(upbeat music)
- Ryan Spahn is a jack-of-all trades creator.
In addition to his numerous stage and screen credits,
he has also served as a writer and a director.
Fun fact, he was also the cinematographer of Broadway.com's
award-winning live stream "Buyer & Cellar"
starring his long-time love, Michael Urie.
Now Spahn has adapted "Nora Highland,"
a show he wrote for last year's Pride Plays into a movie.
I spoke with him about the pandemic-produced project
and staying creative.
Ryan Spahn, it's so good to see you.
Thank you for joining me.
- Oh my gosh, thanks for having me, how's it goin'?
(Ryan chuckling)
- They're all hanging in there as best we can.
I'm so happy to be talking to you.
- Likewise, that is true.
We are hanging in.
- Yes, how are you doing during this time?
I know that is a loaded question right now,
but you have created a wonderful film.
- [Ryan] Thank you, thank you.
- It's so amazing.
"Nora Highland" is this project
that I know started off as a play.
- That's correct.
- Yes, it premiered I believe last year
during the Pride Plays Festival at the
Rattlestick Playwrights' Theater.
Can you tell me a little bit about,
how do you describe "Nora Highland?"
- The play started, it's a two-hander.
It's designed as a two-hander,
which means that one male and one female identifying actor
play all the parts all the way through.
And then I had that premiered
for it's first audience during the Pride Plays Festival
as you said in 2019.
And that was the first time an audience heard it.
And then the following spring, the pandemic hit
and Jeremy Wein who runs Play-PerView,
asked me to do a digital reading of the play.
And so Michael Urie and Tessa Thompson read the two parts
all the way through as a fundraising event.
And then when I watched it,
I realized how suited it was for the digital space.
And I think what one of the struggles
has been as both a performer and a viewer,
is that a lot of things you watch that are virtual,
that weren't meant to be virtual.
You can feel that they were not meant to be virtual.
And I felt like when I watched "Nora Highland"
being presented as a play on this format,
I realized pretty quickly how suited it was for that.
And so I started changing the script
to be a six or eight person cast
and changed all of the scenes
to be either a found footage camera situation,
or a Zoom meeting.
The whole entire film was shot on Zoom
and everyone had to practically shoot themselves.
And it really I think is successful in being a piece
that feels intended for the format that it's presented on,
which I think is what is really exciting about both the film
and the pandemic filming experience (Ryan chuckling)
which is its own weird thing.
- Absolutely, but it's so cool to see what,
I consider you a multi-hyphenate creator.
And so I think it's so amazing that you've taken this on
in this way and have made the pivot from stage to screen.
Now "Nora Highland" deals with the subject matter,
that I feel like I, having a lot of friends,
both in the theater community and just friends
that are performers elsewhere,
I feel like the subject matter has come up a lot
in conversations I've had with friends.
And I always appreciate a show
that tackles a conversation like that.
For those that don't know,
can you sort of unpack the subject matter of "Nora Highland"
without giving anything away? - Of course,
of course.
So "Nora Highland" examines the casting process
of the revival of a Broadway show
that was very successful 20 years ago
in which the central character is an openly gay character,
and there's discrepancy about who
should be playing that role.
And so I took three sort of situations
in which this could be discussed.
So it's breaks down into three parts.
And so the first part is a casting actor
and a casting director.
The second part is a meeting
between the director of the revival
and an actor that this person is very interested
in meeting for the role.
And then the third scene is an L.G.B.T. gala
in which they're honoring somebody.
And I feel like those three situations,
both in my personal life and in my professional life,
I have witnessed this sort of very, very,
very deeply rooted homophobia
that still is percolating throughout the industry.
- Yes, I think, not to spoil anything.
I believe the film starts with this list.
(music)
As someone that has a lot of friends within
that community, it was again,
I've heard friends talk about this in terms
of their casting experiences
and in terms of representation in general
in T.V. and film,
but laying it out that way was so jarring.
And even just the speeches you took from real life
in your trailer, that made me so,
I feel like excited is the wrong word.
Because it is definitely something
that I think we are evaluating,
but I think it's so interesting
that this is the subject matter that inspired your art.
So what was--
- 'Cause I think exciting is the right word.
I would argue that that is actually the right word
'cause I think change and conversation can happen
if people get excited about things.
And I think we've hit a point in our culture
where it's very hard for people with opposing views
to get excited to talk to each other.
And I think this is a conversation
that needs to be happening amongst people
who don't see the position I have
and need to see it, along with people who deeply see it.
