WITH SPANISH NAMES TRYING TO ENTER THIS COUNTRY.
WE WILL COVER THAT LATER IN THIS
HOUR.
HOUR. WE BEGIN TONIGHT WITH THE
CONTINUING STRUGGLE FOR
DEMOCRACY, AND FREEDOM AROUND
THE WORLD, A STRUGGLE THAT DOES
NOT HAVE THE SUPPORT OF THE
PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES.
TONIGHT, ORDER HAS BEEN RESTORED
AT THE AIRPORT IN HONG KONG, AND
MOST FLIGHTS SEEM TO BE RUNNING
CLOSE TO SCHEDULE AFTER THIS
WEEK’S HONG KONG’S AIRPORT
BECAME THE SCENE OF WHAT MAY BE
THE MOST IMPORTANT AND DANGEROUS
PROTESTS OF CHINA SINCE THE
UPRISING IN BAY
UPRISING
UPRISING UPRISING IN BEIJING AND
TIANANMEN SQUARE, KILLING AN
UNKNOWN NUMBER OF PROTESTERS,
MOSTLY STUDENTS.
MOSTLY STUDENTS. AT THAT TIME, HONG KONG WAS NOT
YET OFFICIALLY A PART OF THE
PEOPLE’S REPUBLIC OF CHINA.
THE BRITISH GOVERNMENT FORMALLY
SURRENDERED ITS CONTROL OF HONG
KONG TO CHINA IN 1977.
CHINA PROMISED HONG KONG THE
LIBERTIES ENJOYED THERE WOULD
NOT BE CURTAILED BUT A
TOALTARIAN
TOALTARIAN TOTALITARIAN REGIME WAS BOUND TO
EVENTUALLY PRODUCE A CULTURE
COLLISION WHICH IT NOW MOST
CERTAINLY HAS.
CERTAINLY HAS. THE WORLD IS ON EDGE AS THE HONG
KONG CRISIS UNFOLDS AND NOT
SURPRISINGLY, DONALD TRUMP HAS
NO IDEA WHAT TO SAY OR WHO HE IS
ROOTING FOR, OR EVEN IF HE
SHOULD BE ROOTING FOR ANYONE IN
HONG KONG, AND SO HE SAYS THE
MOST INANE THINGS EVER SPOKEN BY
AN AMERICAN PRESIDENT IN A
CRISIS LIKE THIS, SHOUTING TO
REPORTERS OVER THE USUAL
HELICOPTER NOISE IN THE
BACKGROUND, I’M SURE IT WILL
WORK OUT.
WORK OUT. I HOPE IT WORKS OUT FOR
EVERYBODY, INCLUDING CHINA, BY
THE WAY.
THE WAY. AS AN AFTER THOUGHT, THE
PRESIDENT SAID, I HOPE NOBODY
GETS KILLED.
GETS KILLED. IN RUSSIA, PROTESTS OF A SIMILAR
SPIRIT HAVE BEEN JOINED BY TENS
OF THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE
PROTESTING IN MOSCOW.
LAST WEEKEND, THE FIFTH WEEKEND
THAT RUSSIANS HAVE RALLIED TO
DEMAND FAIR ELECTIONS,
TRANSPARENT ELECTIONS.
TRANSPARENT ELECTIONS. THE RUSSIAN PROCESS HAVE GOTTEN
LARGER BY THE WEEKEND.
ESTIMATES PUT LAST WEEKEND’S
CROWDS AT 50,000 PROTESTERS
AGAINST VLADIMIR PUTIN’S REGIME.
THE RUSSIAN PROTESTS IN FAVOR OF
FAIR ELECTION PROCESSES GO TO
THE VERY HEART OF THE OPERATING
PRINCIPLE OF THE RUSSIAN
GOVERNMENT WHICH IS THE OPPOSITE
OF TRANSPARENCY.
OF TRANSPARENCY. CRAIG MASON’S BRILLIANT
FIVE-PART HBO DRAMATIZATION OF
THE RUSSIAN NUCLEAR ACCIDENT AT
CHERNOBYL SHOWS THE
ANTI-TRANSPARENCY SYSTEM IN
ACTION, AND WE ARE NOW POSSIBLY
SEEING IT AGAIN IN REALTIME IN
THE AFTER MATH OF ANOTHER
NUCLEAR ACCIDENT IN NORTHERN
RUSSIA.
