Alright, bleacher report's kind of Rogers is with us. Now.
Amen. So Michael and I just finished chatting as we rejoin.
You guys live from The Fan Experience here at the NFL
draft in Las Vegas, man. It's unbelievable. The energy here
is off-the-chain
Connor. We wish you were here. Just hope you can soak up this
energy
through the, through the screen here. But listen, we were just
talking about the Jags. That one the fun starts at 1, which
is unusual for most drafts, but
understandable for a draft without a clear-cut
quarterback, or a team at number one, without a needle.
Quarterback.
Michael. Holly, I guess I would put your analysis of what
the Jag should do simply as anybody, but Ray Vaughn Walker.
Yeah,
pretty much. And you
is that right there? You see it that way counter.
Michael, you're spot-on. I was listening to your previous
segments and everything. You said is exactly right with this
franchise and it's kind of puzzling. How we got here,
right? It's fascinating to me when you look at Ray Vaughn
Walker. Yeah. He's a first-round caliber player in
this draft. He is unlike
any typical top five top. Pick that we see in terms of
the production or the lack thereof in the production and we look
at Jacksonville. Their help is staring them right in the face.
It kyun Kwan o in my eyes is the best player in this
trap. He would be fine kicking over to right tackle. I still
think they have a need at right tackle. This offense was
a disaster last year. I don't think just hiring Doug Peterson
and making some mid-tier free. Agent signings is going to help
that for the
next three years might give you a boost for this year, but you
draft for three years, you don't draft, you know,
obviously for R 2 months. So and then if you wanted to go
defense, you're right. The high floor nature of Aden.
Hutchinson makes a lot of sense.
I mean, Kavon Thibodeau has a higher floor in my eyes as
a pass rusher, at least not a run Defender, but a pass rusher
than Trayvon Walker, so I'm with you, it's puzzling, but
guys,
I think it's happening.
You think it's got betrayed, my Walker? Oh, is that right?
I've really do everything I have heard is that?
That is Trent balki's guy. Now, I think there's a little bit of
a differing opinion with the new coaching staff. I think
there is some wonder by the owner who is very aware of
public opinion.
And that is reading everything saying Aiden Hutchinson's
a no-brainer. Number one, overall pick. Like you said, even one
of the tackles whether it is Ebony, Laura kiek, want to make
a lot of sense, and I think He's, you know, probably
pushing a little bit upstair saying hey,
why are we taking this guy? But if it is Trent balki's call at
the end of the day, then I think it will be Trayvon Walker
and I do believe he has the most power within that
organization.
So the only thing we've heard publicly from Jacksonville was
that they were discussing four players. The aforementioned,
Evan Neal from Alabama Iggy Quantum, from North Carolina
State 804, Michigan and trade my Walker from Georgia.
So if it is down to the edge, guys, Michael is kind of
reminds me of our old Bengals Feud. Dude, and one of
the things that I had to keep
saying and I think we all as, as draft nerves Connor, have to
remind everybody is that there's more than one round to
the draft,
you know, a couple of years ago. They went just round one
on Thursday night and everybody focuses their energy on round
one and we analyze round one and it will be grades coming
out tonight, but the full picture of the draft matters in
terms of strategy.
I say that to say this,
let's say they have narrowed in on an edge rusher, either Walker
or Hutchinson.
Tell us about the tackle depth that could be available for
Jacksonville when they're on a clock at number one tomorrow
night. Presumably if they keep the number one pick in
the second round of the draft
or later solid matter. Yeah, it falls off a little bit for me.
I think if Tyler Smith the hulking tackle, from Tulsa made
it to that pick.
That is very up in the air.
That would be an interesting solution. I love what he can do
in the Run game. He's a 20 year old Prospect right now. So that
green light is still coming on. He flipped over to tackle late
in his high school.
Rear, so there is a lot of untapped potential with him.
And then yes, the league is high on a guy like Bernard
Raymond originally from Austria, a little bit of
an older Prospect of formerly a tight end in college that moved
to tackle, really good feet,
really good athleticism, but raw and when you're an older
raw prospect, that scares me, so I think I would personally
guys, take the sure thing. Number one and then look at
the edge pass rush class at 33 and Arnold Eva. Katie boy, a Mafi,
maybe David
a Jabba. Nobody expects Jacksonville to win a Super
Bowl this year. They can draft and stash a David, a job. Oh
and that's completely fine. So
I don't really fully understand the strategy, the order of
the strategy here from them.
