JOINING US NOW IS GLEN
KIRSCHNER, FORMER CAREER FEDERAL
PROSECUTOR, NOW AN MSNBC LEGAL
ANALYST.
GLEN, THIS IS SO STRIKING, ESPECIALLY THIS ALLEGATION THAT
ESPECIALLY THIS ALLEGATION THAT
MATT GAETZ AND RUDY GIULIANI WAS
SENDING EVERYONE TO MATT GAETZ
WITH FAIR ELECTION CLAIMS.
THEY ARE BEGGING THE TRUMP
PRESIDENCY FOR A PARDON FOR
HIMSELF.
>> LET’S START WITH THE OBVIOUS
OBSERVATION, LAWRENCE.
YOU.NET DON’T ASK FOR A PRESIDEN
PARDON UNLESS YOU’VE COMMITTED
CRIMES, UNLESS YOU NEED A
PRESIDENTIAL PARDON.
BUT IT’S NICE TO ACTUALLY HAVE
SOME SUPREME COURT PRECEDENT TO
LOOK TO TO PUT THIS INTO
CONTEXT.
MORE THAN 100 YEARS AGO, 1915,
THERE WAS A CASE CALLED THE
UNITED STATES AGAINST GEORGE
BURDICK, AND PRESIDENT WOODROW
WILSON ISSUED GEORGE BURDICK A
PARDON.
GEORGE SAID, I DON’T WANT ONE
BECAUSE I DON’T BELIEVE I
COMMITTED A CRIME.
THE SUPREME COURT SAID, A PARDON
CARRIES WITH IT AN IMPUTATION OF
GUILT, AND IF YOU ACCEPT A
PARDON, THAT IS VIRTUALLY A
CONFESSION OF GUILT.
SO IF WE EXTEND THE SUPREME
COURT RATIONALE TO MATT GAETZ,
WHAT DOES IT MEAN WHEN YOU
REQUEST A PARDON, WHEN YOU SPEAK
OUT A PARDON?
IT OBVIOUSLY, IF YOU APPLY THE
SAME RATIONALE, HAS AN
AMPUTATION OF GUILT AND COULD BE
VIEWED AS A CONFESSION OF GUILT.
>> THE "TIMES" IS REPORTING THAT
MATT GAETZ WAS ASKING NOT JUST
FOR HIMSELF, HE WANTED A GROUP
OF REPUBLICAN CONGRESSMEN TO GET
A PARDON, WHICH STRIKES ME AS
JUST KIND OF ASKING FOR COVER.
YOU KNOW, HE WANTS JIM JORDAN
AND A BUNCH OF OTHER PEOPLE TO
BE PARDONED, INCLUDING PEOPLE
WHO MIGHT NOT NEED ONE FOR ANY
REASON AT ALL SO THAT HIS PARDON
WON’T STAND OUT.
>> YOU KNOW WHAT, NOBODY WANTS
TO STAND IN A LINE-UP BY
THEMSELVES, BECAUSE THEN YOU’RE
THE ONE WHO IS GOING TO GET
PICKED.
LET’S SURROUND OURSELVES, LET’S
PUT OURSELVES IN A BAG OF
PARDONS AND THEN MAYBE I’LL GET
LOST IN THE MIX.
THAT’S IMPORTANT THAT HE WAS
ASKING FOR PARDONS FOR LOTS OF
FOLKS, BUT HE WAS ALSO ASKING
FOR A BLANKET PARDON, NOT A
TARGETED PARDON.
YOU COULD SEE IF MATT GAETZ WAS
HYPOTHETICALLY FACING A RECKLESS
DRIVING CHARGE AND HE SAID, MR.
PRESIDENT, I DON’T WANT TO
CONTEND WITH THIS RECKLESS
DRIVING CHARGE, SO I’D LIKE A
TARGETED PARDON FOR THAT.
NO, MATT GAETZ WANTED A BLANKET
PARDON.
WHAT DOES THAT MEAN?
IMT A
I WANT A PASS, MR. PRESIDENT,
FOR ALL CRIMES I HAVE EVER
COMMITTED IN ALL MY LIFE.
AND, LAWRENCE, THAT IS QUITE AN
ASK.
>>> THERE IS NEWS TONIGHT FROM
"POLITICO" ABOUT WHAT MIGHT BE
MATT GAETZ’ NEXT PUBLIC
APPEARANCE.
THEY SAY HE IS TO BE THE
FEATURED SPEAKER AT A PRO-TRUMP WOMEN’S SPEAKER EVENT THIS
WOMEN’S SPEAKER EVENT THIS
FRIDAY IN FLORIDA AT A TRUMP
COUNTRY CLUB THERE.
IT SAYS, THE ORGANIZATION
PRAISED GAETZ AS ONE OF THE FEW MEMBERS OF CONGRESS WILLING TO
MEMBERS OF CONGRESS WILLING TO
STAND UP AND FIGHT ON BEHALF OF
PRESIDENT TRUMP AND HIS AMERICA
FIRST AGENDA.
IT IS LIKELY WE WON’T HEAR ANY
FACTS ON THIS CASE.
>> PROBABLY NOT, BUT THEY WILL
BE LISTENING KEENLY, BECAUSE
MATT GAETZ IS ALWAYS MAKING
ADMISSIONS.