RUSSIA. TODAY, RUSSIA AUTHORITIES
ANNOUNCED THE EVACUATION OF THE
VILLAGE NEAREST TO THE SITE OF
THAT NUCLEAR ACCIDENT WHICH LAST
WEEK KILLED SEVEN PEOPLE AND
RELEASED RADIATION, APPARENTLY,
WHEN A SMALL NUCLEAR REACTOR
MALFUNCTIONED DURING THE TEST OF
A NEW TYPE OF MISSILE NEAR A
NAVAL WEAPONS TESTING SITE.
"THE NEW YORK TIMES" REPORTS
RUSSIAN OFFICIALS HAVE RELEASED
A FLURRY OF MISLEADING OR
INCOMPLETE STATEMENTS PLAYING
DOWN THE SEVERITY OF THE
ACCIDENT WHICH THE MILITARY
FIRST REPORTED ON THURSDAY AS A
FIRE INVOLVING A LIQUID FUEL
ROCKET ENGINE.
ROCKET ENGINE. IT WAS NOT UNTIL SUNDAY THAT
RUSSIAN SCIENTISTS CONCEDED THAT
A REACTOR HAD RELEASED RADIATION
DURING A TEST ON AN OFFSHORE
PLATFORM IN THE WHITE SEA.
THAT PATTERN OF MURKINESS
CONTINUED ON TUESDAY AS NEWS
REPORTS AND OFFICIAL STATEMENTS
OFFERED ONLY THE VAGUEST
EXPLANATION FOR EVACUATION, AND
HOURS LATER SEEMED TO INDICATE
THAT IT HAD BEEN CALLED OFF.
THE PRESIDENT COMMENTED ON THE
SITUATION YESTERDAY IN A TWEET
THAT SEEMS TO HAVE BEEN WRITTEN
FOR HIM BY HIS STAFF.
THE UNITED STATES IS LEARNING
MUCH FROM THE FAILED MISSILE
EXPLOSION IN RUSSIA.
WE HAVE SIMILAR, THOUGH MORE
ADVANCED TECHNOLOGY.
ADVANCED TECHNOLOGY. THE RUSSIAN SKY FALL EXPLOSION
HAS PEOPLE WORRIED ABOUT THE AIR
AROUND THE FACILITY AND FAR
BEYOND NOT GOOD.
PRESIDENT TRUMP HAS HAD
ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO SAY ABOUT
THE RUSSIAN PROTESTS FOR FAIR
ELECTIONS.
ELECTIONS. HE DID NOT EVEN BOTHER TO SAY I
HOPE IT WORKS OUT FOR EVERYBODY.
LEADING OFF OUR DISCUSSION
TONIGHT, OUR FORMER U.S.
AMBASSADOR TO RUSSIA, MICHAEL
McFALL, AN MSNBC NATIONAL
SECURITY ANALYST, AND WENDY
SHERMAN, AND AN MSNBC GLOBAL
AFFAIRS CONTRIBUTOR, AND WENDY
SHERMAN, I WANT TO START WITH
YOU ON THE SITUATION IN HONG
KONG.
KONG. THE PRESIDENT HAS SAID NOTHING
AND YET BY SAYING NOTHING HAS
SAID EVERYTHING IN THAT HE IS
SUPPORTING, HE IS NOT IN ANY WAY
SUPPORTING THE PROTESTS FOR
FREEDOM AND INDEPENDENCE FROM
THE CHINESE REGIME IN HONG KONG.
>> IT’S REALLY QUITE
EXTRAORDINARY, LAWRENCE, WE ARE
SEEING SIGNS OF DEMOCRACY IN
RUSSIA, SIGNS OF DEMOCRACY HERE
IN HONG KONG, SIGNS OF
DEMOCRACY, OF PEOPLE TRYING TO
GET RID OF MADURO IN VENEZUELA.
WE ARE SEEING ALL KINDS OF
THINGS HAPPENING AROUND THE
WORLD, AND YET THE PRESIDENT
DOESN’T EM BASEBRACE THE UNIVERS
DECLARATION OF HUMAN RIGHTS, THE
AGREEMENT MADE IN THE HANDOVER
OF HONG KONG BY THE UNITED
KINGDOM TO CHINA THAT CREATED
ONE CHINA, BUT TWO SYSTEMS, SO
THAT THE PEOPLE OF HONG KONG
COULD HAVE A QUASI DEMOCRACY AT
LEAST UNTIL 2047, AND IT IS
REALLY DISMAYING AND IT’S QUITE
EXTRAORDINARY BECAUSE EVEN MITCH
McCONNELL OF WHOM I AM NOT A
FAN, HE STOPS EVERY GOOD THING
THAT COULD HAPPEN IN THE UNITED
STATES SENATE FOR THE AMERICAN
PEOPLE, EVEN HE SAID THE WORLD
IS WATCHING, AND THAT CHINA
SHOULD BE CAREFUL.
