE
THERE WILL BE MORE CONGRESSIONAL
OVERSIGHT FROM DEMOCRATS.
THERE ARE MOUNTING CONTROVERSIES
HAPPENING WITHIN THE
ADMINISTRATION FROM THE TOP DOWN
THAT ARE EASILY BECOMING A
DISTRACTION AHEAD OF THE
NOVEMBER ELECTION.
NOVEMBER ELECTION. SCOTT PRUITT IS MAYBE VIEWED,
NOW WE’RE SAYING TODAY, AS
SOMETHING THAT IS NOT WORTH IT,
A DISTRACTION THAT IS NOT WORTH
IT WHEN REPUBLICANS ARE HEADING
INTO THIS VERY COMPETITIVE
ELECTION IN JUST A FEW WEEKS.
>> HOWARD, DOES IT TAKE, THOUGH,
SOMETHING AWAY FROM THE
DEMOCRATS?
DEMOCRATS? ARE REPUBLICANS BREATHING A SIGH
OF RELIEF?
OF RELIEF? THEY DIDN’T WANT TO HAVE TO KEEP
ANSWERING QUESTIONS ON THE
CAMPAIGN TRAIL ABOUT THE
PRESIDENT’S PROMISE TO DRAIN THE
SWAMP?
SWAMP? >> ANYBODY WHO THINKS THAT SCOTT
PRUITT IS NOT GOING TO PLAY A
PROMINENT ROLE IN ADS IN
NOVEMBER IS VERY MISTAKEN.
YOU’LL SEE ZINKE, YOU’LL SEE
PRUITT, THERE WILL BE A WHOLE
LOT OF PEOPLE.
YOU’LL SEE BILL SHINE.
THAT’S THE MOST AMAZING THING TO
ME.
ME. IF THE THEORY SHINE DID THIS,
SHINE GOES INTO THE WHITE HOUSE
WITH ETHICS PROBLEMS BECAUSE HE
WAS INVOLVED IN THE PAYOFFS AT
FOX NEWS FOR THE SEXUAL ASSAULT
STUFF.
STUFF. SO, LOOK, TRUMP HIRES PEOPLE
LIKE HIMSELF.
LIKE HIMSELF. THIS IS A SCANDAL-RIDDEN
ORGANIZATION.
ORGANIZATION. AS I ONCE SAID IT BASICALLY IS
AN ORGANIZED CRIME RING RUN OUT
OF THE WHITE HOUSE.
THAT’S WHAT IT IS AND THAT’S
WHAT YOU’RE GOING TO SEE.
SCOTT PRUITT IS NOT GOING AWAY
AS FAR AS THE DEMOCRATS ARE
CONCERNED.
CONCERNED. HE’LL BE WITH US UNTIL ELECTION
DAY.
DAY. >> I GUESS THE QUESTION IS WHAT
DO THE DEMOCRATS DO ABOUT THIS
BESIDES RUN ADS ON IT?
IS IT REALLY SOMETHING THAT’S
GOING TO HAVE ANY KIND OF REAL
IMPLICATIONS?
IMPLICATIONS? OR ARE PEOPLE JUST SORT OF
SLUGGING ANDSHRUG
SLUGGING ANDSHRUG SHRUGING AND SAYING, YEAH, YOU
REPLACE SOMEBODY WHO WANTS TO
DISMANTLE EVERYTHING THE OBAMA
ADMINISTRATION DID WITH THE
ENVIRONMENT AND YOU REPLACE IT
AND LET’S SAY THEY KEEP THE
DEPUTY IN, HE’S GOT 200 DAYS
BEFORE HE WOULD HAVE TO BE
FORMALLY NOMINATED.
FORMALLY NOMINATED. EVEN IF HE DIDN’T MAKE IT
THROUGH HE COULD STAY ANOTHER
210 DAYS.
210 DAYS. THE PRESIDENT CAN KEEP THIS
GOING WELL PAST.