They need to be able to express it in a succinct
and compelling way in order for there
to be an exciting conversation to happen around it.
And I think that my goal and my dream
is for this film to just open up conversations
with people who just aren't aware at the subtle
and not so subtle ways in which they are homophobic,
really is what it boils down to.
And what's tricky is so many people say
that assemble a cast based on the best people
that they saw in the room for a specific role,
which I want to believe.
And I want to believe that that is true,
but the reality is,
is that the same kind of person, the same types,
the same prototypes are the people who are often
in those rooms the most.
And therefore they're stronger at the audition process.
They're stronger in those situations.
They are bolder and brighter
because they've literally worked the muscle
of being presented in that way.
And so when they're against somebody who's being undervalued
and underused, and they're all placed in the same pool,
that that person who is probably better for the role,
isn't gonna shine in that specific environment.
And I think that a show like "Pose" is a shining example of
that, because I feel like if you've seen it,
have you seen "Pose?"
- [Lindsey] Oh, absolutely.
- Okay, so in my opinion, the first couple of episodes,
I was like, "Oh, how's this gonna go?"
'Cause some of these actors felt very new to acting
or new, to acting with this much on their plate.
And then I think as the series went
on through the first season
and particularly into the second season,
everyone is extraordinary on this show.
And it just proves that if you give somebody a chance,
if you give them a moment to figure it out, they will.
But if you're deciding on somebody who's best in the room,
who's best in the moment, who's the best for the job,
you're gonna miss an entire world of person
who is probably better suited to telling certain stories.
And then once those people have the strength
and the power within those stories,
they'll be allowed to perform in other stories.
Because I don't believe
that only people should stay in their lane.
But I do think if all lanes are open,
they need to be all open for everyone.
They can't just be open for this straight cis demographic.
That's just not.
'Cause then the more that those people who identify
that way come into the other smaller categories,
the people who are only allowed in those categories
get pushed out and it becomes a messier, dicier situation.
- What was the moment that you were like,
"Oh, this is a play."
- I was running into a lot of problems with that.
And I'm partnered with somebody who a lot of people know
in this industry and he's a well-known actor
and he's a well-known name.
And so I'll walk into situations in which immediately
that's what we're talking about.
And so my individuality feels kind of lost,
or my privacy feels lost.
And I feel like that was coming up so much.
And and most of the time probably wasn't affecting
what jobs I was and was not getting,
or what encounters I was and was not succeeding at.
But some of them it did.
And that coupled with the other stuff
that anyone who's queer deals with,
it just started to just build inside of me.
And I started writing that first scene
between the young actor and the casting director.
And that's all true.
All of those things have been said to me.
The thinly veiled ways in which people say,
"Butch it up," basically.
Or the way that they give you a note to be a certain type
of guy before you've even auditioned,
spoken a word of the script.
There's an assumption about what you're gonna do,
just based on what they think they know about you.
And I can call a friend who went in for the same role
and be like, "Hey, did that person do this to you?"
And, and the response will be,
"Oh, no, no, no, we didn't.
"We went right on, we talked about other things."
And so I feel like there's a definite thing that people do.
And I don't know how to wrap my head around it.
And so I'm hoping that "Nora Highland"
helps people wrap their head around it,
particularly people in power.
- You have taken it upon yourself
to adapt this play into a film.
Can you tell me a little bit about your process
of making a film
and working remotely with some of my favorite talents?
- Yeah, of course.
Yeah, this cast couldn't be better.
And I would say most of them have never met in person.
So that was one of the more interesting things.
So for instance, the second scene,
which is a conversation between two very old friends,
between Marin Ireland and Michael Hsu Rosen,
they had never met in person
and they had to find a history through Zoom rehearsals.
We rehearsed it a bunch,
and then we recorded it in one take.
So it's like a 40-minute take.
And then I played with time,
I would speed things up or I would do different things to it
in the editing room.
But it is one single take, and we only did it once.
And that was exciting, that was thrilling.
And that was theatrical for us.
And all three of us are theater people.
And so when it was happening, when it was done,
we all got pretty emotional
about how much we missed 30 minutes of performing
in a way where it feels like if something goes wrong,
we can't stop.
And with normal filmmaking, you would just cut
and you'd start over and you do it again.
But in this instance, it was rehearsed
and presented like a short play.
And so that was really exciting to me.
And this really was a very moving and bonding
and emotional experience for all of us.
- I understand that it is going to be part
of the Newest Film Festival.
