LIZ: SO "THE WALL STREET
JOURNAL" IS REPORTING AT THIS
HOUR THAT BOTH THE JUSTICE
DEPARTMENT AND THE SECURITIES
AND EXCHANGE COMMISSION ARE
INVESTIGATING THE COLLAPSE OF
SILICON VALLEY BANK IN SEPARATE
PROBES.
THE INVESTIGATIONS ARE IN THEIR
PRELIMINARY PHASES AND, LISTEN,
WE DON’T KNOW, IT MAY OR MAY NOT
LEAD TO CHARGES OR ALLEGATIONS
OF WRONGDOING, BUT NO DOUBT A
CHILL HAS JUST FALLEN OVER THE
START-UP WORLD NOW THAT IT’S --
I CALL IT THE BANK OF FIRST AND
LAST RESORT, SILICON VALLEY
BANK, HAS GONE BELLY UP.
JOINING ME NOW IS THE COFOUNDER
OR AND CEO OF AVC, JOE LONSDALE
WHO HAS A HUGE AMOUNT OF
EXPERIENCE IN START-UPS
INCLUDING COFOUNDING PALANTIR
WITH NOW-CEO, ALEX KARP.
THANK YOU BOTH FOR BEING HERE.
>> THANKS FOR HAVING US.
LIZ: ALEX IS GIVING US CONTEXT
ON PALANTIR, BUT FIRST, LET’S
START WITH YOU, JOE, AND SILICON
VALLEY BANK.
CLEARLY, THE DEPOSITORS WERE
MADE WHOLE.
IS THAT THAT A GOOD DECISION TO
HAVE MADE?
>> YOU KNOW, LIZ, THERE WERE
RUMORS ABOUT THIS BANK HAVING
ISSUES FOR QUITE A WHILE.
A LOT OF US WERE NOT AS EXPOSED
DIRECTLY, BUT THERE WERE ABOUT
60,000 START-UP COMPANIES THAT
WERE.
IF YOU LOOK AT THE MATH, THEY
PROBABLY WOULD HAVE ONLY LOST
ABOUT 2-5% OF THEIR GOES SITS.
ON FRIDAY I TOOK MY MONEY OUT OF
THE REGIONAL BANKS, A BUNCH.
OF ORE WEALTHY PEOPLE HAVE HAD
IN TEXAS -- HAD IN TEXAS, IN
CALIFORNIA.
I THINK THE FDIC USING A SMALL
AMOUNT OF MONEY TO BASICALLY
MAKE DEPOSITORS WHOLE WAS A
SMART THING FOR THE REGIONAL
BANKS THEMSELVES.
A LOT OF PEOPLE WANTS TO ATTACK
THE VCs.
LISTEN, SVB LOST THEIR MONEY,
DEBT HOLDERS LOST THEIR MONEY.
I THINK IT WAS SMART THAT THE
FDIC STOPPED THE BANK RUN.
LIZ: OKAY.
ALEX, A, WHAT DO YOU THINK?
AND ALSO, YOU’VE GOT TO THE
EXPLAIN THE EARLY YEARS OF
PALANTIR WHEN YOU HAD VENTURE
CAPITAL MONEY IN TO BLOAT YOU --
>> WE SCREWED THAT UP.
WE SCREWED THAT UP TOO.
WE WERE EXPOSED TO
AUCTION-RIGGED SECURITIES IN
2008.
YOU REMEMBER THAT?
THEY LOCKED UP THE MONEY FOR
ABOUT FIVE MONTHS, IT WAS
TERRIFYING.
>> THIS IS THE THING, I LARGELY
THINK THE CRADLING OF U.S.
INDUSTRIES AND INNOVATION, WE
ARE -- WE LEAD E THE WORLD IN
TECH, WE NEED THE INNOVATION,
AND SILICON VALLEY INSTITUTIONS
ARE CRUCIAL.
THERE IS ANOTHER ISSUE WHICH IS
WHY SILICON VALLEY IS UNPOPULAR,
AND I THINK IT’S JUSTIFY BY
UNPOPULAR BECAUSE LEAVING ASIDE
THINGS THAT JOE HAS INVESTED IN
IN COFOUNDING PALANTIR, A LOT OF
WHAT SILICON VALLEY HASP DONE IS
NOT SOMETHING ANYONE WANTS TO
SUPPORT.
