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>> Chris: A CONGRESSIONAL
CONFERENCE COMMITTEE IS UP
AGAINST THE CLOCK LOOKING FOR A
COMPROMISE ON BORDER SECURITY
PRESIDENT TRUMP WILL SIGN TO
AVOID ANOTHER GOVERNMENT
SHUTDOWN IN JUST FIVE DAYS.
JOINING US NOW, TWO LEADING
MEMBERS OF THE PANEL, THE
REPUBLICAN CHAIR OF THE SENATE
APPROPRIATIONS COMMITTEE RICHARD
SHELBY AND DEMOCRATIC
SENATOR JON TESTER, GENTLEMEN,
WELCOME TO "FOX NEWS SUNDAY" ."
SENATOR TESTER, LET ME START
WITH YOU, HAS THE CONFERENCE
COMMITTEE REACHED AGREEMENT AT
LEAST ON THE NUMBER OF REPORTED
BARRIERS AND THESE REPORTS THAT
IT'S GOING TO BE SOUTH OF
$2 BILLION, IS THAT TRUE?
>> Senator Tester: WE ARE
STILL IN NEGOTIATIONS, CHRIS AND
I THINK THAT WHEN YOU'RE TALKING
ABOUT BORDER SECURITY INCLUDES
MORE THAN JUST A BARRIER, AND
INCLUDES TECHNOLOGY, IT INCLUDES
WHAT WE ARE GOING TO DO WITH THE
MANPOWER AIRCRAFT, THE WORKS.
WE ARE NOT TO A POINT WHERE WE
CAN ANNOUNCE A DEAL,
NEGOTIATIONS ARE STILL GOING ON.
THERE ARE GOOD PEOPLE ON THIS
COMMITTEE SO I HAVE CONFIDENCE
THAT HOPEFULLY WILL GET
SOMETHING DONE VERY SOON.
>> Chris: SENATOR SHELBY, I
HOPE YOU HEARD CHIEF OF STAFF
MULVANEY JUST BEFORE YOU SAY
THAT APPARENTLY AN ISSUE HAS
COME UP AND AT THE TALKS ARE IN
JEOPARDY, TELL ME WHAT THAT IS.
>> Senator Shelby: I THINK THE
TALKS ARE STALLED RIGHT NOW.
I'M HOPING WE CAN GET OFF THE
DIME LATER TODAY OR IN THE
MORNING BECAUSE TIME IS TICKING
AWAY BUT WE GOT SOME PROBLEMS
WITH THE DEMOCRATS DEALING WITH
ICE, THAT IS DETAINING CRIMINALS
THAT COME INTO THE U.S. AND THEY
WANT A CAP ON THEM, WE DON'T
WANT A CAP ON THAT.
WE HAVE THEM, AS JON TESTER
SAID, WE HAVE A NUMBER ON THE
BARRIER YET BUT WE ARE WORKING
AND WE'RE HOPING WE CAN GET
THERE BUT WE'VE GOT TO GET FLUID
AGAIN.
WE GOT TO START MOVEMENT.
>> Chris: I'M GOING TO GET TO
SENATOR TESTER AND THIS IDEA
THAT THE TALKS ARE STALLED, BUT
ON THIS QUESTION OF THE NUMBER,
YOU MET WITH PRESIDENT TRUMP ON
THURSDAY AND YOU CAME OUT AND
SAID THAT YOU WERE MORE
OPTIMISTIC THAN YOU HAVE BEEN.
FOR THE SAKE OF THIS ARGUMENT,
FOR THE SAKE OF THIS DISCUSSION,
IF THE NUMBER IS 2 BILLION,
SUBSTANTIALLY LESS THEN A
5.7 BILLION, THAT THE PRESIDENT
GIVE YOU ANY ASSURANCE THAT HE'S
WILLING TO GO ALONG WITH THAT
NUMBER TO AVOID ANOTHER
GOVERNMENT SHUTDOWN?
>> Senator Shelby: OUR TALKS
WITH THE PRESIDENT ARE
CONFIDENTIAL BUT I CAME OUT OF
THE MEETING THINKING WE COULD
MAKE A DEAL WITH THE DEMOCRATS
IF THEY ARE WILLING TO MEET US
HALFWAY.
SECONDLY, THE PRESIDENT
BASICALLY IN THE CONVERSATION
GAVE US SOME LATITUDE TO TALK
AND THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO
DO TO GET TO YESTERDAY.