Can you tell me a little bit about how that opportunity
came together? - Sure, sure.
- And how people can see it.
- Yes of course, thank you for bringing that up.
I submitted the film when it was done to Newfest,
which is New York's L.G.B.T. film festival,
and it was selected, which is wonderful.
So it's having its world premiere
on Monday the 26th of October at 8:00 PM.
And basically what you do, if you want to see it,
which hopefully you do (Ryan chuckling)
is you go to the Newfest website,
you type in "Nora Highland," there's a buy ticket thing.
I think they're like 10 bucks or something
and you click on it.
And then I'm assuming the day of the show,
Newfest sends you the link information.
And then at eight, o'clock it premieres
because all film festivals are digital this year.
And so Newfest is currently underway
and films are premiering all week.
And then ours hits on the 26th of October.
And then you can watch it from your computer or your phone,
or if you can put it up on your television, you can do that.
But it's also a really cool way to be involved
with a film festival because they have I don't know,
50 movies playing and all of the movies have talk-backs
at the end, that they've prerecorded.
And there's an intro and there's ads,
which say what you will about ads,
but the whole experience of it
feels like you're at a film festival, which is really cool.
And then when it's over,
you can reach out to those filmmakers on social media
and tell them how much you loved their films.
And then you can schmooze that way, I guess,
in the way that you would at a film festival,
if you were attending it in person.
There's ways to still feel like you're involved
in something,
as opposed to just sitting back and looking at your watch.
- In the film I know we can hear
your long-time love Michael Urie's voice.
It's a very, very funny scene.
And I know that you were the cinematographer
behind a very bright spot for theater lovers
in all of this,
which was Broadway.com's award-winning live stream
of "Buyer & Cellar." - Yes.
"Buyer & Cellar," yeah.
(indistinct) (Ryan chuckling)
- I do understand the implications
of being a part of a theater couple
and two wonderful people that are creatively inclined.
Do you mind telling me what it's like
to collaborate specifically with Michael?
I know obviously you enjoy each other's company.
- I love collaborating with him.
And I think prior to all of this,
actually I'm wearing a hat for,
I created a web series with Halley Feiffer
about idiots who run a 911 call center
in Hell, Michigan.
It's called "What's Your Emergency?"
And Michael directed that.
And prior to that, Halley and I made a film called,
"He's Way More Famous Than You" that Michael directed.
So we had all of this experience with filmmaking together.
And so when the pandemic hit, we hadn't at that point,
done a lot of theater together.
But now that we live together,
we were able to do MCC did a show with us.
It was a short play that Tylene Monaghan wrote
that was called "Frankie and Will"
about Will Shakespeare and his apprentice living
in a house together during quarantine.
And we were able to film it with multiple cameras
and then "Buyer & Cellar" we were able to film
that live in this space actually.
It's been exciting because we were able
to use the stuff that we learned prior to the pandemic.
We were able to use that in a really tangible way
that made us able to really succeed I feel like
in a lot of the early streaming stuff.
- You have been in some of my favorite off-Broadway works
like "Daniel's Husband" and "Gloria."
You are, in addition to being all
of these other creative roles,
you are also a true man of the theater.
that's what your background is,
that is what you originally started this journey with.
What, as a man of the theater specifically,
what are you most looking forward to?
- Ah, that's very sweet of you to say,
'cause I sometimes struggle with thinking that I'm that.
And so it's just nice to hear what you said, so thank you.
I miss audiences.
I feel so sad for people whose job it is in the theater
to be an audience member.
They don't that right now.
I think actors and even directors
and many other fields can at least get their fix
doing something to a certain extent.
But I feel like true hardcore theater audience members
who go six times a week and that's how they just feel
and experience their highs and their lows.
They don't have that right now.
And I just want that back.
- I think we all want that back.
- [Ryan] Yeah.
- Very, very much.
Is there anything that I didn't ask you
or that you didn't get to say about "Nora Highland?"
- I just wanna say thank you to the whole cast,
Mallory Portnoy, Marcus Crawford Guy,
Eric Harper, Michael Rosen, Marin Ireland,
Carlease Burke, Henry Jenkinson, Michael Urie.
They were all just totally game, totally on board,
and really just sold this piece in its format.
And I'm just so grateful for them,
that they went for it as strongly
and as powerfully as they did.
- Ryan, thank you so much for joining me.
I hope that "Nora Highland" reaches the wider audience
that it deserves, thank you so much.
- Thank you, thank you for having me.
It really means a lot, I'm really excited.
(Ryan chuckling)