>>>
>>> WELCOME BACK. WHEN JOHN STANLEY FORD WAS
RECRUITED TO WORK FOR IBM IN
THE LATE 40s HE WAS
UNDERSTANDABLY QUITE PROUD AS
THE COMPANY'S FIRST BLACK
SOFTWARE ENGINEER.
SOFTWARE ENGINEER. HE VIEWED THE JOB JOB AS A
BREAK OF A LIFETIME PUTS FACED
DECADES OF RACISM AS SOME
COWORKERS DID ALL THEY COULD TO
HUMILIATE AND UNDERMINE HIM.
WHILE FORD PERSEVERED AND
STAYED ON, IT CAME IN A GREAT
EMOTIONAL COST TO HIM AND HIS
FAMILY, ESPECIALLY HIS SON,
CLYDE, WHO EVENTUALLY WENT TO
WORK FOR IBM HIMSELF.IN THE NEW
MY WORK, "THINK BLACK", CLYDE
LOOKS BACK, SACRIFICES HIS
FATHER MADE FOR HIS FAMILY AND
HIS COMMUNITY AND JOINS ME NOW.
WELCOME.
WELCOME.
WELCOME. I REALLY ENJOYED THIS BOOK.
WHAT MADE YOU WANT TO WRITE
THIS NOW ?
>> I THINK I SAW IN THE HIGH-
TECH FIELD, WHICH I'VE BEEN IN
FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS, SOME OF
THE SAME ISSUES STILL
PERSISTING MY FATHER REALLY
TRIED TO WORK AGAINST AND
IMPROVE IN THIS WAS A LONG TIME
AGO.
AGO.
AGO. MORE
AGO. MORE THAN 70 YEARS AGO.
>> AND WE FORGET, I THINK OF
THE 1940s AND I THINK ABOUT IT
AS MY PARENTS WERE ALIVE BUT
NOW WE ARE TALKING ABOUT A
REALLY LONG TIME.
>> 1946 IS WHEN MY DAD WAS
HIRED AT IBM.
>> HOW WAS IT THAT HE CAME TO
BE HIRED AT IBM AND WHY WAS IT
NOT -- YOU WOULD HOPE IN THE
MOVIES YOU WILL BREAK THROUGH
AND YOU GET THE JOB AND ALL IS
WELL BUT YOU COMPARE HIS
EXPERIENCE QUITE ACCURATELY, I
THINK, TO JACKIE ROBINSON'S
ROLE IN INTEGRATING BASEBALL.
>> THIS WAS POST-WORLD WAR II.
IT WAS A TIME OF FIRST.
PARTICULARLY IN THE BLACK UNITY
WHERE THERE WAS THE FIRST IN
THIS FIELD AND THE FIRST IN
THAT FIELD.
THAT FIELD. JACKIE ROBINSON BEING THE FIRST
TO BREAK THE COLOR LINE IN
MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL AND MY
DAD HIRED DIRECTLY BY THOMAS J
WATSON SENIOR THE FOUNDER OF
IBM.
IBM.
IBM. THE
IBM. THE FIRST TO BREAK THE SO-
CALLED COLOR LINE IN THE HIGH
TECH WORLD OF COMPUTERS AND
SOFTWARE..
SOFTWARE.. WATSON HIRED MY DAD RIGHT OUT
OF HIS CITY COLLEGE ACCOUNTING
CLASSROOM.
CLASSROOM. AND THAT'S HOW IT HAPPENED.
MY DAD OFTEN TOLD ME THAT
WATSON SAID TO HIM.
I AM THE ONLY PERSON IN THIS
COMPANY WHO COULD OFFER YOU A
JOB.
JOB.
JOB. >>
JOB. >> IS AND THAT SOMETHING.
WHAT DID HE FACE WITH HIS
COWORKERS.
COWORKERS. >>> SOME OF THE STORIES I TELL
IN THE BOOK ARE THINGS LIKE
BEING SENT BETWEEN A BUSINESS
MEETING THAT TURNED OUT TO BE
AN MEETING WITH A PROSTITUTE.
JUST INCREDIBLE STUFF.
GOING TO AN EDUCATIONAL CLASS.