IT’S, LIKE, BUILDING THESE LARGE
INDUSTRIES WHERE ONLY A SMALL
GROUP OF PEOPLE GET WEALTHY, AND
EVERYONE FELLS LIKE, WELL, WHAT
DID I GET?
AS OPPOSED TO PALANTIR AND OTHER
COMPANIES THAT WORK WITH U.S.
DEFENSE AND WITH OUR ALLIES.
SO THERE’S THE WHAT SHOULD HAVE
HAPPENED IN SILICON VALLEY,
OKAY, YOU CAN DEBATE THAT, BUT I
THINK LARGELY WE HAVE TO SAVE
OUR TECH INDUSTRY, AND THEN
THERE’S WHY IS SILICON VALLEY SO
UNPOPULAR?
AND IT’S SO UNPOPULAR BECAUSE
THERE ARE SO MANY FEW COMPANIES
THAT CHOOSE AMERICA AND OUR
ALLIES OVER OURED IS RARE
SHARES -- ADVERSARIES, AND SO
FEW PEOPLE THAT AREN’T INVOLVED
IN THIS KIND OF WEIRD BUBBLE
CULTURE THAT THE SOMEHOW ORIENTS
AROUND THEM GETTING RICH AND THE
REST OF US NOT PROFITING FROM
IT.
THOSE ARE TWO SEPARATE ISSUES.
LIZ: WE’VE GOT TWO BILLIONAIRES
RIGHT HERE.
JOE, WHAT IS YOUR RESPONSE TO
THAT?
>> WELL, IF I WAS ALEX, I WOULD
DEFINITELY SEE THINGS IN THAT
EXTREME WAY.
I REMEMBER BEING ON THE PHONE
WITH ALEX WITH A VERY PROMINENT
VC ABOUT 18 YEARS AGO, AND THE
GUY WAS LAUGHING AT US AND
SAYING WE WEREN’T A SERIOUS
COMPANY BECAUSE ALEX CAN’T HAVE
A TECHNICAL DEGREE.
ALEX PROVED HIM WRONG, NO
EXPOSURE TO ANY OF THESE BANKS
IN SILICON VALLEY, SO HE SHOWED
THAT GUY.
THAT GUY WANTED US TO DO SOCIAL
MEDIA AT THE TIME.
BUT, YOU KNOW, LIZ, I WORK ON A
LOT OF HEALTH CARE COMPANIES, A
LOT OF BIOTECH --
LIZ: JOB CREATION.
AND JOB CREATION --
>> -- SAVED THOUSANDS OF LIVES,
AND THERE’S A LOT OF, YOU KNOW,
OVERALL, ARE THERE LOTS OF
RIDICULOUS THINGS IN TECH?
YES.
THERE’S ALL SORTS OF RIDICULOUS
THINGS.
I THINK RIGHT NOW THERE’S A LOT
OF HATE COMING FROM PEOPLE WHO
THINK IN TERMS OF BUMPER
STICKERS ON THE LEFT AND THE
RIGHT THAT’S TOTALLY
UNWARRANTED.
THE BRIGHTEST SPOT IS OUR
INNOVATION ECONOMY --
>> THE PART I DEFINITELY AGREE
WITH JOE ON IS THE THING THAT
SCARES OUR ADVERSARIES THE MOST,
MORE THAN ANYTHING ELSE, IS THE
INNOVATION IN THE AMERICAN TECH
SCENE.
SO IF YOU’RE RUSSIA OR CHINA,
SURE, YOU THINK ABOUT THE
MISSILES AND OTHER THINGS WE
BUILD, BUT WHAT KEEPS YOU UP AT
NIGHT ARE THE KIND OF SOFTWARE
PRODUCTS THAT WE PROVIDE, THAT
OTHER COMPANIES PROVIDE --
LIZ: RIGHT.
>> -- AND THOSE ARE THE THINGS
THAT WE HAVE TO INVEST IN, AND
THEY COME LARGELY OUT OF SILICON
VALLEY.
NOW, AGAIN, I THINK SILICON
VALLEY WOULD COWELL TO
UNDERSTAND, OKAY, WE’RE -- DO
WELL TO UNDERSTAND, OKAY, WE’RE
INTERESTED, WE’RE THE BEDROCK OF
INNOVATION IN THE WORLD, WHY DO
MOST AMERICANS NOT LIKE US?
