>>> I HAVE SAID FROM THE BEGINNING THAT THESE ARE VERY
SERIOUS ALLEGATIONS, AND SHE
DESERVES TO BE HEARD.
>> DO YOU FEEL LIKE THESE
ALLEGATIONS ARE CREDIBLE, ARE
THEY DISQUALIFYING?
THEY DISQUALIFYING? >> I CANNOT MAKE THAT
DETERMINATION.
DETERMINATION. I SHOULD NOT MAKE THAT
DETERMINATION.
DETERMINATION. THAT WOULD BE LIKE THE QUESTIONS
THAT WERE ASKED OF JUDGE
KAVANAUGH WHEN HE WAS
TESTIFYING.
TESTIFYING. >> THOSE ARE REPUBLICAN SENATORS
SUSAN COLLINS AND LISA MURKOWSKI
ABOUT THE SEXUAL ASSAULT
ALLEGATIONS MADE AGAINST SUPREME
COURT NOMINEE BRETT KAVANAUGH.
KAVANAUGH IS AT THE WHITE HOUSE
AS ALLIES TRY TO BOLSTER HIS
CHARACTER.
CHARACTER. >> I REMIND YOU MURKOWSKI AND
COLLINS CALLED FOR AL FRANKEN TO
STEP DOWN, AND HE DIDN’T HAVE
DUE PROCESS.
DUE PROCESS. SUPPORTERS OF KAVANAUGH ARE
CALLING INTO QUESTION PROFESSOR
CHRISTINE BLASEY FORD’S MEMORY
OF THE ALLEGED ASSAULT, ALONG
WITH THE 36 YEARS THAT PASSED
BETWEEN THEN AND NOW.
THESE METHODS OF DISCREDITING A
WOMAN’S ACCUSATION AGAINST A
MAN, ESPECIALLY ONE WITH
SIGNIFICANT POLITICAL, SOCIAL,
OR FINANCIAL POWER, ARE NOTHING
NEW TO SEX CRIMES INVESTIGATORS.
>> JOINING US NOW IS DOUG
WIDGOR.
WIDGOR. HE’S A FORMALER PROSECUTOR WHO
NOW REPRESENTS SEXUAL HARASSMENT
AND ASSAULT SURVIVORS.
WE’RE A FEW DAYS INTO THIS NOW
WE CAN SORT OF DIG INTO SOME OF
THE SPECIFICS.
THE SPECIFICS. PROFESSOR FORD HAS SAID SHE
CAN’T REMEMBER A LOT OF THE
DETAILS.
DETAILS. NOW, I THINK IT’S FAIR TO SAY
THAT MOST OF US DON’T REMEMBER A
LOT OF DETAILS, BUT THAT IS
SOMETHING THAT PEOPLE WHO ARE
CRITICAL OF HER USE TO ATTACK
HER CREDIBILITY?
HER CREDIBILITY? >> YEAH, THAT’S CORRECT.
IT IS NOT UNCOMMON FOR SOMEBODY
WHO HAS BEEN SEXUALLY ASSAULTED,
FIRST OF ALL, NOT TO COME OUT
IMMEDIATELY.
IMMEDIATELY. WE ALL KNOW THAT.
THE ME, TOO, MOVEMENT HAS REALLY
SHED SOME LIGHT ON THAT.
WHAT’S INTERESTING, ACTUALLY IS
SENATOR HATCH YESTERDAY SAID IN
A CONVERSATION WITH JUDGE
KAVANAUGH THAT JUDGE KAVANAUGH
ACTUALLY REMEMBERS THAT HE
WASN’T AT THE PARTY.
>> RIGHT.
>> RIGHT. >> I JUST HAD MY 50th BIRTHDAY
OVER THE WEEKEND AND I WAS
THINKING BACK TO THE 1980s, I
CAN’T RECALL WHICH PARTIES I
WENT TO, THAT’S FOR SURE.
THERE ARE A LOT OF FACTS THAT
SUBSTANTIATE PROFESSOR FORD’S
CLAIMS.
CLAIMS. WE HAVE HER PASSING A LIE
DETECTOR, POLYGRAPH TEST.
SHE HAS EXCELLENT COUNSEL WHO IS
WELL THOUGHT OF.
SHE CAME IN 2012 SHE PRESENTED
THIS TO HER PSYCHOLOGIST BEFORE
JUDGE KAVANAUGH WAS A SUPREME
COURT NOMINEE.
COURT NOMINEE. SHE PUT SOMEBODY IN THE ROOM.
IF SHE WAS GOING TO MAKE THIS
UP, WOULD SHE PUT ANOTHER
PERSON --
PERSON -- >> AND THE PERSON IS AN ALLY.
