Jen, I'll bring that to you.
I want you to listen
to what
the former president said
about while
he was there at Rice Street,
and then we'll talk about
contrasting that
with the experience of some of the people
he targeted over
these last several years. Let's play it.
Terrible experience.
I came in.
I was treated very nicely but
it is what it is.
I took a mug shot,
which I never heard the words mug shot
that was impeach me
there at the Wharton School of Finance.
And I have to go through a process
that it's election interference.
He was in and out in 20 minutes.
But if you contrast that
with some of the people,
he focused on
the individuals, Ruby Freeman, Shea
Moss over the last several years
who said that
they could not go to grocery stores
they were afraid to go out.
People came to their homes.
What do you hear there,
the president's
description of his experience?
I just don't think he gets it.
And I think, you know,
when we see the Marjorie Taylor Greene
MAGA mug shot,
there seems to be a real disconnect
from reality.
Look, Rye Street
is is a jail that is awful.
No question.
People are dying there
because the conditions
are so absolutely deplorable.
So the fact that he basically got this
this great treatment,
he comes in 20 minutes in and out.
Right. Done and done.
And somehow
that was awful and bad when the reality
is, people
that get booked every day there
and that have their mug shots taken
and that actually have to be in
jail there.
This is very, very serious.
And so, you know,
for all of these people
doing these MAGA mug
shots, for whatever
reason they're doing it,
they just have no understanding
what this really stands for.
I mean, this this is not good, right?
He is in significant legal trouble.
And so whether he thinks
this is more of a political thing
that he needs to massage or not,
as a lawyer,
he needs to stand down
and really focus on his defense
because he is facing serious allegations
that could end him up
with serious time in prison.
In that mug
shot, it's
not going to really mean anything
at the end of the day if he's locked up.
Because, you know, Georgia
so well is
if Trump is convicted
on these charges in state court,
if it doesn't get removed to federal,
would he go to that jail first?
Yeah, that one.
Yes, he would be he would be held there
until they sent him to whatever prison
he is.
They take shine to him
if he got jail time.
Trump was arrested, booked,
photographed, fingerprinted.
Now, as an inmate, no
he was
then released under a bond agreement.
He did not pay the full $200,000
instead of use the bail bonding company.
Joining us now, criminal defense attorney
and former
prosecutor in Fulton
County, Clint Rucker,
Jeremy Saarland and Jen
Durden are back with us.
Clint, I'm starting with you
because you're joining the conversation
for the sheriff
who said that
until somebody tells him different,
the president, former
president is going to be treated
like everybody else.
How close to everybody else
was this process for Trump?
Well,
again, good morning
and thank you for having me.
I will tell you that
the former president was treated
like every other defendant
in as much as he was required
to post a bond
to actually appear personally
at the Fulton County Jail
and go through the normal
booking process,
which included
the surrendering of his fingerprints
and the taking of a mug shot photo.
The mechanism for accomplishing
that, though, was quite unusual.
And in as much as his status
as the former president
presented certain security concerns.
And so
they were able to work out that protocol.
But inasmuch as we are now able to see
unfortunately,
a former elected
president of the United States
being booked and charged with a felony
and have his mug shot
photo plastered across every newspaper
almost in the world is really tragic.
It is sort of.
So we just got the papers
if they weren't even here by the time
the show started early five.
But here's a Wall Street Journal.
Rupert Murdoch, Wall Street Journal.
Trump's right on the front.
They're a little smaller on The Times.
Washington Post, same thing.
And this is going to be not just here
but around the world.
Jeremy, let's just push forward to
Monday.
Mark Meadows goes
before a judge wants to get
this thing moved to federal court.
And that would
and Trump would want that, too.
So where does that go on Monday?
Meaning?
So there will be a hearing
happens Monday.
And when do we know the outcome?
So there will be a hearing on Monday,
and they'll get it going to be
witnesses called on Monday.
And this is not going to be
just some light hearing.
It's going to have substance.
Correct. Correct.
For Georgia, so. Correct.
Absolutely correct.
So the issue is going to be,
as I've noted many times before,
not whether or not
these folks
meeting Meadows,
for example, and Clark and Trump
were actually serving as officers,
although whether Trump is in office
was a separate question.
It's more of whether or not their actions
while they were serving
were furthering their roles
as whatever role
they had, not doing
something beyond the scope
of their duties in that position.
So I think it's going to be difficult
for the defense to articulate that.
And it doesn't have to be a term
proven beyond a reasonable doubt.
That's not the rule anyway,
but it just has to be culpable enough
to get them past that threshold.
But even that low threshold
is not going to be so easy,
because what are they doing
in the state of Georgia?
Why they mingling in the state of Georgia
and the rights of those residents
to vote and have their vote counted?
That's a difficult hurdle.
When is there going to be an answer?
Not that day.
How much do you think we will learn
that we don't know already from
the indictment on Monday?
You're going to hear from
potential witnesses
that you would not have heard of in
the grand jury
that are not initially set
forth in the four corners
of an indictment.
So you will likely learn more
because you're going
to have an opportunity
to hear directly from them.
I mean, two of the attorneys
that were representing
Trump World, right,
in that we're on that call
with Raffensperger
and Meadows have been subpoenaed as well
as was the investigator.
I think your name is Frances Watson.
And so the whole point
is to show exactly what did Meadows do?
Who did he talk to?
What was he asking?
Because just
because he was the chief of staff
for the president
just doesn't mean well,
then he gets this special treatment,
right?
And really what
finally Willis is office
what their argument is, is
what he was doing was really in violation
of the law,
not in terms of the indictment,
but the Hatch Act. Right.
When you are in your public office.
Right.
You cannot even be personal gain
or any kind of electioneering
or kind of political activity.
So you can't
then say, well,
I was doing this political activity
in electioneering,
but I was the chief of staff.
Ergo, I get this protection.
It falls outside of that claim.
Given your extensive experience
in Fulton County
as a former prosecutor there
October 23rd 59 days from now as a
trial start
if they get it
because one of the lawyers, Kenneth
Shrewsberry, wants a speedy trial
which defendants have a right to fining
Willis his team already for that
no problem
Listen.
After 25 years
of experience in that office
and having worked personally
with finally Willis I can tell you
that her team is ready
and prepared to go.
They were ready for trial
when the indictment was handed down.
Those folks have got
their witnesses lined up
and they've got their trial notebooks
all set.
And when October comes,
they'll be prepared.
And a bit of quick insight
The fact that there are 19 people
on this indictment
under RICO,
this is not unprecedented
for this office.
D.A.
Willis and myself
a few years ago
had a RICO case in which 35
individuals were indicted under RICO.
21 of those individuals
entered into negotiated
guilty pleas and accepted responsibility
and testified during the trial with 12
that actually were tried together
It's the longest criminal jury trial
in Georgia history,
a little more than eight months.
But the complex was able to accommodate
all those defendants, all those lawyers
all the evidence.
And we were able to present
a comprehensive case to the jury.
And 11 of the 12 received
guilty convictions.
And so
the prospect of this case
is not overwhelming or unprecedented
for this defense team in this office.
They certainly have
a lot of experience in Rico,
including an ongoing one right now.
Appreciate it.
Very good to have all your perspective.