BUREAU CHIEF OF "THE WASHINGTON POST" BILL RUCKER IS BACK AND
DR. DONNA EDWARDS IS HERE.
DOCTOR, I WANT TO START WITH
YOU.
YOU. I AM NOT WITHOUT SYMPATHY FOR
PEOPLE WHO HAVE TO TRY TO SERVE
THE PUBLIC AND ALSO SERVE DRUF.
THAT SAID, TO ME, IT SEEMED THAT
DR. BIRX SQUANDERED SOME OF HER
CREDIBILITY WITH THE 100% OF THE
AMERICAN PUBLIC THAT IS
INTERESTED IN WHAT PEOPLE LIKE
HERSELF AND DOCTOR FAUCI HAVE TO
SAY WHEN SHE SUGGESTED OR
REFUSED TO CONDEMN FROM A PUBLIC
HEALTH STANDPOINT THE DECISION
ON GEORGIA’S PART TO OPEN UP
HAIR SALONS AND TATTOO PARLORS
AND GYMS.
AND GYMS. >> WELL, YOU CALLED IT A
THREE-RING CIRCUS.
THREE-RING CIRCUS. I HOPE IT’S JUST THREE RINGS.
BUT IT SEEMS MUCH MORE DIRE THAN
THAT.
THAT. WE HAVE AN INCREDIBLE ARRAY OF
MIXED MESSAGING COMING FROM THE
TOP WHICH, OF COURSE, UNDERMINES
ANY ABILITY TO FIGURE OUT WHAT
THE RIGHT STRATEGY IS.
IS IT POSSIBLE TO OPEN UP A
BEAUTY SALON?
BEAUTY SALON? MIGHT BE, BUT NOT RIGHT NOW.
NOT WITH THE LIMITED AMOUNT OF
TESTING WE HAVE.
WE CAN’T GO INTO A BEAUTY PARLOR
OR A BARBER SHOP AND NOT SHOW
WHETHER THE BARBER HAS COVID-19
OR NOT OR WHETHER I HAVE IT AND
GIVE IT TO THE BARBER OR ANYBODY
ELSE IN THE SHOP.
SO ALL OF THESE THINGS ARE
POTENTIALLY DOABLE.
POTENTIALLY DOABLE. TRUMP CALLED THIS A LIGHT AT THE
END OF THE TUNNEL.
YEAH, THERE IS A LIGHT AT THE
END OF THE TUNNEL BUT IT’S
PROBABLY THE LONGEST TUNNEL ONE
WOULD POSSIBLY IMAGINE AND THE
LIGHT AT THE END OF THIS TUNNEL
IS INCREASINGLY DIFFICULT TO SEE
WHAT THE PATHWAY IS TO GET
THERE, AT LEAST UNDER THIS VERY
DISORGANIZED AND DYSFUNCTIONAL
MESSAGE THAT IS COMING FROM THE
TOP, NICOLE.
TOP, NICOLE. >> WHAT WOULD YOUR GUIDANCE BE
ABOUT GEORGIA’S PLAN FOR
REOPENING?
REOPENING? ARE THEY TRYING TO DO TOO MUCH
TOO SOON, OR ARE THOSE THINGS
THAT SHOULD BE ON THE TABLE FOR
ANY STATE?
ANY STATE? >> FIRST OF ALL, I WANT TO BE
SYMPATHETIC AND SAY THIS ON
BEHALF OF THE ENTIRE PUBLIC
HEALTH COMMUNITY.
HEALTH COMMUNITY. NOBODY WANTS TO DELAY ANY MORE
THAN NECESSARY THE REOPENING OF
THE AMERICAN BUSINESS AND
EVERYDAY PEOPLE GETTING THEIR
INCOMES BACK.
INCOMES BACK. THAT GOES FOR SURE.
THE PROBLEM IS THIS QUESTION OF
WHICH WE KEEP REPEATING, CAN WE
OPEN SAFELY OR NOT?
BUT WE CAN’T OPEN SAFELILY
UNLESS WE CAN DO TESTING AND
UNLESS WE CAN DO A VERY
EFFECTIVE AND VERY EFFICIENT
CONTACT TRACING TO MAKE SURE WE
FOLLOW UP WITH PEOPLE WHO MIGHT
BE POSITIVE.
BE POSITIVE. WE MAKE SURE WE HAVE NEW RULES
TO THE WORKPLACE.
MY ASSISTANT WILL PUT ON A
REPORT NEXT SEVERAL DAYS THAT
GET SPECIFIC ABOUT THIS.
BUT TO PROMISE TO GIVE FALSE
HOPE TO AMERICANS THAT THIS
COULD BE DONE SAFELY THE NEXT
FEW WEEKS IS PREPOSTEROUS.
I REALLY FEEL SORRY THAT DR.
PBIRX IS PUTTING HERSELF ON THE
LINE LIKE THAT.
I CAN’T IMAGINE WHAT IT MUST BE
LIKE TO BE WORKING FOR THE TRUMP
ADMINISTRATION AND TRYING TO BE
TRUE TO THE SCIENCE AND THE
EVIDENCE, SAY WHAT MAKES SENSE,
AND STILL NOT GET FIRED BY A
VERY ERRATIC BOSS.