AND SO IS IT REALLY A VICTORY
FOR DEMOCRATS WHEN YOU HAVE
SOMEBODY WHO IS ARGUABLY AT
LEAST AS BAD FOR THE ENVIRONMENT
AS SCOTT PRUITT WAS, AND SOME
PEOPLE MIGHT ARGUE SOMEBODY WHO
EVEN HAS MAYBE A WORSE
ENVIRONMENTAL RECORD OR
BACKGROUND THAN SCOTT PRUITT?
>> THE PUBLIC WAS NEVER -- I’M
SORRY, WHO ARE YOU ASKING?
>> GO AHEAD, HOWARD.
>> THE PUBLIC WAS NEVER GOING TO
VOTE ON WHETHER SCOTT PRUITT WAS
GOOD OR BAD FOR THE ENVIRONMENT.
THEY DON’T GENERALLY DO THAT.
THERE ARE PEOPLE THAT VOTE THE
ENVIRONMENT, BUT NOT MANY.
WHAT THE PUBLIC IN GENERAL, BOTH
REPUBLICANS AND DEMOCRATS OBJECT
TO IS CORRUPTION IN GOVERNMENT.
THAT’S WHY TRUMP’S NUMBERS ARE
UNDERWATER.
UNDERWATER. IT’S NOT EVEN HIS INCOMPETENCE,
WHICH HE IS, IT’S HIS CORRUPTION
THAT’S REALLY UPSET PEOPLE.
SO THIS IS NOT A VICTORY FOR THE
DEMOCRATS TO GET PRUITT OUT OF
THERE, THIS IS A VICTORY FOR THE
COUNTRY THAT’S LONG OVERDUE.
IF THE REPUBLICANS IN CONGRESS
HAD BEEN DOING THEIR JOBS, HE’D
HAVE BEEN GONE A LONG TIME AGO.
YOU DON’T THINK IF MITCH
McCONNELL AND PAUL RYAN WENT TO
TRUMP AND SAID YOU’VE GOT TO
FIRE THIS GUY, WE CAN’T SUPPORT
HIS AGENDA, HE’D HAVE BEEN FIRED
RIGHT THERE.
RIGHT THERE. THE ISSUE FOR THE FALL IS THAT
DONALD TRUMP HAS DISGRACED THE
OFFICE OF THE PRESIDENCY AND
THESE ARE JUST GOING TO BE
EXAMPLES OF THE INSIDIOUS
CORRUPTION.
CORRUPTION. THERE WILL BE PLENTY MORE
BETWEEN NOW AND THEN.
>> ALEXI, WHAT DO YOU THINK?
HOW MUCH ARE THE REPUBLICANS
GOING TO HAVE TO ANSWER FOR
SCOTT PRUITT ON THE CAMPAIGN
TRAIL?
TRAIL? >> I THINK AS LONG AS DEMOCRATS
FOLD THIS IN THE CORRUPTION
ANGLE, THEY WILL HAVE TO ANSWER
FOR HIM AND WE’VE SEEN THAT
ALREADY IN THE "A BETTER DEAL"
PLATFORM DEMOCRATS HAVE ROLLED
OUT.
OUT. CORRUPTION IS A BIG PART OF THAT
AND THAT EXTENDS TO SCOTT
PRUITT, RYAN ZINKE, BEN CARLSON,
THE MUELLER INVESTIGATION,
STORMY DANIELS.
STORMY DANIELS. YOU SEE IT BEING USED BY NANCY
PELOSI, CHUCK SCHUMER, TOM
STEYER IN CALIFORNIA IN HIS
IMPEACHMENT CAMPAIGN AND ADS
ASSOCIATED WITH THAT.
SO I THINK THE LARGER CORRUPTION
SCANDAL AND SORT OF PICTURE YOU
CAN DRAW FOR VOTERS, THE MORE
REPUBLICANS WILL HAVE TO ANSWER
FOR IT AND THE MORE DEMOCRATS
WILL BE ABLE TO USE THAT FOR