Joining us, CNN
legal analyst Norm Eisen
and our senior law enforcement
analyst, Andrew McCabe.
CNN's Katelyn
Polantz is still with us as well.
Andrew, let's start
with the fight between the U.S.
Justice Department
and the former president.
Former President Trump's
legal team right now
over the special master issue in the Mar
a Lago. Classified documents probe.
Based on what we heard today,
do you think federal prosecutors
are making a winning argument?
Well, Wolf, it sounds like they are.
If we take the reactions of the judges
during today's
hearing as an indicator of where
they're likely to rule,
then the Justice Department
is probably feeling pretty good tonight.
But let's remember that
they're appealing this simply
because the ruling, the initial
ruling from Judge Cannon in Florida
was so unprecedented did so off base.
And it put the department
in a very dangerous position, potentially
having to put up with a precedent
that could wreak havoc
in all sorts of other cases.
This is simply not done
in criminal investigations
when the subject of a search warrant
can walk into court
and request
the imposition
of the special master
to slow things down and review
all the government's evidence,
just no other
defendant is treated
that way in this country.
And the Justice Department
can't leave the door open to this
poor ruling from Judge Canon
to set that sort of precedent.
Norm,
how do you expect this will all play out?
Wolf, the
underlying issue in the argument
today was should a former president
get special treatment?
His lawyer,
Jim Trusty,
pressed that again and again, claiming
it was context.
The court was hostile to that.
That leaves us in fact,
at one point
they said,
how would this forget that he's
a former president?
Could we apply the rule here
of the lower court in every case?
Of course they can't.
And for that reason,
because no one's above the law,
we have to have the same rules
for everyone.
The great likelihood is
that Trump is going to face
defeat in the 11th Circuit.
Good point.
You know, Caitlin,
this fight comes just a few days
after the new special counsel,
Jack Smith, was announced.
How would a win on this matter
unfolding right now impact his work?
Well, right now,
Jack Smith is coming into place.
We know that he's telling his teams,
don't slow down,
keep doing what you're doing.
He's coming in as a supervisor.
But at this point in the Mar
a Lago investigation,
he can't access some of the evidence
that was collected
by the Justice Department
during that search and seizure in August.
I mean, today,
Trump's lawyer, Jim
Trusty, was saying, well,
it was a Celine Dion poster.
It was golf shirts
that the FBI had taken out of Mar a Lago.
But really,
there were classified
documents intermixed
with all kinds of other things.
The classified documents
the Justice Department
has those the intelligence community
has those.
They're able to work on
those Smith is able to direct his team
what to do with that as part of a case.
But everything else
that would have been gathered
in that search and seizure,
I'm sure as Andy knows,
those things
become part of the evidence as well.
And right now,
a portion of that really
is shut off to him.
We don't know how quickly
the court will rule here,
but this was a very,
very short hearing today.
And so it could affect him
long term if they sit on things,
but perhaps they won't.
Yeah, let's not forget those documents.
Some of them at least,
we're not just classified,
but they were the most sensitive,
highly, highly
classified documents
that should never have been
there to begin with.
Norm, let's turn to the U.S.
Supreme Court decision
to allow the House of Representatives
to review former President Trump's
tax returns.
Right.
And lawmakers want to access
these records to begin with.
And what sort of relevant information
might they actually contain?
Well, if we wanted these
and I worked on the case
when I was co-counsel
in the impeachment
because they contain evidence,
very likely of Trump's
entanglements with, for starters,
foreign governments.
We know that's an issue
infamous and has continued to come out.
It's something that's so serious.
They put it in the Constitution,
well, forbidden.
They call it emoluments.
So I think those kinds of indications
will be in the tax returns.
Congress will pore over them.
Trump is also under investigation
in New York
for alleged business
improprieties, both civil and criminal.
That kind of information may come out.
And then, of course,
we've never had a president
in modern times
refuse to turn over tax returns.
So this will help Congress frame
legislative and policy initiatives
to deal with that kind of secrecy.
Very important day
for Congress in the Supreme Court.
And the Democrats
are still in the majority,
at least until January.
That's when the Republicans take over
the majority
we'll see what happens between now
and January.
Andrew, could information
from these tax returns
actually advance
any of the multiple investigations?
The former president is currently facing?
Well, I mean, they certainly could.
We don't know
exactly what's in those returns.
But once they're
subjected to the sort of analysis
that I'm sure
Congress will will do, we'll see
what sort of referrals potentially come
from that analytical work
and maybe get sent over
to the Department of Justice.
You know, as Norm said,
we already have
a pretty extensive record,
at least within New York State
of authorities looking into
not just former President Trump,
but also his companies
business practices with respect to
potentially inflating
and deflating the value of assets
to benefit himself
in terms of loans and taxes
and that sort of thing.
So there could be relevant
information in these returns
that actually adds fuel to those already
simmering investigations
in New York State.
Caitlin,
what I thought was very interesting,
there were no public
public dissents
to the Supreme Court decision
from any of the justices,
including those
appointed by Trump himself.
Does that tell you anything?
Well, Wolf,
they did make quick work of this,
a denial with with nothing else
said on the record,
allowing those tax returns
to go over to House Democrats.
It doesn't really tell us
whether there was any internal dissent
at the Supreme Court
it is possible
for justices to disagree
and not publicly come out and say that.
But one of the things
that is always surprising
when when you're watching courts,
especially appeals courts,
is when things are handled quickly.
And there was always a possibility here
that this case
would never have been resolved
by the end of this Congress.
The end of Democrats
control of this Congress.
This case was open two years ago.
We really are in the last quarter
of the House Democrats
having the Ways and Means Committee.
And they it does appear
they are going to get these things
with the Supreme Court's
blessing very quickly
and with no dissent.
So it is notable in that
I thought to our Kaitlan Collins,
Norm Ice and Andrew McCabe.
Guys, thank you very much.