THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU.
>> Harris: THAT WAS A LOT OF
QUESTIONS.
THE ANSWERS WERE SURPRISING.
WE FINALLY GOT A NUMBER OF
PEOPLE THERE AT THE END THAT
MIGHT HAVE BEEN CLOSEST TO THE
SCENE AS ALEC BALDWIN FIRED THE
WEAPON WHICH KILLED HALYNA
HUTCHINS, THE 42-YEAR-OLD
DIRECTOR ON THE "RUST" MOVIE
SET.
A FRAGMENT OF THE BULLET CASING
WE KNOW FROM SHERIFF MENDOZA IS
WHAT HIT THE DIRECTOR OF THE
FILM, JOEL SOUZA IN THE
SHOULDER.
THEY’VE RETRIEVED THAT.
NOW THEY’RE PUTTING TOGETHER THE
BULLET, THE GUN AND ALL OF THAT.
THE BIG QUESTION NOW IS, HOW
MANY PEOPLE WERE ON THE SET, WHO
KNEW WHAT WHEN AND COULD THIS
HAVE BEEN PREVENTED?
AT FIRST HE SAID 100 PEOPLE.
THEN 90 AND THEN BACK TO 100
PEOPLE.
THERE WERE A LOT OF PEOPLE ON
THE SET.
WE KNOW 16 OF THEM ARE CLOSE TOO
WHAT WE’LL CALL A SHOOTING
ACTION SO WE DON’T KNOW FROM OUR
OWN REPORTER, JONATHAN HUNT.
WELL, IS COMPLACENCY A CRIME?
WE DON’T KNOW WHAT WE’RE LOOKING
AT.
I’M HARRIS FAULKNER.
YOU’RE WATCHING "OUTNUMBERED."
THIS IS EMILY AND KAYLEIGH.
EMILY, THERE WERE SOME THINGS
THAT POPPED.
500 ROUND OF AMMUNITION, A MIX
OF, YOU KNOW, LIVE AMMUNITION,
BLANKS, DUMMIES.
WE DON’T KNOW HOW MANY.
YOUR TAKE.
>> Emily: HERE’S WHAT VIEWERS
NEED TO UNDERSTAND.
SAFETY IS NO ACCIDENT.
SO LET’S JUST TAKE THAT GENERAL
RULE AND LET’S APPLY IT HERE.
EVERYONE IS TALKING ABOUT THE
NEGLIGENCE STANDARDS AND
CRIMINAL CHARGES AND THE LIKE.
IF YOU KNEW OR SHOULD HAVE NONE
THAT SOMETHING OCCURRED THAT IS
CIVIL NEGLIGENCE.
IF YOU HAVE A RECKLESS DISREGARD
FOR LIFE, HAVE A GREAT RISK FOR
BODILY INJURY OR DEATH, THAT’S
WHEN YOU’RE CRIMINALLY LIABLE.
SO WHEN WE TALK ABOUT FINDING
LIVE ROUNDS ON SET, WE HEARD
THEM TALK ABOUT THAT, THEY FOUND
LIVE ROUNDS ON SET, THAT SUN
ACCEPTABLE.
HE KEEPS REFERENCING THE FACT
THAT THE FBI WAS BROUGHT IN AND
THE CONFIRMATION OF SUCH WILL
OCCUR AT QUANTICO.
HE DISCUSSED THE EVENTS MOVING
FORWARD.
THAT IS STANDARD OPERATING
PROCEDURE.
THE SHERIFF SAYS THEY WILL KEEP
INVESTIGATING THE SCENE AND KEEP
INVESTIGATING WHAT HAPPENED.
IF THEY -- IF IT RISES TO THE
LEVEL THAT PROBABLE CAUSE EXISTS
FOR A CRIME THAT HAS OCCURRED,
THEY DETERMINED SUCH, THEY WILL
MAKE AN ARREST AND CHARGES WILL
BE FILED.
OTHERWISE, THEY WILL SUBMIT IT
TO THE D.A.
THAT’S WHAT ALWAYS HAPPENS AND
THE D.A. IS WHO DETERMINES WHAT
CHARGES THEY WILL BE FILING,
WHAT CRIMES THEY BELIEVE
OCCURRED.