OF COURSE, CHINA, AGAIN, TODAY,
BECAUSE IT’S TODAY ALREADY IN
CHINA, IS SAYING THE U.S. SHOULD
BUG OUT.
BUG OUT. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS.
IT’S AN INTERNAL AFFAIR, AND
THEY THINK THEY HAVE A GREEN
LIGHT FROM THE PRESIDENT OF THE
UNITED STATES.
UNITED STATES. >> JOE BIDEN TWEETED TODAY THE
BRAVE PROTESTERS IN HONG KONG
ARE DEMANDING THE RIGHTS AND
FREEDOMS PROMISED TO THEM.
THE U.S. SHOULD BE LEADING THE
FREE WORLD TO RALLY SUPPORT
BEHIND THEM AND WITH ONE DEVICE
DEFEND OUR SHARED DEMOCRATIC
IDEALS AND THE DESIRE FOR
LIBERTY THAT BEATS IN EVERY
HEART AND AMBASSADOR McFALL,
THAT’S THE WAY PRESIDENTS IN
THIS COUNTRY USED TO SOUND.
>> THAT’S RIGHT.
AND I THINK WHEN THE HISTORY OF
THE TRUMP ERA IS WRITTEN, THERE
WILL BE TWO DISTINGUISHING
FEATURES ABOUT HIS FOREIGN
POLICY, ONE, THE WITHDRAWAL
DOCTRINE, HE WITHDRAWS FROM ALL
KINDS OF AGREEMENTS AND TWO, HE
IS DEMONSTRATED A CONSISTENCY IN
NOT CARING ABOUT DEMOCRACY AND
HUMAN RIGHTS ON ALMOST EVERY
COUNTRY IN THE WORLD THAT WENDY
JUST MENTIONED, HE SAID NEXT TO
NOTHING, AND ON HONG KONG, HE
LOOKED AT HIS TWITTER FEED
COMING ON, IT’S CLEAR HE’S
CONFUSED.
CONFUSED. HE’S RE-TWEETING, THE
DEMONSTRATION VIDEOS, AND SAYING
EVERYBODY WILL BE SAFE.
WHO IS HE REFERRING TO, TO THE
PROTESTERS, BECAUSE THEY MOST
CERTAINLY DON’T FEEL SAFE RIGHT
NOW AS THE CHINESE MILITARY IS
MASSING ON THE BORDERS NEXT TO
HONG KONG.
HONG KONG. >> KAMALA HARRIS IS ALSO
TWEETED, I STAND WITH THE
PROTESTERS IN HONG KONG AS HAVE
OTHER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATES.
LET’S LISTEN TO WHAT GORDON
CHANG HAS SAID ABOUT THIS.
>> THAT LANGUAGE I THOUGHT WAS
INAPPROPRIATE ON THE PART OF THE
PRESIDENT.
PRESIDENT. THIS IS NOT JUST A DISPUTE
BETWEEN HONG KONG AND CHINA.
CHINA IS ATTACKING FREEDOM AND
DEMOCRACY, INCLUDING OURS,
ACROSS THE BOARD, AND THIS IS
THE FRONT LINE OF FREEDOM IN
HONG KONG.
HONG KONG. WE NEED A RINGING DECLARATION
FROM THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED
STATES WHICH SAYS THAT,
ESSENTIALLY IF CHINA USES FORCE
IN HONG KONG, IT WILL RESULT IN
THE MOST SEVERE SANCTIONS THAT
THE UNITED STATES PARTNERS AND
FRIENDS WILL IMPOSE ON THE
CHINESE.
CHINESE. WE NEED TO STOP THIS.
THIS IS A LEADER OF THE FREE
WORLD.
WORLD. THIS IS NOT JUST SOME -- ANOTHER
COUNTRY.
COUNTRY. >> AND WENDY, PRESIDENT TRUMP IS
BEHAVING IN THE WEAKEST POSSIBLE
WAY THAT WE HAVE EVER SEEN A
PRESIDENT IN A SITUATION LIKE
THIS.
THIS. THIS IS THE SAME GUY WHO TRIES
TO PRETEND THAT HE PLAYS TOUGH
WITH CHINA.