>> Chris: SENATOR TESTER, DO
YOU AGREE WITH SENATOR SHELBY
THAT THE TALKS ARE STALLED, AND
SPECIFICALLY THIS DEAL OF
DETENTION.
THERE HAS BEEN TALK THAT
DEMOCRATS WANT FEWER DETENTION
BEDS, WHICH RAISES THE QUESTION
IF YOU CAN DETAIN FEWER PEOPLE,
DOESN'T THAT MEAN YOU HAVE TO
CATCH AND RELEASE MORE, WHICH
RAISES THE POSSIBILITY MORE OF
THEM WON'T SHOW UP FOR THEIR
COURT HEARINGS.
>> Senator Tester: ITS
NEGOTIATIONS.
NEGOTIATIONS SELDOM GO SMOOTH
ALL THE WAY THROUGH.
IT'S A GIVE-AND-TAKE, ITS
COMPROMISE, IT'S THE WAY
GOVERNMENT IS SUPPOSED TO WORK.
WE GOT GOOD PEOPLE IN THIS
CONFERENCE COMMITTEE, CHAIRMAN
SHELBY, BLUNT, DURBIN, I CAN GO
DOWN THE LIST.
THE BOTTOM LINE IS WE CUT PEOPLE
WHO AREN'T BOMB THROWERS AND
PEOPLE WHO KNOW HOW TO WORK
TOGETHER AND GET A DEAL.
I'M NOT POSITIVE WE WILL END UP
WITH A DEAL BUT WITH THIS GROUP
OF PEOPLE AND THE FOLKS FROM THE
HOUSE I THINK WE ARE GOING TO
END UP WITH SOMETHING THAT DEALS
WITH DETENTION BEDS, WITH
BARRIERS, WITH TECHNOLOGY, WITH
THE CHALLENGES WE HAVE ON THE
SOUTHERN BORDER IN A
COMMON SENSE WAY.
CHAIRMAN SHELBY IS CORRECT, TIME
IS OF THE ESSENCE, WE NEED TO
MOVE FORWARD, WE NEED TO KEEP
OUR EYES ON THIS BUT I'M VERY
HOPEFUL, NOT POSITIVE, BUT VERY
HOPEFUL WE CAN COME TO AN
AGREEMENT.
>> Chris: WHY WOULD YOU WANT
TO LIMIT THE NUMBER OF DETENTION
BEDS IF THE IDEA IS YOU WANT TO
DETAIN THEM RATHER THAN CATCH
AND RELEASE THEM AND THEN THEY
MERGE INTO THE COUNTRY?
>> Senator Tester: I CAN TELL
YOU UNTIL WE GET A FINAL NUMBER
I'M NOT SURE WE ARE DOING ANY OF
THAT.
WE'VE GOT TO COME TO A FINAL
NUMBER AND IT'S A NEGOTIATED
PROCESS.
I THINK WHAT EVERYBODY WANTS,
INCLUDING THE PEOPLE I SERVE
WITH ON BOTH SIDES OF THE AISLE,
THEY WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT
SOUTHERN BORDER IS SECURE,
THERE'S MANY WAYS TO DO THAT.
WHETHER IT'S DETENTION, WHETHER
IT'S TECHNOLOGY, WHETHER IT'S A
BARRIER.
AND WE CAN'T DO EVERYTHING ALL
AT ONCE BY THE WAY.
IF WE HAVE TO PRIORITIZE AND
MOVE FORWARD AND I THINK THIS
COMMITTEE IS FULLY CAPABLE OF
PRIORITIZING EXPENDITURES AND
HOPEFULLY WILL GET SOMETHING IN
THE HOUSE THAT THE HOUSE CAN
PASS, THE SENATE CAN PASS ON THE
PRESIDENT WILL SIGN.
>> Chris: SENATOR SHELBY, LET
ME BRING YOU BACK INTO THIS,
OBVIOUSLY TIME IS OF THE
ESSENCE, THE GOVERNMENT RUNS OUT
OF MONEY, AT LEAST SOME AGENCIES
DO AT MIDNIGHT FRIDAY NIGHT AND
BECAUSE A VARIETY OF ROLES, AND
A LOVE ONE OF THEM IS THAT THE
HOUSE ACTUALLY WANTS TIME TO
READ WHATEVER YOU GUYS COME UP
WITH, THE THOUGHT HAS BEEN THAT
YOU HAVE TO MAKE A DEAL, YOU
HAVE TO ANNOUNCE SOMETHING BY
TOMORROW, DO YOU FEEL THAT THE
DEADLINE, AND HOW CONFIDENT ARE
YOU THAT YOU CAN REACH A DEAL BY
TOMORROW?