WHEN THE FBI IS BROUGHT IN, IT’S
BROUGHT IN BECAUSE OF
JURISDICTION OR RESOURCES.
HERE THEY’RE BROUGHT IN BECAUSE
OF RESOURCES.
NEW MEXICO IS MAKING A POSITION
THAT THEY’RE DOING EVERYTHING
UNDER THEIR PURVIEW.
THEY HAVE COOPERATION OF OTHER
AGENCIES TO MAKE SURE IT’S AS
THOROUGH AND ACCURATE AS
POSSIBLE.
I WANT EVERYONE TO THINK BACK,
THIS IS A CASE THAT I BROUGHT UP
BEFORE.
WHEN A CAMERA ASSISTANT DIED ON
SET, THE ASSISTANT DIRECTOR
SERVED TIME IN PRISON FOR
INVOLUNTARY MANSLAUGHTER AND
THAT WAS THE DIRECTOR WITH TEN
YEARS OF PROBATION.
BECAUSE OF THAT ABSOLUTE
RECKLESS DISREGARD STANDARD THAT
I MENTIONED EARLIER.
WHAT IS INTERESTING THERE AND
WHY I BRING IT IN HERE IS
BECAUSE THERE WERE SHOE
COMPLAINTS ON THE SET OF THE
RECKLESS DISREGARD, SO MANY
SAFETY PROTOCOLS THAT WERE
IGNORED THAT WERE UNDER THE
PURVIEW OF THE DIRECTOR AND THAT
THEY THEN PROVED THAT IT LED TO
THAT CAMERA ASSISTANT’S DEATH.
SO WE HAVE THE SHERIFF SAYINGER
WITH AWARE OF THE SAFETY
COMPLAINTS THAT OCCURRED, WE’RE
AWARE OF ALLEGATIONS OF ALCOHOL
CONSUMPTION THE NIGHT BEFORE.
AGAIN, WE RECOVERED LIVE ROUNDS.
WAIT FOR CONFIRMATION ON THAT.
IF THEY KNEW A LIVE ROUND WAS IN
THAT GUN, IF THE ASSISTANT
DIRECTOR WAS NEGLIGENT AND
ALLOWED THE LIVE ROUNDS ON SET
BY THE ARMOR, BY ANY KIND OF
LACK OF PROTOCOL AND SAFETY,
THAT’S WHEN WE CAN EXPECT
CHARGES TO BE FILED.
>> Harris: I WANT TO BIG DEEPER
FROM WHAT WE HEARD.
WE’RE GOING TO WORK ON THE FACTS
THAT SHERIFF MENDOZA OF SANTA FE
COUNTY AND THE PROSECUTOR JUST
GAVE US.
THERE WAS A LOT TO GET TO.
SOMETHING THAT EMILY JUST TALKED
ABOUT REMINDS ME -- I DON’T KNOW
IF OUR TEAM HAS THE 911 CALL --
BUT WHEN THAT ASSIST ABOUT THE
DIRECTOR -- WHEN THE PROP PEOPLE
WERE MENTIONED AND A 911 CALL,
IT STARTS TO YOUR POINT, EMILY,
OF THERE WERE PROBLEMS ON THAT
SET BEFORE THIS HAPPENED.
SO MY BIG QUESTION IS WHO IS AT
THE TOP OF THE FOOD CHAIN HERE?
IS IT ALEC BALDWIN OR SOMEBODY
ELSE?
HOW DOES IT WORK?
IF SAFETY IS ALWAYS A THING WITH
GUN AND YOU HEARD THE SHERIFF
SAY THAT, IT’S ALWAYS A THING,
DID ALEC BALDWIN THERE WERE
POTENTIAL LIVE ROUNDS AMONG THE
AMMUNITION THAT THEY FOUND?
WAS THERE EVEN A POSSIBILITY OF
THIS HAPPENING AND WAS HE AWARE
OF IT?
>> THERE WAS A POSSIBILITY.
LOOK, EMILY LIED OUT THE LAW
BEAUTIFULLY, KNEW OR SHOULD HAVE
KNOWN.
LET ME GIVE YOU ALLEGED FACTS.
THESE ARE FACTS THAT WOULD BE
CONSIDERED.
ONE IS THAT A STUNT DOUBLE
DISCHARGE ADD PROP WEAPON THAT
HE WAS TOLD WAS A COLD WEAPON.