IT’S A TOUGH POSITION FOR HER TO
BE IN AND I DO FEEL SORRY FOR
HER, NICOLE.
HER, NICOLE. >> YOU KNOW, PHIL RUCKER,
SCIENCE IS REALLY FASCINATING
FOE FOR THIS PRESIDENT THAT YOUR
NEWSPAPER HAS CLOCKED 16,000
LIES COME OUT OF HIS MOUTH.
WE PLAYED THE LAST HOUR HALF A
DOZEN INSTANCES WHERE HE SAID
EVERYTHING FROM TRY IT TO WHAT
HAVE YOU GOT TO LOSE ABOUT A
DRUG TREATMENT THAT WAS JUST
STUDIED AND RENDERED TO NOT BE
AN EFFECTIVE OR SAFE TREATMENT
FOR COVID-19.
FOR COVID-19. I KNOW WE ALWAYS ASK THIS
QUESTION ABOUT GUARDRAILS, BUT
IS THERE ANY RESPECT FOR THE
SCIENTISTS AND THE JOB THEY
HAVE, ESPECIALLY ANTHONY FAUCI,
OF LEADING A DEPARTMENT FULL OF
SCIENTISTS?
SCIENTISTS? >> WELL, NICOLE, THERE ARE A
COUPLE OF SCIENTISTS AROUND THE
TABLE WITH THE PRESIDENT,
DOCTORS FAUCI AND BIRX ARE TWO
OF THEM BUT NOT TO SAY THEY HAVE
HAVING A GREAT DEAL OF INFLUENCE
WITH HIM.
WITH HIM. THEY HAVE ACCESS TO HIM AND THEY
ARE ABLE TO PRESENT INFORMATION
TO HIM, BUT THIS IS A PRESIDENT
WHO, IN HIS PREDAYSES OF
CORONAVIRUS WHO PUT EMOTION AND
ANECDOTE AND HIS GUT INSTINCTS
ABOVE RAW INTELLIGENCE AND ABOVE
FACT AND ABOVE SCIENCE.
HE ALWAYS FEELS LIKE HE IS THE
ONE WITH THE BEST INSTINCTS AND
KNOWS WHERE TO GO AND KNOWS WHAT
TO DECIDE IRRESPECTIVE OF WHAT
THE EXPERTS AROUND HIM HAVE TO
SAY.
SAY. I HAVE TO THINK BACK THAT VISIT
HE MADE EARLY ON DURING THIS
PANDEMIC TO THE CDC HEADQUARTERS
DOWN IN ATLANTA.
>> YEAH.
>> YEAH. >> WHERE HE WAS GETTING A TOUR
OF THE FACILITY BY SOME OF THE
MEDICAL EXPERTS THERE AND HE
WENT ON AND ON ABOUT WHAT GENIUS
HE IS, THE PRESIDENT IS, WHEN IT
COMES TO SCIENCE AND MEDICINE
AND MAYBE HE SHOULD HAVE GUN
INTO THAT FIELD.
HE, OF COURSE, IS NOT EDUCATED
IN THAT FIELD AND IS NOT
CREDENTIALED IN THAT FIELD, BUT
HAS SO MUCH FAITH IN HIS OWN GUT
AND HIS OWN INSTINCTS THAT IT
OVERRIDES A LOT OF TIMES WHAT
THE FACTS SAY AND WHAT THE
SCIENCE LAYS BEAR.
>> I’M REALLY GOOD AT THIS
STUFF, THEY COULDN’T BELIEVE HOW
GOOD AT THIS STUFF HE SAID.
THEN I THINK HE DROPPED IN THAT
HE WAS RELATED TO SOMEONE WHO
WENT TO MIT OR SOMETHING.
I’LL NEVER FORGET THAT AND I’LL
NEVER BE THE SAME.
HE WAS ALSO WEARING A RED -- NOT
A -- MEGA HAT BUT A KEEP AMERICA
GREAT HEART AND A WIND BREAKER.
HE ALSO A SLAVE TO THE POLLS AND
HERE IS WHAT THE POLLS SAY ABOUT
EASING SOCIALLY DISTANCING
RESTRICTIONS.
RESTRICTIONS. THIS IS IN THE IMPORTANT
CORONAVIRUS HOT SPOT, BUT ALSO
AN IMPORTANT POLITICAL STATE OF
FLORIDA.
FLORIDA. 72% WOULD LIKE SOCIALLY
DISTANCING RESTRICTIONS EXTENDED
INTO MAY APPEAR ONLY 22% WOULD
LIKE THEM LOOSENED BY THE END OF
APRIL.
APRIL. SO THE PRESIDENT NOW AT ODDS
WITH THE POLITICAL WILL OF A
PRETTY IMPORTANT STATE IN TERMS
OF DEFEATING AND PUSHING BACK
AGAINST THE SPREAD OF
CORONAVIRUS, AS WELL AS THE
STATE THAT I’M SURE, MORE
IMPORTANT TO THE PRESIDENT, IS A
POLITICAL BATTLEGROUND.