So you, so just to be clear, you can see better Edge depth
in the second round.
That Jacksonville could tap into, if they follow your advice,
and go icky quano with the first overall pick.
Yeah. By a country, by a country mile, for sure.
All right, let's say let's say, Jacksonville does what
we think. Might happen. Let's say they pass on
offensive lineman. Let's say they pass on Hutchinson.
They take Walker.
How's that? How's that affect the rest of the state top five
or top six? You still have great lineman there. You still
have Hutchinson there.
Everybody says, Hey Detroit takes the card and just
and puts it in front and center about the.
Do you think that's the way to go? Or would you say? Hey
Back-to-back, you took a lineman last year in pain, a Sewell
and seven. I believe it was
why not come back and take a great Lyman
and number two. What do you think? They should do?
What I think they should do
is take cave on Thibodeau. And I'd have no problem if they
took eight and Hutchinson you're talking about my number
two and number three players in the draft. It's just what you
prefer, higher floor or higher ceiling. Now what I'll say
here, guys, that fascinates me to answer the beginning of
the question about the impact on the rest of the
draft. I have heard start.
A on Tuesday from somebody in that building.
That there is a bit of the front office and scouting
Department views cave on Thibodeau as the guy. And there
are members of the coaching staff that view Aidan
Hutchinson as the guy. This is a true split down the middle
where nobody knows what they are going to do exactly. When
for so long. We were led to believe if Aidan Hutchinson is
there, they would Sprint in that card. Now, we're seeing
that turn where Kavon Thibodeau is absolutely in the picture
and potentially the favorite to go.
Now when you look at the trickle effect besides that
I think Houston would take Hutchinson if he fell at
the Jets will take a Kia quano at for if he's there the Giants
are going to take Evan Neal most likely or Charles cross.
So that kind of becomes a little bit more simplified.
But what the Lions do it to right now
might be the hottest mystery in the entire draft.
Well, let me let me add to that. I like it. I
like it. Let me add to that.
Because
all right, Dan. Campbell recently talked about, you
don't need a great quarterback. You know, you got to have
a complete team, you know, it's not just about the one, you
know,
which is what you say. When you have Jared Goff is your
quarterback,
what I'm wondering.
Let's say Jacksonville does follow your advice, Michael
Holland and take 8 and Hutchinson
which takes the obvious pick away from Detroit. The Michigan
guy, you know, the local kid. It makes a lot of dollars and
cents
to take eight Hutchinson if you Detroit, but if Hutchinson is
off the board, what are the chances that Detroit throws? A
monkey wrench in this entire draft and takes Malik will
asada Liberty without
because that are
you saying? No, I'm just saying I heard. Heard that there's
some as a possibility there. It's possible,
not likely, but if Hutchins is off the board,
I think that opens up that possibility. Have you heard
anything to that effect? Connor? It's a scenario,
they've discussed because they really like Malik Willis,
right? And it's hard, not to like Malik Willis. It's not
just the
untapped potential. I've told you guys before,
it's very easy to believe in the person and that's just how
evaluating quarterbacks often goes. Once you feel comfortable
with the talent and Malik, Willis has passed that test
with flying colors. I would say more so than Maybe.
Any quarterback in this draft, so
when you look at it like that,
there is a chance,
I would say it's very small because they know
that they might be able to navigate from 32
and get him. Anyway, later on. The only other team that I've
heard is really in on Malik Willis and round one is
the Pittsburgh Steelers at 20 and the question is are they going
to be aggressive to go get them?
Or they going to be really patient and risk losing him. So
I think the Lions who have, we know a bare-bones roster right
now, they want a blue chip. Position player with that,
number two overall pick. Then they want to see how
the quarterback dominoes fall.
Who do you think? And let's say, well, it's doesn't go to
Detroit with that number to pick.
Who do you think will be the best? The, well, two things
who's coming the first quarterback
to go,
and ultimately will play a little futuristic game. Who's
gonna be the best quarterback in this draft.
I think any pic, it's going to be the first one to go off
the board whether that is Carolina at six, not as likely as it
once was, they might try to move back and still get them.
The Saints are very much in play for. Kenny Pickett and
then the Steelers are still in.
For Kenny Pickett, so that's the three spots for him and
Malik. Willis obviously has very similar, Landing spots.