>> RIGHT, HE’S A KAVANAUGH ALLY.
ALSO INTERESTINGLY IN HIS BOOK
AND THE YEARBOOK, IT PAINTS A
VERY DISTURBING PICTURE OF THE
ENVIRONMENT THAT WAS GOING ON
THERE.
THERE. >> HIS YEARBOOK PAGE WHERE HE
SAYS WOMEN SHOULD BE GONGED
OCCASIONALLY.
OCCASIONALLY. >> ASK THE DRINKING THAT WAS
GOING ON.
GOING ON. >> SO THERE’S SOME SERIOUS
THINGS THAT ACTUALLY ARE IN HER
FAVOR.
FAVOR. ON THE FLIP SIDE, IN JUDGE
KAVANAUGH’S DEFENSE THERE ARE
SOME THINGS IN HIS FAVOR AS
WELL.
WELL. I MEAN, USUALLY IN THESE TYPES
OF CASES THESE ARE NOT ONE-OFFS.
THE HEARINGS MONDAY MAYBE OTHER
PEOPLE WILL COME OUT.
AS FAR AS WE KNOW THERE ARE NO
OTHER WOMEN WHO HAVE PROTESTED
OR SAID ANYTHING NEGATIVE ABOUT
JUDGE KAVANAUGH.
JUDGE KAVANAUGH. ONE THING THAT STICKS OUT IN MY
MIND IN PARTICULAR IS I WAS A
FORMER LAW CLERK.
LAW CLERKS ARE VERY CLOSE TO
THEIR JUDGES.
THEIR JUDGES. THEY GET TO KNOW THEIR JUDGE
VERY WELL.
VERY WELL. HE HAD A LOT OF WOMEN WHO WERE
LAW CLERKS.
LAW CLERKS. NONE OF THEM HAVE SAID ANYTHING.
SO THOSE ARE THE SORTS OF THINGS
THAT ARE IN HIS COLUMN.
MONDAY IS GOING TO BE
FASCINATING TV.
FASCINATING TV. A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BE
HOME AND TAKE OFF FROM WORK TO
WATCH IT.
WATCH IT. >> DO YOU THINK MONDAY IS A GOOD
IDEA?
IDEA? DO YOU THINK THE PUBLIC HEARINGS
ARE A GOOD IDEA?
ANITA HILL WROTE A PIECE SAYING
HOLD ON A SECOND.
>> THEY DON’T HAVE ANY BETTER
SYSTEMS THAN BACK THEN.
>> IF YOU THINK ABOUT WHAT SHE
WENT THROUGH PERSONALLY,
PROFESSIONALLY, I MEAN, BRUTAL.
>> I’VE GIVEN THAT A LOT OF
THOUGHT.
THOUGHT. I’M NOT SURE MONDAY IS GOING TO
HAPPEN.
HAPPEN. A LOT COULD HAPPEN BETWEEN NOW
AND MONDAY.
AND MONDAY. >> WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY THAT?
>> OTHER THINGS COULD COME OUT.
MAYBE SOMEBODY WHO WAS AT THAT
PARTY SAYS HOLD ON A SECOND,
JUDGE KAVANAUGH WAS THERE AND
THAT SORT OF REFUTES WHAT HE
SAID TO SENATOR HATCH.
ANOTHER WOMAN COULD COME
FORWARD.
FORWARD. JUDGE KAVANAUGH COULD DECIDE THE
SPECTACLE IS NOT IN THE BEST
INTERESTS OF MY FAMILY AND I
WANT TO GO BACK TO THE D.C.
CIRCUIT WITH MY REPUTATION
INTACT.
INTACT. BUT THERE IS NO PERFECT SYSTEM.
WHEN SOMEBODY ACCUSES SOMEONE OF
SEXUAL ASSAULT, THEIR
CREDIBILITY IS IMPORTANT.
SO DIFFICULT QUESTIONS WILL NO
DOUBT BE ASKED OF PROFESSOR FORD
AND DIFFICULT QUESTIONS OF JUDGE
KAVANAUGH, WHICH WILL -- IT IS
NOT A TRIAL.
I MEAN, THE SENATE’S ROLE HERE
PURSUANT TO THE CONSTITUTION IS
TO PROVIDE ADVICE AND CONSENT.
>> RIGHT.
>> RIGHT. AND NOT TO DETERMINE GUILT OR
INNOCENCE?
INNOCENCE? >> EXACTLY.
>> EXACTLY. IF THERE IS A -- I MEAN, I’VE
SEEN PEOPLE SAY EVEN IF IT’S
TRUE HE SHOULD BE CONFIRMED.
I CERTAINLY DON’T AGREE WITH
THAT THAT’S FOR SURE.