THIS HAPPENED LESS THAN A WEEK
BEFORE.
THERE WAS COMPLACENCY ON THIS
SET.
IAN HUDSON THAT FILM ADD DEATH
SCENE ON THE VERY SAME SET, HE
SAID THIS.
HE SAID WHEN THE ROUNDS WERE
RELEASED, THESE WERE BLANKS
FIRED AT HIM, HE SAID BEHIND HIM
THE CREW WAS IN DIRECT LINE OF
FIRE AND THEY HAD SHIELDS.
AGAIN, THESE WERE BLANKS.
WHEN THEY SHOT AT ME, I DID FEEL
THE BLANKS HITTING MY FACE AND
BODY AND I WOULD FEEL THE WIND
FROM THE SHOTGUN.
IT WAS HEAVY AND STRONG AND TALK
TO MY FELLOW CAST.
WE ALL AGREED HOW SCARY IT WAS,
HOW REAL IT WAS.
HE WENT ON TO SAY, REMEMBER THE
LAST TIME THIS HAPPENED WAS THE
1993 DEATH OF AN ACTOR TO A
PROBLEM WEAPON.
HE SAID THEY COMPARED THAT SET
AND HOW IT FELT ON THAT SET TO THIS 1993 --
THIS 1993 --
>> Harris: TALKING AMONG
THEMSELVES.
>> YES.
>> Harris: AND OF THE 16 THAT
WERE CLOSEST TO WHAT WAS GOING
ON AND THEY FEEL LIKE THEY
TALKED TO ALL 16 AT THIS POINT
ACCORDING TO THE SHERIFF, THEN
THEY’VE GOT WHAT YOU JUST
DESCRIBED.
THAT IS A BIG POTENTIAL CHUNK OF
PUTTING THIS PUZZLE TOGETHER.
IF PEOPLE CAN TALK IN THAT MUCH
DETAIL, THERE’S SOME EXPERTISE
IN THAT SETTING.
>> Kayleigh: COMPARING THE DEATH
OF BRANDON LEE.
>> Harris: THAT IS INTERESTING.
YOU MENTIONED COMPLACENCY.
THE SHERIFF SAID COMPLACENCY ON
THE SET IS SOMETHING THAT STATE
AND INDUSTRY SHOULD LOOK AT.
FROM WHAT HE KNOWS, THERE WAS
COMPLACENCY.
WE’VE GOT THAT 911 CALL.
REMEMBER, THE SCRIPT SUPERVISOR
WAS PLACING THE BLAME ON THE
FILM’S ASSISTANT DIRECTOR IN THE
911 CALL. LET’S LISTEN.
>> Harris: HE’S SUPPOSED TO
CHECK THE GUN.
HE’S SUPPOSED TO DO THAT.
I’LL TELL YOU -- I DON’T KNOW
HOW THIS WORKS.
AND DAGEN McDOWELL AND GUY
BENSON ARE HERE.
I WANT TO BRING IN OUR FAMILY
FOR AN HOUR.
BUT YOU KNOW, I WOULD IMAGINE IF
YOU HAD BEEN AROUND MOVIE SETS
AS MUCH AS ALEC BALD WHEN AND SO
ON AND SO FORTH, THERE MIGHT BE
SOMEONE THAT WOULD SAY IF YOU’RE
HANDLING A WEAPON, YOU TOO NEED
TO KNOW A QUICK TWO,
THREE-SECOND CHECK OF WHETHER OR
NOT THERE’S A BULLET IN THAT
BARREL.
YOU NEED TO KNOW IF THERE’S A
ROUND OF ANY KIND IT IN
REGARDLESS OF WHAT YOU MAY KNOW
ABOUT ANY ROUND OR ANY KIND IN
IT.
YOU NEED TO KNOW THERE’S NOT
ONE.
IF YOU’RE SITTING ON THE STUMP
OF A CHURCH, AT THE SET, AND
YOU’RE GOING TO POINT THE GUN AT
THE CAMERA AND THERE’S PEOPLE
AROUND NOT WITH CHILDS, WHAT ARE
YOUR THOUGHTS ABOUT THIS, DAGEN?