TRYING TO LEARN HIS JOB AND
BEING THWARTED BY GIVING THE
WRONG DATE OR BEING GIVEN THE
WRONG DATA OR THE WRONG
INFORMATION.
INFORMATION. NOT THE QUIET EQUIPMENT ARE NOT
HAVING OPPORTUNITIES TO WORK ON
EQUIPMENT IN ORDER TO DO WHAT
HE NEEDED TO DO, IN ORDER TO
SUCCEED AT HIS JOB.
AND YET THROUGH ALL OF THAT HE
REALLY FOUGHT HARD AND
PERSEVERED.
PERSEVERED. >> HOW DID THAT MAKE HIM FEEL?
HOW DID THAT MANIFEST IN HIS
LIFE?
LIFE?
LIFE? >>
LIFE? >> ONE OF THE BIG CHALLENGES I
TALK ABOUT IN THE BOOK IS MY
DAD ALWAYS HAD A SENSE THAT
SOME OF THE CHALLENGES HE WAS
FACING WAS NOT BECAUSE OF WHAT
WAS GOING ON OUTSIDE OF HIM.
HE TURN IT INWARD AND THOUGHT
SOMEHOW HIS SKIN COLOR WAS THE
BIG PROBLEM IN, SO, I WAS
ALWAYS FACED WITH A FATHER WHO
LAMENTED THE FACT THAT HE WAS
OF A DARK SKIN COLOR AND THAT
WAS THE PROBLEM AS OPPOSED TO
LOOKING IN THE OUTSIDE WORLD.
>> BECAUSE HE THOUGHT THAT DARK
SKIN COLOR MEANT WANT?
>> HE THOUGHT THAT MEANT YOU
WERE LESS INTELLIGENT, LESS
CAPABLE AND LESS DESERVING.
AND I JUST COULD NOT FIGURE OUT
WHY.
WHY.
WHY. HERE
WHY. HERE IS A REALLY INTELLIGENT
GUY.
GUY.
GUY. THE
GUY. THE IBM CHAMPIONSHIP TEST TEAMS
FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS.
PLAYS A FOUR OR FIVE INSTRUMENTS
, AND OPERATIC BARITONE.
HE STILL COMES AWAY WITH THIS
VIEW OF HIMSELF AS BEING
NEGATIVE BECAUSE HE'S AN
AFRICAN-AMERICAN.
AFRICAN-AMERICAN. I FOUND THAT REALLY HARD.
>> I CAN EVEN IMAGINE AND THAT
WAS ONE OF THE MANY POINTS I HAD
TO PUT THE BOOK DOWN FOR A
MINUTE AND PROCESS BECAUSE THE
IDEA THAT YOU WOULD INTERNALIZE
THIS UGLY, UGLY THING, THIS
RACISM THAT WAS BEING COMMITTED
AGAINST YOU IS JUST SUCH A
PAINFUL, HORRIBLE THING.
AND YOU GUYS WERE UP AGAINST
SOCIAL MOVEMENTS THAT WERE
TAKING YOU IN ANY DIRECTION AND
CAUSING YOU TO KIND OF QUESTION
HOW HE WENT ABOUT HIS LIFE AND
HIS BUSINESS.
HIS BUSINESS. TELL ME A BIT ABOUT THAT AND
ABOUT YOUR OWN EMPLOYMENT AT
IBM.
IBM.
IBM. >>
IBM. >> IT WAS THE MIDDLE TO LATE
1960s WHEN YOU HAD SOCIAL
MOVEMENTS LIKE THE CIVIL RIGHTS
MOVEMENT AND THE BLACK POWER
MOVEMENT.
MOVEMENT.
MOVEMENT. FOR ME, THOSE WERE AFFIRMATIONS
OF WHO I WAS AS A PERSON IN
HERE I WAS COMING HOME TO MY
FATHER WHO WAS LAMENTING WHO HE
WAS AS A PERSON.
SO, THAT REALLY PRODUCED A KIND
OF CLASH.
OF CLASH.