>> Senator Shelby: CHRIS, THAT
IS A DEADLINE.
I'M NOT CONFIDENT WERE GOING TO
GET THERE.
I'M HOPING WE WILL GET THERE.
BUT THE HOUSE HAS SOME LEEWAY AS
FAR AS THEY'VE GOT ROOFS, THAT'S
TRUE.
I THINK THE NEXT 24 I SAID THE
OTHER DAY IT WAS 72 HOURS, I'M
THINKING THE NEXT 24 HOURS ARE
CRUCIAL, WE COULD CLOSE SOME
DEALS BUT THEY'VE GOT TO BE GOOD
TO SECURE OUR BORDERS.
>> Chris: LET ME JUST PURSUE
THAT FOR A SECOND.
YOU'RE SAYING IT'S GOT TO BE A
GOOD DEAL, OBVIOUSLY.
WHAT IF YOU CAN'T MAKE A DEAL IN
24 HOURS?
DO YOU GIVE UP?
TO KEEP GOING?
WHAT HAPPENS?
>> Senator Shelby: I DON'T
THINK WE EVER GIVE UP, BUT THE
PRESIDENT WILL HAVE SOME
OPTIONS, PERHAPS WE WILL HAVE
SOME OPTIONS BUT SHORT OF A
DEAL, THEY ARE NOT GOOD OPTIONS.
>> Chris: LET ME JUST PICK UP
ON THAT WITH YOU,
SENATOR SHELBY, I WILL BRING IN
SENATOR TESTER IN A MOMENT.
WHAT IS YOUR ATTITUDE AT THIS
POINT TOWARDS A GOVERNMENT
SHUTDOWN?
IS THAT JUST COMPLETELY OFF THE
TABLE?
AND THERE'S BEEN TALK THAT THERE
ARE A LOT OF REPUBLICANS,
PARTICULARLY IN THE SENATE WHO
REALLY DON'T LIKE THE IDEA OF
DECLARING A NATIONAL EMERGENCY
DESPITE WHAT MICK MULVANEY SAID,
FEARING THAT IT WILL SET A
PRECEDENT FOR A DEMOCRATIC
PRESIDENT.
>> Senator Shelby: SHUTTING
DOWN THE GOVERNMENT SHOULD
ALWAYS BE OFF THE TABLE.
WE WOULD LIKE FOR IT TO BE OFF
THE TABLE.
WE'VE WORKED HARD TO FUND THE
GOVERNMENT, WERE GOING TO
CONTINUE TO WORK HARD IN THESE
NEGOTIATIONS BUT THE SPECTER OF
A SHUTDOWN IS ALWAYS OUT THERE.
>> Chris: AND WHAT ABOUT
NATIONAL EMERGENCY?
>> Senator Shelby: I THINK THE
PRESIDENT HAS SOME POWERS UNDER
THE CONSTITUTION AND ALSO UNDER
THE STATUTE BUT I WOULD RATHER
WE REACH A LEGISLATIVE
CONCLUSION TO THIS.
THAT'S OUR JOB.
I'M GOING TO DO EVERYTHING I CAN
TO DO IT BUT WE'VE GOT TO DO IT
BOTH WAYS.
IT'S GOT TO BE A DOUBLE-EDGED
SWORD HERE.
>> Chris: THE INTERESTING
THING IS, SENATOR TESTER, THERE
WAS QUITE A LOT OF OPTIMISM AS
RECENTLY AS THIS WEEKEND THAT
YOU GUYS WERE GOING TO HAVE A
DEAL, YOU ARE GOING TO ANNOUNCE
SOMETHING.
THE PRESIDENT WAS GOING TO HAVE
TO EAT CONSIDERABLY LESS MONEY
FOR A BORDER BARRIER, HOW MUCH
TROUBLE IS THIS IN RIGHT NOW?
>> Senator Tester: I THINK
CHAIRMAN SHELBY PUT HIS FINGER
ON IT, IF WE STAY FOCUSED ON
GETTING A DEAL AND WE NEGOTIATE
IN GOOD FAITH ON BORDER SECURITY
I THINK WE WILL END UP WITH
SOMETHING THAT CAN WORK AND KEEP
THE GOVERNMENT OPEN AND GET
CERTAINTY FOR NOT ONLY THE
PUBLIC EMPLOYEES FOR THE SAFETY
OF THE COUNTRY.