>> THIS IS SOMETHING THAT YOU
LEARN AS A CHILD FROM FRIENDS
AND FAMILY WHEN YOU’RE TAUGHT
HOW TO HANDLE A GUN AND WHEN
YOU’RE TAUGHT GUN SAFETY.
DO YOU ALWAYS CHECK THE WEAPON
TO MAKE SURE IT’S NOT LOADED.
AGAIN, ON A MOVIE SET,
THERE’S -- EMILY CAN WEIGH-IN ON
THIS.
THERE SHOULD BE A GREATER
EXPECTATION FOR ALEC BALDWIN
BECAUSE HE’S NOT JUST AN ACTOR
ON THE FILM.
HE’S A PRODUCER, NUMBER 1.
A COLD GUN MEANS THERE’S NOT
EVEN A --
>> Harris: THERE’S NOTHING IN
IT.
>> NOTHING IN IT.
NOT EVEN A BLANK IN THE GUN.
THE BIGGEST QUESTION IS HOW DID
LIVE AMMO WIND UP ON THIS SET,
WHO BROUGHT IT ON TO THE SET AND
WHO KNEW ABOUT IT AND WHO
ALLOWED IT.
ONE THING I FOUND INTERESTING
FROM THE SHERIFF THAT OF THE
FIVE ROUNDS OF AMMO, THEY
DISCOVERED BLANKS, WHICH IS
POWDER, NO LEAD, THEY DISCOVERED
DUMMY ROUNDS, WHICH IS -- HAS --
IT’S MEANT TO LOOK LIKE A
BULLET, IT’S NO POWDER AND LEAD
TRADITIONALLY AND THEN ACTUAL
WHAT THEY BELIEVE TO BE LIVE
ROUNDS.
THERE WAS ALSO OF THE THREE
FIREARMS PICKED UP, THERE WAS
ALSO A PLASTIC NONFUNCTIONING
REVOLVER.
THAT IS A PROP GUN.
ANY REFERENCE TO THE WEAPON THAT
ALEC BALDWIN DISCHARGED IS NOT A
PROP.
IT’S AN ACTUAL GUN.
A PROP IS SOMETHING THAT HAS NO
ABILITY OF FIRING A BLANK OR AN
ACTUAL LIVE ROUND.
BUT IT’S INTERESTING TO KNOW
THAT THERE’S A PLASTIC
NONFUNCTIONING REVOLVER
INVOLVED.
>> Harris: WHY DID THEY HAND HIM
THAT?
WE WON’T KNOW AS HE SAT ON THE
MOVIE SET.
>> THE CHAIN OF RESPONSIBILITY
TRADITIONALLY, IT’S THE ARMORER
WHO HANDS THE ACTOR OR ACTRESS
THE GUN.
AND WHY -- THIS IS SOMETHING
CLEARLY THEY’RE INVESTIGATING.
WHY DID THE ASSISTANT DIRECTOR,
HALL, GRAB THE GUN OFF A CART.
>> WHY.
>> WE SHOULD POINT OUT THIS IS A
LOW BUDGET PRODUCTION.
THEY WERE UNDER THE GUN --
>> Harris: WHICH FUELS THE
COMPLAINTS.
>> IT WAS UNDER THE GUN.
THE UNION CAMERA CREW HAD WALKED
OFF THE SET EARLIER THAT DAY.
THEY WERE TRYING TO CUT COSTS,
TRYING TO GET THE DAY IN.
AGAIN, THEREIN LIES THE
RECKLESSNESS THAT WAS BRED.
WE CAN SAY IT’S RECKLESSNESS.
IT’S BEYOND COMPLACENCY.
BECAUSE SOMEBODY IS DEAD.
>> Harris: GUY, I WANT TO COME
TO YOU.
I’M NOT GOING TO PROFESS TO KNOW
WHAT WE DON’T KNOW.
I WON’T FILL IN THE BLANKS ABOUT
THE WEAPON BECAUSE HE WASN’T ALL
THAT SPECIFIC.
HE SAID AND F. LEE PIETA.
IT’S A HISTORICAL WEAPON AND
BEAUTIFUL GUNS.
BASED ON WHAT DAGEN SAID,
THERE’S NO WAY THAT YOU CAN GET
AN F. LEE PIETA CONFUSED WITH A
PROBLEM GUN UNLESS THEY’RE
DYNAMIC REPLICAS OF ONE ANOTHER.