AND JUST, LIKE, ASKING THAT
SIMPLE BUT LEGITIMATE QUESTION
IS SUPER IMPORTANT --
LIZ: WELL, BUT PALANTIR HAS
EXPANDED ITS BUSINESS, HAS IT
NOT?
YOU DO BIG DATA FOR HOSPITALS
AND ALL KINDS OF DIFFERENT
COMPANIES, NOT JUST THE
GOVERNMENT AND THE DEFENSE --
>> WHAT I’M INVOLVED IN, WHAT
PALANTIR’S INVOLVED IN AND WHAT
I THINK JOE AND HIS VC ARE ALSO
INVOLVED IN IS SILICON VALLEY
ONCE BUILT THINGS FOR THE
MILITARY AND THEN EXPORTED IT TO
EVERYDAY AMERICANS AND ALL OVER
THE WORLD.
AND DE FACTO, THAT’S WHAT WE’VE
DONE.
WE BUILT THIS KILL CHAIN THAT
INVOLVES HANDOFF PROCESS FROM A.
I., IDENTIFYING TARGET, YOU HAVE
TO DECIDE WHEN A HUMAN’S
INVOLVED, WHEN A HUMAN’S NOT
INVOLVED, YOU HAVE TO SEE THE
PEDIGREE OF THE DATA.
THIS IS EXACTLY THE WAY EVERY
LARGE INSTITUTION WORKINGS.
EVERY LARGE INSTITUTION IN THE
WORLD IS GOING TO HAVE FUNCTIONS
THAT CAN BE RUN BY A.I., THAT
CAN’T BE RUN BY A.I., THEY’RE
GOING TO HAVE THE TAXONOMY OF
HOW THE DATA, WHERE THE DATA
WENT.
IF YOU’RE IN A HOSPITAL, FOR
EXAMPLE, THERE ARE THINGS ONLY
A.
>> SHOULD DECIDE, AND THEN THERE
ARE LOTS AND LOTS OF THINGS THAT
AN ALGORITHM CAN DECIDE.
IF YOU’VE VERIFIED THAT THE
DOCTOR ONLY DECIDED WHAT HE’S
ALLOWED TO DECIDE, TO DECISIONS
OF LIFE AND DEATH.
YOU HAVE THE HOSPITAL A.I., IN
FACT, THE TECHNICAL
PREREQUISITES ARE THE SAME FOR
BOTH, AND THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT
SILICON VALLEY DID FOR THE FIRST
50, 60 YEARS.
LIZ: WITH VENTURE CAPITAL, JOE,
AND AS WE FINISH UP, ARE YOU
CONCERNED THAT THERE WILL BE A A
MASSIVE, LIKE, KILLER OF SALT IN
THE VC WORLD WHERE TOO MANY
PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BE
FRIGHTENED TO LEND TO START-UPS?
>> YOU KNOW, LIZ, THERE WAS
DEFINITELY A BUBBLE IN EC.
PART OF ANGER THAT’S RIGHT IS
THERE WAS TOO MUCH MONEY IN EC
THE, THERE WERE A LOT OF SILLY
THINGS GOING ON, THEY WEREN’T
FOCUSING ON THE STUFF THAT
MATTERS.
ALEX PREVENTED TONS OF ATTACKS
ON GOVERNMENT --
>> BY THE WAY, JOE IS AN
INCREDIBLE COFOUNDER --
[LAUGHTER]
AND REALLY COURAGEOUS PERSON.
WE DISAGREE ON EVERY POLITICAL
ISSUE --
[LAUGHTER]
BUT YOU WANT TO WORK WITH --
>> ALEX IS NOT QUITE A COMMUNIST
[LAUGHTER]
NO, BUT LISTEN, LIZ, A LOT OF
COMPANIES ARE GOING TO DIE
BECAUSE THERE’S TOO MUCH MONEY
IN TECH, BUT THERE’S SOME GREAT
COMPANIES AS WELL.
LIZ: ALEX, JOE, A PLEASURE TO
HAVE YOU.
I THINK THIS WAS SUCH A VALUABLE
CONVERSATION FOR OUR VIEWERS.
PLEASE BOTH COME BACK, THERE’S
SO MUCH MORE TO COME FROM WHAT’S
HAPPENING IN SILICON VALLEY AND