WITH CHINA. >> WITHOUT A DOUBT.
THERE IS NO CHINA POLICY.
THERE IS NO CHINA STRATEGY.
THERE’S A TRADE STRATEGY.
FOR THE PRESIDENT, EVERYTHING IS
A COMMERCIAL TRANSACTION.
IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH
EMPATHY.
EMPATHY. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH
PEOPLE.
PEOPLE. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HUMAN
RIGHTS, DIGNITY, DEMOCRACY,
FREEDOM, AND TO A STORY YOU’RE
GOING TO GET TO LATER TONIGHT,
WE HAVE KEN CUCCINELLI STANDING
UP AND SAYING THAT THE STATUE OF
LIBERTY SHOULD STAY GIVE ME YOUR
TIRED, YOUR POOR, AND PEOPLE WHO
CAN STAND ON THEIR OWN 2 FEET,
AND WHEN PRESSED, HE SAID THE
STATUE OF LIBERTY WAS PUT UP
WHEN PEOPLE WERE COMING FROM
EUROPE.
EUROPE. THIS IS AN ADMINISTRATION THAT
IS COMPLETELY CORRUPT,
COMPLETELY WITHOUT A SENSE OF
WHAT DIGNITY, FREEDOM, AND TO
USE THE PRESIDENT’S OWN WORD,
LIBERTY IS REALLY ABOUT.
>> AND AMBASSADOR McFALL, THE
PROTESTS IN RUSSIA COULD BE
PROTESTS IN THE UNITED STATES
FOR FAIR ELECTIONS AND FOR
TRARNS
TRARNS TRANSPARENCY.
TRANSPARENCY. WE SAW STACEY ABRAMS WITH RICHAC
MADDOW.
MADDOW. WE’RE GOING TO BE TALKING ABOUT
THAT LATER THIS HOUR, BUT THERE
SEEMS TO BE A CONNECTION BETWEEN
WHAT WE’RE SEEING IN HONG KONG,
WHAT WE’RE SEEING IN RUSSIA.
>> THERE ARE PEOPLE STANDING UP
FOR CIVIL LIBERTIES.
THEY’RE DIFFERENT CASES, RIGHT,
BECAUSE IN RUSSIA WHAT HAPPENED
THERE WAS PEOPLE HAD GOT THE
PETITIONS IN PLACE TO BE ON THE
BALLOT, AND THEY WERE DENIED,
AND SO THEY’RE STANDING UP TO
SAY, HEY, WE WANT OUR
REPRESENTATIVES TO BE ON THE
BALLOT BUT IN BOTH CASES THEY’RE
FACING AUTOCRATIC REGIMES
CRACKING DOWN.
CRACKING DOWN. PEOPLE ARE STANDING UP, YOU
KNOW, IN A VERY VIGILANT WAY, IN
A VERY BRAVE WAY AND WE SHOULD
BE STANDING UP WITH THEM.
AT A MINIMUM, I HOPE TRUMP
ADMINISTRATION IS SENDING THE
SIGNALS, ESPECIALLY TO THE
CHINESE AUTHORITIES OF THE
DANGEROUS CONSEQUENCES OF TAKING
MILITARY ACTION AT HONG KONG,
BECAUSE THAT WILL TRIGGER NOT
JUST PROBLEMS WITH DEMOCRACY AND
HUMAN RIGHTS, BUT THERE WILL BE
MAJOR NEGATIVE ECONOMIC
CONSEQUENCES NOT ONLY FOR CHINA
BUT THE WORLD ECONOMY, SO THE
PRESIDENT IS NOT DOING IT
PUBLICLY.
PUBLICLY. I HOPE THE REST OF THE
ADMINISTRATION IS TAKING ACTION.
>> AMBASSADOR McFAUL TO THE
NUCLEAR ACTION IN RUSSIA, THE
PROTESTS ARE ABOUT A TRANSPARENT
GOVERNMENT PROSE OF GETTING ON
BALLOTS AND HAVING REAL
ELECTIONINGS
ELECTIONINGS ELECTIONS, AND HERE IS THIS SAME
GOVERNMENT THAT IS BEHAVING, IT
SEEMS, VERY SIMILARLY TO WHAT WE
SAW AFTER THE CHERNOBYL ACCIDENT
30 YEARS AGO WITH THIS REFUSAL
TO DEAL DIRECTLY AND HONESTLY,
INCLUDING WITH THE PEOPLE WHOSE
LIVES COULD BE ENDANGERED BY IT.