IT’S NOT BEEN DESCRIBED THIS
WAY.
JUST THE THOUGHT OF WHAT DAGEN JUST LAID OUT, HOW DIFFERENT
JUST LAID OUT, HOW DIFFERENT
THESE WOULD LOOK, FEEL AND
REQUIRE.
>> THERE WAS A LIVE ROUND IN IT.
MY ASSUMPTION HERE AND WE DON’T
WANT TO ASSUME MUCH, IS THAT
ALEC BALDWIN BELIEVED ENTIRELY
THAT IT WAS A GUN THAT IF HE
PULLED THE TRIGGER, THERE WOULD
NOT BE A REAL ROUND FLYING OUT.
THAT’S WHAT HAPPENED AND SOMEONE
IS DEAD.
WE HEARD FROM THE TWO LAWYERS.
NEAR REALLY EXPERTS ON THE LAW.
I’M NOT.
AS A LAW PERSON, THE WORLD
NEGLIGENCE IMMEDIATELY CAME TO
MY MIND AS SOON AS I HEARD SOME
OF THE INITIAL DETAILS ABOUT
THIS STORY.
HOW ON EARTH IS IT POSSIBLE FOR
THAT TYPE OF CATASTROPHIC LETHAL
MISTAKE TO HAPPEN ON A FILM SET.
I UNDERSTAND IT WAS A STRESSFUL
DAY BASED ON THE WALK-OUT.
THERE WERE SOME SIMMERING
TENSIONS FROM THE 911 CALL.
PERHAPS PEOPLE HAD BEEN DRINKING
THE NIGHT BEFORE.
WE HEARD ABOUT THOSE RUMORS.
MAYBE NOT EVERYONE IS AT THE TOP
OF THEIR GAME.
NEVERTHELESS, HOW ARE THERE ANY
LIVE ROUNDS ON SET WHATSOEVER
WHEN THERE WERE REAL GUNS ON
SET?
I DON’T THINK LISTENING TO ALL
OF THOSE QUESTIONS AND ALL OF
THE ANSWERS FROM THE SHERIFF AND
THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY, I DIDN’T
LEARN A LOT OF INFORMATION.
THE ONE PIECE THAT REALLY DID
STICK OUT TO ME IS THAT AT LEAST
BASED ON THE SHERIFF’S FRAMING
OF IT, THIS WAS NOT JUST ONE
REAL BULLET.
THEY BELIEVED THERE WERE
MULTIPLE LIVE ROUNDS, MULTIPLE
BULLETS ON SET.
HOW ON EARTH WAS THAT POSSIBLE.
>> Harris: HUMANS MADE THAT
POSSIBLE.
GUNS DOWN WALK TO THE SET WITH
BULLETS.
WE DON’T KNOW WHICH ONE.
NOW WE KNOW THEY HAD 100 PEOPLE
ON THE SET IN CONDITIONS WHERE
THERE WAS SOME QUESTIONABLE
THINGS GOING ON.
SO THAT’S -- THOSE INTERVIEWS
WILL TAKE SOME TIME, I WOULD
IMAGINE.
REAL QUICKLY AND THEN WE WANT TO
MOVE ON.
I WANT YOUR FINAL THOUGHT.
>> JUST A FINAL THOUGHT THAT THE
SHERIFF REFERRED TO THE PRODUCER
AS ACTOR ALEC BALDWIN AND
PRODUCER.
THEY’RE LOOKING AS HIM AS MORE
WHEN HE RECEIVED THE GUN.
>> Harris: SO MUCH COMING OUT OF
SANTA FE NEW MEXICO TODAY WHERE
A WOMAN DIED ON THE MOVIE SET OF
"RUST."
THE IRONY, THERE WAS TRUST THAT
THEY WERE PASSING AROUND
APPARENTLY.
BUT WITH A GUN THAT WAS
POTENTIALLY LOADED WITH A LIVE
WEAPON.
I SAY POTENTIAL BECAUSE WE HAVE
TO WAIT FOR THE CRIME LAB TO
FIGURE THAT OUT.
BUT THE SHERIFF SEEMED TO BE
CONFIDENT OF IT.
HALYNA HUTCHINS IS DEAD.