>> THIS IS WHERE THE RUBBER HITS
THE ROAD THAT I KEEP HEARING
THINGS ARE SO DIFFERENT.
SO MUCH HAS CHANGED SINCE THE
199
199 1990s, BUT SADLY I DON’T SEE
THAT.
THAT. I SEE THAT THE ME, TOO, MOVEMENT
EXISTS, BUT IF THIS IS A REPEAT
OF WHAT HAPPENED TO ANITA HILL,
LOOK AT TWITTER, AND LOOK AT HOW
PROFESSOR FORD IS GETTING
ATTACKED, HER CHARACTER
ASSASSINATED RIGHT NOW.
THINGS DON’T SEEM DIFFERENT AT
ALL.
ALL. IF YOU LOOK AT THE REPUBLICANS
THAT ARE ON THE JUDICIARY
COMMITTEE, IT IS A LINEUP OF
WHITE GUYS OVER THE AGE OF 50.
THIS IS A PRESIDENT WHO
VOLUNTARILY A YEAR AGO --
REMEMBER WHEN HE SPOKE TO "THE
NEW YORK TIMES," HE SAID BILL
O’REILLY HE SHOULD TAKE THOSE
WOMEN TO COURT.
I KNOW HE’S A GOOD GUY.
>> HE ACTUALLY SAID THEY WEREN’T
TELLING THE TRUTH BEFORE HE EVEN
MET OR SPOKE TO THESE WOMEN.
>> HOW CAN WE SAY THINGS ARE SO
DIFFERENT?
DIFFERENT? IT’S EXACTLY THE SAME.
>> WHAT I THINK IS DIFFERENT, OF
COURSE THERE ARE FRINGE PEOPLE
ON THE RIGHT AND THE LEFT WHO
ARE GOING TO SAY CRAZY THINGS ON
TWITTER ASK SOCIAL MEDIA.
THAT’S UNFORTUNATE, OF COURSE.
I THINK MOST PEOPLE TODAY WHO
ARE WATCHING THIS, YOU KNOW, THE
90% OF THE PEOPLE, MAYBE 85% OF
THE PEOPLE VIEW SEXUAL ASSAULT
ALLEGATIONS VERY DIFFERENTLY.
I THINK THE ATTITUDES HAVE
CHANGED WHERE IF A WOMAN COMES
FORWARD AND SAID THAT SOMETHING
HAPPENED 30-SOMETHING YEARS AGO,
IT’S NOT AUTOMATICALLY DISMISSED
AS SHE SHOULD HAVE COME FORWARD
BACK IN THE 1980s, THEREFORE IF
HE
HE SHE DIDN’T COME FORWARD SHE
SHOULD NOT HAVE HER DAY IN
COURT.
COURT. PEOPLE HAVE BEEN EDUCATED TO
KNOW THAT SEXUAL ASSAULT VICTIMS
DON’T ALWAYS COME FORWARD.
A LOT OF THEM DON’T COME FORWARD
FOR DECADES BECAUSE THEY DON’T
WANT TO BRING THOSE THINGS
FORWARD.
FORWARD. THEY DON’T WANT THEIR
CREDIBILITY
CREDIBILITY CREDIBILITY ATTACKED.
CREDIBILITY ATTACKED. THERE’S A WHOLE HOST OF REASONS
WHY THAT HAS CHANGED.
I DO THINK EVEN THOUGH THEY ARE
WHITE MEN, REPUBLICANS, THAT
THEY WILL TREAT THE VICTIM
DIFFERENTLY.
DIFFERENTLY. I BELIEVE THEY WILL.
LET’S SEE WHAT HAPPENS.
>> ORRIN HATCH DID SAY YESTERDAY
SHE WAS MIXED UP.
>> I THINK THAT WILL COME BACK
TO HAUNT HIM.
I THINK WHAT MIGHT COME BACK TO
HAUNT JUDGE KAVANAUGH IS THIS
THING HE WASN’T EVEN AT -- I
CAN’T UNDERSTAND -- HOW DOES HE
KNOW?
KNOW? >> I WISH I COULD REMEMBER.
>> THAT MAKES NO SENSE.
>> HE’S GOT TO BE ABLE TO SAY
SOMEWHERE IN A TEN-YEAR PERIOD
HE WASN’T AT ANY PARTIES EVER AT
ANYBODY’S HOUSE.
ANYBODY’S HOUSE. >> WILL JUDGE KAVANAUGH SUBMIT
TO A LIE DETECTOR TEST?
THEY’RE NOT ADMISSIBLE NO COURT,
BUT THIS IS NOT COURT.
WE KNOW THAT VARIOUS AGENCIES