>> I AGREE.
AND FIRST OFF, I WANT TO EXPRESS
MY CON DOLLDOLENCES, TO THE PEOP
THE FAMILIES WHO WERE LOST IN
THE TRAGEDY.
THE TRAGEDY. DO WE NEED NUCLEAR POWERED
CRUISE MISSILES IN THE WORLD, I
DON’T THINK SO, BUT THE FACT
THAT THEY ARE TRYING TO GO BACK
TO OLD SOVIET WAYS AND COVER IT
UP ARE SOME OF THE PROBLEMS
MIKEL GORBACHEV AFTER CHERNOBYL
THAT LED TO A PIVOT, A MORE OPEN
SOCIETY.
SOCIETY. THEY ARE PLAYING WITH FIRE IN
THE 21st CENTURY TO ASSUME THAT
THE CITIZENS OF RUSSIA,
SOPHISTICATED PEOPLE WITH ACCESS
TO INFORMATION ARE NOT GOING TO
DEMAND MORE ACCOUNTABILITY FROM
THAT GOVERNMENT.
THAT GOVERNMENT. >> WENDY SHERMAN, YOU AND
MICHAEL McFAUL WORKED IN
ADMINISTRATIONS WHERE WHAT YOU
WERE PRESENTING AT YOUR LEVEL TO
FOREIGN GOVERNMENTS WAS BACKED
UP BOTH PUBLICLY AND PRIVATELY
BY WHAT THE PRESIDENT IS SAYING.
AMBASSADOR McFAUL SAYS HE’S
HOPING THAT THE FOREIGN POLICY
ESTABLISHMENT IS COMMUNICATING
TO CHINA IN A BAY THAT GETS
THROUGH TO THEM ABOUT THE
IMPORTANCE OF THIS.
WHY WOULD THEY TAKE ANYTHING
SERIOUSLY FROM THE TRUMP STATE
DEPARTMENT IF THEY SEE THE
TWEETS OF DONALD TRUMP AND THE
PUBLIC COMMENTS OF DONALD TRUMP
WHERE HE DOESN’T SEEM TO CARE
ABOUT THIS AT ALL.
>> INDEED.
>> INDEED. MOST LEADERS AROUND THE WORLD
HAVE DECIDED THE ONLY PERSON WHO
DOES MATTER AS THE PRESIDENT
HIMSELF SAYS IS DONALD TRUMP.
AND SO EVEN WHEN DIPLOMATS AND
THERE AREN’T NEARLY ENOUGH OF
THEM, AND THEY CERTAINLY AREN’T
ABLE TO DO THE WORK THAT MIKE
AND I WOULD HAVE DONE.
WE WOULD HAVE BEEN TALKING TO
OUR COLLEAGUES OVER THE WORLD,
GOING TO THE UNITED NATIONS TO
ASK THAT THIS SITUATION BE
LOOKED AT, THE UNITED NATIONS IS
IN FACT STARTING ITS OWN
INVESTIGATION OF POLICE
BRUTALITY, IN HONG KONG, AND I
ASSUME SOMEONE’S GOING TO TAKE A
LOOK AT WHAT WAS REALLY A FLYING
CHERNOBYL ON A MISSILE THAT TOOK
PLACE, A FLYING NUCLEAR REACTOR
IN ESSENCE, SOMETHING WE BEGAN
IN THE 1960s AND PUT ASIDE
BECAUSE IT WAS SO DANGEROUS AND
FRAUGHT WITH TROUBLE, BUT ALL OF
THAT KIND OF DIPLOMACY, ALL OF
THAT TECHNICAL EXPERTISE IS NOT
BEING BROUGHT TO THE TABLE AND
EVEN IF IT WERE, AS YOU POINT
OUT, NOBODY WILL MUCH CARE IF
THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED
STATES IS REALLY JUST SAYING
NEVER MIND, AS MIKE SAID, I’VE
WITHDRAWN FROM THE WORLD, YOU’RE
ON YOUR OWN.
I’LL STAY OUT OF YOUR BUSINESS.
YOU STAY OUT OF MINE, AND JUST
MAKE SURE THAT AMERICA IS GREAT
AGAIN WHEN I THINK AMERICA WAS
PRETTY GREAT, CAN BE GREATER
ALWAYS, BUT THE PRESIDENT’S PATH
IS A PATH OF DESTRUCTIONINGS.