OF CLASH. ALSO I WAS A TEENAGER AND SO
OBVIOUSLY THERE IS THE BUILT-IN
CLASH THAT WILL HAPPEN WITH A
TEENAGER AND HIS FATHER. BUT
ON TOP OF THAT WITH ALL THE
SOCIAL PRESSURES, YES, I DID GO
TO WORK WITH IBM BUT I WANTED
IBM TO KNOW THAT I WAS NOT MY
FATHER'S SON.
FATHER'S SON. >> LOOKING AT A PICTURE THERE.
TELL ME ABOUT THE SIGNIFICANCE
OF THIS PHOTO AND ALSO HOW YOU
STRODE INTO IBM WHEN YOU
ARRIVED.
ARRIVED.
ARRIVED. >> THAT IS A CLASSIC PICTURE IN
THE LATE 60s RADICAL.
AND IT'S VERY SIMILAR TO HOW I
WALKED INTO IBM.
I HAD A HUGE AFRO.
I HAD PORK CHOP SIDEBURNS, LIKE
THE PICTURE.
THE PICTURE. I HAD A BLUE, AND RED
PINSTRIPED SUIT SUIT.
ALMOST DOWN TO MY KNEES.
A BRIGHT RED TURTLENECK AND
WHAT I DID NOT GET INTO THE
BOOK WAS I ACTUALLY HOW DONNA
BROWN PATENT LEATHER SHOES.
PLATFORM SHOES WITH HEELS ON
THEM.
THEM.
THEM. >>
THEM. >> PERSONALLY I LOVE IT.
>> SO I LOOKS LIKE I STEPPED
OUT OF A BLACKSPLOITATION FILM
OF THE DAYS LIKE A SHAFT FILM
OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
AND I JUST WANTED IBM TO KNOW,
YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE TO DEAL
WITH ME ON MY TERMS.
NOT THE WAY MY FATHER MAY HAVE
DEALT WITH IBM.
>> YOU SHOULD HAVE A MUSICAL
SCORE.
SCORE.
SCORE. THAT SOUNDS VERY CINEMATIC.
>> THIS ANIMAL SCORE.
I WAS HUMMING ON MY FIRST DAY
TO WORK WAS, SHAFT.
BECAUSE I HAD JUST SEEN THAT
MOVIE THE NIGHT BEFORE.
>> IT PUT YOU IN THAT FRAME OF
MIND.
MIND.
MIND. HOW
MIND. HOW ARE YOUR EXPERIENCES
SIMILAR OR DISSIMILAR TO YOUR
FATHER ?
FATHER ?
FATHER ? >> AND SOME OF THE WAYS THEY
WERE SIMILAR WASN'T THE FIRST
DAY I WAS TOLD YOU CAN DRESS
LIKE THAT.
LIKE THAT. WHO ARE YOU?
THERE WAS A SENSE OF YOU ARE
NOT DOING WHAT YOU'RE SUPPOSED
TO DO.
TO DO.
TO DO. YOU ARE NOT BEING THE , QUOTE,
RIGHT BLACK PERSON FOR THE JOB.
SOME OF THE WAYS MY EXPENSES
WERE DIFFERENT WAS, BY THAT
TIME THERE WERE PEOPLE IN THE
COMPANY WHO WERE WILLING TO
ACCEPT ME BASED ON MY
INTELLIGENCE AS OPPOSED TO MY
SKIN COLOR AND THAT I REALLY,
REALLY APPRECIATED.
REALLY APPRECIATED. YES, I FACED SOME OF THE SAME
RACISM WHEN I TRY TO GO FOR
PROMOTIONS.
PROMOTIONS. I WAS DENIED THOSE PROMOTIONS.
MY DAD WAS TOO.
I ENDED UP FIGHTING IN WAYS
THAT MY DAD DID NOT FIGHT AND
THEN I LEARNED THAT MY DAD HAD
HIS OWN WAYS OF FIGHTING
AGAINST THE THINGS THAT WERE
HIS IMPEDIMENTS.
HIS IMPEDIMENTS. >> SO THERE WERE SOME WAYS IN
WHICH YOU COULD RECONCILE
YOURSELF WITH HIS APPROACH TO
LIFE.
LIFE.
LIFE. >>
LIFE. >> ABSOLUTELY.