AND I THINK THAT'S THE BOTTOM
LINE AND NOBODY WANTS A
SHUTDOWN, NOBODY WANTS THE
PRESIDENT TO USE SOME KIND OF
EMERGENCY POWERS.
WE JUST NEED TO DO OUR JOB AND
WE CAN DO IT.
AND LOOK, ALMOST EVERY
NEGOTIATION OUT THERE HIT BUMPS
IN THE ROADS.
THERE ARE BUMPS ON THE ROAD BUT
AS LONG AS WE STAY FOCUSED IN A
BIPARTISAN WAY, BICAMERAL WAY TO
GET THIS DONE I'M HOPEFUL WE CAN
GET IT DONE.
IS IT A DONE DEAL?
NO, IT ISN'T AND WE COULD END UP
IN A TRAIN WRECK, IT'S HAPPENED
BEFORE BUT I DON'T THINK ANYBODY
HAS AN APPETITE FOR GOVERNMENT
SHUTDOWN AND I THINK EVERYBODY
WANTS TO MAKE SURE --
>> Chris: TO WANT TO GIVE ME
SO OFTEN THE IDEA, 50/50,
BETTER, WORSE THAT YOU ARE GOING
TO HAVE A DEAL?
>> Senator Tester: I'M A
FARMER, I NEVER MAKE THE
DECISION WHEN SELLING MIGRAINE,
I'M NOT A GOOD POKER PLAYER
EITHER.
>> Senator Shelby: I WILL SAY
50/50 WITH GET A DEAL, I HOPE
AND PRAY THAT WE DO.
>> Senator Tester: SO THE
GLASS IS HALF-FULL.
>> Chris: IT DEPENDS ON HOW
YOU LOOK AT THAT, ISN'T IT,
SENATOR.
I WANT TO ASK ABOUT ONE MORE
QUESTION.
WHILE THERE'S NO QUESTION THAT
ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION IS A REAL
PROBLEM THERE ARE CHARGES,
PARTICULARLY FROM DEMOCRATS THAT
PRESIDENT TRUMP IS EXAGGERATING
IT, AND I WANT TO TALK ABOUT A
SPECIFIC ISSUE.
THE PRESIDENT GOES TO EL PASO
TOMORROW FOR A BIG RALLY AND
HERE'S WHAT HE SAID ABOUT THE
SITUATION IN EL PASO AT THE
STATE OF THE UNION.
SPEAK OF THE BORDER CITY OF
EL PASO, TEXAS, USED TO HAVE
EXTREMELY HIGH RATES OF VIOLENT
CRIME.
WITH A POWERFUL BARRIER IN PLACE
EL PASO IS ONE OF THE SAFEST
CITIES IN OUR COUNTRY.
>> Chris: BUT LET'S LOOK AT
THE FACTS.
FROM 1993-2006, THE NUMBER OF
VIOLENT CRIMES IN EL PASO, AND
THIS IS BEFORE THE WALL WAS
BUILT, FELL 34%.
CONSTRUCTION OF THE WALL DIDN'T
START TILL 2008 AND FROM
2006-11, BEFORE THE WALL WAS
BUILT UNTIL AFTER THE WALL WAS
BUILT, THE VIOLENT CRIME RATE IN
EL PASO ACTUALLY ROSE 17%, SO IT
FELL BEFORE THE WALL, ROSE
DURING AND AFTER THE WALL,
SENATOR SHELBY, IS THE PRESIDENT
MISLEADING OR EXAGGERATING THE
THREAT TO AMERICANS?
>> Senator Shelby: I DON'T
THINK HE'S MISLEADING OR
EXAGGERATING.
WE GOT REAL PROBLEMS ALONG OUR
BORDERS.
WITH THAT MILLIONS OF ILLEGAL
IMMIGRANTS IN THIS COUNTRY.
WE'VE HAD A LOT OF DRUG DEALERS,
GANGS AND EVERYTHING COME ACROSS
THAT BORDER.
HE'S NOT EXAGGERATING IT.
WE'VE GOT TO SECURE THE BORDER.
WE'VE MADE PROGRESS, BUT WE CAN
DO BETTER THAN THIS.
I THINK WE OWE IT TO THE
AMERICAN PEOPLE.
>> Chris: SENATOR SHELBY,
SENATOR TESTER, THANK YOU BOTH,