POLITICAL BATTLEGROUND. >> IT’S REALLY INTERESTING
BECAUSE BEFORE THIS PANDEMIC
BEGAN FLORIDA WAS SEEN AS A
SWING STATE LEANING IN THE
PRESIDENT’S DIRECTION AND THERE
WERE SOME DOUBTS WHETHER THE
DEMOCRATIC NOMINEE WOULD REALLY
CONTEST THAT STATE AS
AGGRESSIVELY AS SOME OF THE
OTHER SWING STATES BECAUSE OF
TRUMP’S POPULARITY THERE.
YET WE ARE SEEING THE FLORIDIANS
ARE NOT IN AGREEMENT WITH THE
PRESIDENT OF WANTING TO RESTART
THE ECONOMY SO SOON.
ONE DEMOGRAPHIC TO KEEP AN EYE
ON IS PEOPLE OVER AGE 65
SENIORS.
SENIORS. THEY ARE MOST VULNERABLE TO THE
CORONAVIRUS BUT ALSO A VERY
IMPORTANT VOTING BLOCK FOR THE
PRESIDENT IN HIS RE-ELECTION
CAMPAIGN YOOSACROSS THE COUNTRY
ALSO IN FLORIDA WHERE SO MANY
RETIREES MOVE.
RETIREES MOVE. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE HOW THE
DEMOGRAPHIC SHIFTS IN THESE
POLLS.
POLLS. >> DONNA, IT’S A GREAT POINT AND
A POLITICAL CONTINGENCY EVEN IF
WE HADN’T BEEN IN THE THROES OF
A GLOBAL PANDEMIC, JOE BIDEN IS
VERY STRONG IN THAT AGE GROUP AS
WELL.
WELL. I WANT TO ASK YOU AS WE COME ON
THE AIR, THIS IS, AGAIN, SORT OF
A RECURRING PLOT TWIST IN THE
TRUMP STORY.
TRUMP STORY. THERE IS AN ATTEMPT AT A
WALK-BACK, NOT FROM THE HEAD OF
THE CDC, BUT FROM THE WHITE
HOUSE ABOUT THE HEAD OF THE CDC
SAID ABOUT A POTENTIALLY MORE
DEADLY SECOND WAVE OF
CORONAVIRUS.
CORONAVIRUS. IF YOU NEED ANY EVIDENCE THAT IN
THIS THREE-RING CIRCUS EVERYONE
IS GETTING PRESSURE AND A
SQUEEZE FROM DONALD TRUMP TO
STAY ON HIS CHOSEN POLITICAL
MESSAGE, IT’S HAPPENING IN
REAL-TIME AS WE ARE TALKING.
THE PRESIDENT IS TALKING ABOUT A
NEW STATEMENT SAYING THE CDC
DIRECTOR WAS TOTALLY MISQUOTED
BY FAKE NEWS CNN ON COVID.
HE WILL BE PUTTING OUT A
STATEMENT.
STATEMENT. THAT USUALLY IS A PUBLIC
EXTORTION OR A PUBLIC THREAT.
THE STATEMENT HASN’T COME OUT
YET.
YET. THE QUOTE WAS IN AN INTERVIEW IN
"THE WASHINGTON POST," NOT CNN,
SHOWING THAT PRESIDENT, AGAIN,
ISN’T GETTING HIS INFORMATION
FROM ANYTHING HE READS, BUT FROM
THE CABLE NETWORK HE JUST CAN’T
QUIT, CNN.
QUIT, CNN. >> WELL, YOU KNOW, NICOLE THE
DIRECTOR OF THE CDC IS IN THE
SAME POSITION AS DR. BIRX.
ANYONE AROUND THE PRESIDENT
EVENTUALLY FINDS HIMSELF
SWIRLING AROUND IN THE MUCK OF
THE PRESIDENT’S OBJECT FEWSCUTIO
THEY CHOOSE TO BE IN THE GOOD
GRACES OF PRESIDENT OF THE
UNITED STATES.
UNITED STATES. HERE IS WHERE WE ARE POTENTIALLY
LOSING LIVES AND SO I FULLY
EXPECT EVERY TIME THE PRESIDENT
TAKES TO THE PODIUM, HE WILL LIE
AND OBJECT
AND OBJECT AND.
AND. D DR. BIRX AND HER TO AMERICAN
PEOPLE -- DOING THAT AS WELL.
IT REALLY DOES GREAT DAMAGE TO
THE PUBLIC THAT IS CONFUSED
ABOUT WHAT THE GUIDELINES MEAN,
WHAT THE RESTRICTIONS ARE, WHAT
THE RISKS ARE GOING INTO THE
FUTURE AND, FRANKLY, THE
INFORMATION FROM THE CDC
YESTERDAY, THE DIRECTOR’S
STATEMENTS WERE PERHAPS THE MOST
CHILLING THAT WE HAVE HEARD
BECAUSE WE WEREN’T PREPARED
BEFORE, WE ARE NOT PREPARED NOW,
AND IT IS DIFFICULT TO SEE HOW
THIS PRESIDENT AND THIS