>> ABSOLUTELY. WHEN MY DAD CAME BACK FROM THE
MARCH ON WASHINGTON AND HEARD
KING'S SPEAK I THINK IT CHANGED
AND PICK ONE OF THE THINGS I
LEARNED, WHICH I FOUND -- I
HAVE TO LAUGH AT NOW -- THE
BOTTOM OF ONE OF HIS DRESSER
DRAWERS, BENEATH HIS PLAYBOY
MAGAZINES, HE KEPT AN ENVELOPE
THAT HAD BOOTLEG COPIES OF THE
IBM ENTRANCE EXAMINATIONS AND
QUESTIONS.
QUESTIONS. WHICH HE USED IN A VERY HUSH-
HUSH MANNER TO HELP TUTOR YOUNG
BLACK MEN AND WOMEN FOR PASSING
THE ENTRANCE EXAM AND AM TO
IBM.
IBM.
IBM. >>
IBM. >> AND YOU DID NOT KNOW THAT AT
THE TIME.
THE TIME.
THE TIME. >> I DID NOT.
>> QUICKLY.
>> QUICKLY. YOUR FAMILY KNEW ONE OF THE
WOMEN WHO WAS PORTRAYED IN,
HIDDEN FIGURES, THE MOVIE.
AND I THINK A LOT OF US WHO
DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT HISTORY,
I KNEW NOTHING ABOUT IT. I
DON'T KNOW IF THAT SAYS
SOMETHING ABOUT THE WAY WE KEEP
HISTORY ARMY, BUT I REMEMBER
SEEING THAT MOVIE AND BEING
ANGRY THAT SOMEONE LIKE
KATHERINE JOHNSON COULD BE SO
INSTRUMENTAL IN THIS HISTORIC
ACHIEVEMENT AND HAVE BEEN
BASICALLY WRITTEN OUT OF
HISTORY UNTIL HOLLYWOOD DECIDES
TO WRITE A STORY ABOUT IT.
TO WHAT EXTENT DOES THAT YEAR A
SURE STILL EXIST IN TERMS OF
AFRICAN-AMERICAN ACHIEVEMENT IN
TECH AND RECOGNITION ?
>> AFTER HIDDEN FIGURES, MY
COUSIN SENT AROUND A PICTURE OF
DOROTHY VAUGHAN WITH HER AUNT
AND SOME OF THE OTHER FAMILY.
AND I THINK THE WAY IT EXISTS,
IT'S NOT HYPOTHETICAL OR
THEORETICAL.
THEORETICAL. RIGHT NOW IN HIGH-TECH FIELDS,
BLACK MEN ARE LESS THAN 2% OF
THE WORKFORCE.
THE WORKFORCE. BLACK WOMEN ARE LESS THAN 1% OF
THE WORKFORCE.
THE WORKFORCE. IT SHOULD NOT BE THAT WAY BASED
ON THE BATTLES MY DAD FOUGHT 70
YEARS AGO.
YEARS AGO. WE SHOULD SEE SOME PARODY,
CERTAINLY IN TERMS OF
PERCENTAGE OF THE POPULATION,
SO THAT NOW YOU HAVE AFRICAN-
AMERICANS ADVANCING TO THE
HIGHEST ROUNDS OF COMPANIES.
IN THE C SUITE AND THE BOARD OF
DIRECTORS SO THEY ARE MAKING
DECISIONS THAT RESULT IN
BRINGING MORE PEOPLE INTO THE
COMPANY SO YOU DON'T HAVE SOME
OF THESE PROBLEMS EXISTING.
AND AS WE STARTED THIS SEGMENT,
THAT'S WHY EVER THE BOOK.
THE PROBLEMS MY DAD FACED 70
YEARS AGO, SOME OF THEM ARE
STILL HERE TODAY.
>> I AM SO GLAD YOU POINTED
THIS OUT.
THIS OUT.
THIS OUT. HELPING US TO UNDERSTAND WE CAN
DO BETTER AND WE WILL ALL BE
IMPROVED WHEN THE DOORS ARE
OPEN.
OPEN.
OPEN. THANK YOU SO MUCH.
>> THANK YOU.