OR SAYING HE’S OPEN TO ONE IS
THAT DESPERATION GETTING REALLY
DANGEROUS AND SCARY.
GENERAL JACK KEANE BACK WITH US.
ALWAYS LIKE TALKING TO THE
GENERAL.
GENERAL, YOU OFTEN REMIND ME,
SIR, ABOUT YOU KNOW, A LEADER
THAT IS TRAPPED, WOUNDED ANIMAL,
IN A CORNER CAN LASH OUT IN ALL
SORTS OF WAYS.
CLEARLY SENDING A SIGNAL TO
ENGULF THE REST OF THE WORLD
WITH HIM.
WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF IT?
>> WELL, I THINK MOSTLY THE
THREAT OF A NUCLEAR WEAPONS IS
ABOUT FEAR MONGERING.
WHAT HE’S ATTEMPTING TO DO IS
CLEARLY -- HE’S LOSING THIS WAR.
DOESN’T MEAN HE’S GOING TO LOSE
IT.
CERTAINLY IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR
THE UKRAINIANS TO INFLICT THAT
ON HIM.
THEY DO HAVE THE MOMENTUM.
THAT’S ALL GOOD.
CERTAINLY WHAT HE WANTS TO DO IS
CUT OFF THE SUPPORT.
HE KNOWS THE SUPPORT THAT THEY
HAVE RECEIVED FROM THE UNITED
STATES AND THE U.K. AND OTHER
COUNTRIES HAS BEEN DECISIVE AND
HELPING UKRAINIANS ACHIEVE THIS
MOMENTUM.
WHEN EVERYBODY TALKS ABOUT,
WELL, IT’S PART OF THE DNA FOR
THEM TO USE TACTICAL NUCLEAR
WEAPONS IF THEY’RE FIGHTING A
WAR, THAT IS -- THAT SCENARIO IS
WHEN THEY’RE FIGHTING A WAR
AGAINST A SUPER POWER LIKE THE
UNITED STATES.
WE HAVE TO UNPACT THIS A LITTLE
BIT SO IT MAKES SENSE TO THE
AMERICAN PEOPLE IN TERMS OF WHAT
THE CONSEQUENCES ARE.
MILITARILY, ONE TACTICAL NUCLEAR
WEAPON WOULD NOT DO THE DAMAGE
THAT PUTIN WOULD WANT TO DO TO
THE UKRAINIAN FORCES AND A
DISPOSITION OF THEIR PEOPLE AS
WELL.
BUT POLITICALLY PROBABLY ONE
WOULD BE SUFFICE.
WHAT WOULD BE THE CONSEQUENCES
OF THAT?
FIRST OF ALL, THEY HAVE TO DEAL
WITH THE RADIATION THEMSELVES.
RUSSIAN FORCES ON THE GROUND AND
POSSIBLY THE RUSSIAN PEOPLE
THEMSELVES.
SO THAT IS ATER TERRIBLE
CONSEQUENCE FOR HIM.
A NUCLEAR WEAPON IN EUROPE
GUARANTEES THAT THE UNITED
STATES WOULD ENTER THE WAR AND
NATO.
THAT MEANS FOR A FACT PUTIN
LOSES.
THERE’S NO DOUBT.
IF THE UNITED STATES CAME IN
UNILATERALLY, HE LOSES.
>> Neil: HOW DOES THIS END,
GENERAL?
HOW DOES IT END?
YOU THINK ABOUT IT, HIS OPTIONS
ARE FEW.
HE CAN’T LEAVE WITHOUT
SOMETHING, RIGHT?
JUST TALKED TO A PARLIAMENT
MEMBER THAT SAYS HE’S NOT
LEAVING WITH OUR LAND.
THAT’S FOR SURE.
HE’S NOT LEAVING, TAKING THE
EASTERN PROVINCES AND MAKING
THEM HIS OWN.
THAT’S NOT HAPPENING.
WHAT DOES HE GO BACK TO TO SHOW
THE RUSSIAN PEOPLE FOR ALL OF
THIS?
>> YEAH, I THINK WHERE HIS HEAD
IS NOW -- AFTER THE DONBAS
REGION, HE WASN’T ABLE TO BE
SUCCESSFUL THERE.
40% SUCCESSFUL.
AFTER THIS COUNTER OFFENSIVE, HE
KNOWS FULL WELL THAT THIS WAR
DOESN’T END IN WEEKS OR MONTHS.
THAT HE’S IN A PROTRACTED WAR
AND HE’S PLAYING FOR THE LONG
GAME, NEIL.
WHAT HE WANTS IS WEAR AND TEAR
ON THE THE UKRAINIAN PEOPLE AND
YOU DISCUSSED THIS YOURSELF.
THEY GET WORE DOWN BY THE
CASUALTIES, LOSS OF LIFE TO
FAMILIES.
THE SECOND THING, HE’S COUNTING
ON THE EUROPEANS AND THE UNITED
STATES AND MOSTLY THE EUROPEANS
TO GET WORN DOWN.
ENERGY CRISIS THIS COMING
WINTER, INFLATION --
>> Neil: SOME OF THEM ARE,
GENERAL.
THEY’RE TIRED OF IT.
>> OH, THERE’S NO DOUBT.
LISTEN, THE GERMANS AND THE
FRENCH HAVE NEVER BEEN IN THIS
THING, NEIL.
SO HE SEES THAT.
HE’S PLAYING FOR THE LONG GAME
HERE.
THAT’S WHAT HE WANTS.
I STILL THINK IN HIS MIND HE CAN
STILL TAKE MUCH OF THAT SOUTHERN
COAST AND CALL IT A DAY AT SOME
POINT THROUGH NEGOTIATIONS AS A
RESULT OF THAT.
THAT I THINK IS KIND OF AND END
GAME.
WE CAN ONLY SPECULATE.
THE IDEA OF HIM USING A NUCLEAR
WEAPON AND THE CONSEQUENCE OF
THAT WAR EXPANDING AND
GUARANTEEING HIM A LOSS THEN,
THAT IS REMOTE.
CERTAINLY A POSSIBILITY BECAUSE
HE’S THROWING IT OUT THERE.
BUT I THINK IT’S LARGELY FEAR
MONGERING.
>> Neil: LET US HOPE SO.