Now. It's interesting. I have them stacked side by side, not
in the top 30, I believe 31 and 32 with. Pick it up,
31, Willis at 32. Kenny pick. It has a high floor. He can
come in, be serviceable distribute the ball to play
makers and run your offense. He's
an older Prospect. You
broke out late at Pitt
his, you know, ability to distribute throw with a little
bit of anticipation and accuracy is where it needs to
be. Now. There's not the upside there, the The arm is average,
the playmaking with his legs is average, the overall,
when the play breaks down, ability
kind of shrug your shoulders with Malik Willis,
the former things
being ready to step in and play right now and be a superhero
coming out of Liberty. I don't think he's there yet. I think
he needs seasoning. I think he needs to marinate a little bit.
And that's okay. A lot of these quarterbacks do
the arm Talent 10 times better
than Kenny pick it, the running ability, and I'm not just
talking about the electric running ability. I'm talking
about the vision, the The Tackle breaking with a very
very thick frame. Malik Willis has all of those things. So if
you're trying to hit a home run,
you take Malik Willis, he has the chance to be
a near Superstar
out of this quarterback class. That is, I won't say that about
any of the rest of them while pick, it can be a middle of
the pack starter the rest of the guys.
I'm just not in on any of them. To be honest with you guys.
See, I see this is this is why I'm sitting here
because I ain't got to be held accountable for missing on
these pics because I would probably be that GNN. We'll get
myself fired swinging for the fences because when you say
that about Malik Willis and we had Thord Nystrom all. Yeah.
The other day from NBC Sports, it was feeling no probably
loves me loves more than anybody else out of Malik
Willis's family. Yeah,
when you say he has the ability to be a superstar.
If I'm Detroit, how do I pass on that? How do I pass on that
potential? Even if it means redshirting him after Jared
Goff,
I would I would rather I would rather Miss
trying to get a superstar quarterback,
then pass on a potential Superstar quarterback in favor
of going to Safe route and taking an edge guy when I got
Jared Goff and my corner. Man, that's not necessarily a safe
route. Either going to the edge
because you never know what Edge guys will turn out to be
like if I'm gonna miss I'm a miss big. I'm a miss on
a potential Superstar quarterback.
I'm not sure I grab him. I asked you for my playing with
fire.
No. And I'll just say the political side of this is they
are very safe in Detroit, right? Brad homes, and Dan
Campbell understandably got five, your Deals. They did take
on Jared Goff some money for a big draft Capital return.
They feel like they can
retool the roster, the 53-man roster last year. They started to,
you know, hit on an ice pick. Like I'm on Ross, same brown
even later on, that's going to help. A quarterback one day.
Use these picks this year to do that for when a quarterback
comes in. The infrastructure is in place and
they feel like they have the time to do that whether that's
right or wrong guys, right? I get it. There's not
the desperation on there and if they win four games this year,
I don't think they're going to be fired and next year's
quarterback class. Okay,
teams already working on it. They could also they could
afford to wait, they can afford, they can afford to Kick
the Can down the road while a lot of teams can't they can do
it. And then a Young quarterback will come into
an infrastructure where he
can. Of the right way. Yeah,
you know what? That's interesting because that's what
I'm thinking about when I think about Carolina and it. Well,
let's so Atlanta,
but I think about some of these organizations that are or even
Seattle. It's like, can they afford to say? Oh, we'll just
wait for the 2023 quarterback class because if you're
a position to draft the CJ, Stroud, you
know, next year or Bryce young or somebody like that. Then you
probably lost a lot of games and you're probably not going
to be employed. But go ahead. Michael. Yeah. I was going to
say, you know,
the the
Nugget and all all of this and I love it.
Connor is that you say? Detroit likes Thibodeau,
and it's finally I'm
I'm excited to somebody likes the guy. I know we heard
a bunch of crap. I keep hearing all this sliding talk tell me
why they like them. I like until we talk to him. We loved
him. Tell me,
remind everybody why
he's a prospect worthy of a drafts of a drafts lot like
that.
I mean, he's been the guy since he was in high school, right?
And he got to or As a true freshman and somehow lived up
to those massive recruit expectations. He was tremendous
as a true freshman, the covid season. Obviously, he was still
a good player. There's just very limited tape out in
the pack. They did not get to
play a lot of games and then you look at this year and he
kept getting better. Guys, the production the pass rush win
rate improved over time. Now, he has incredible speed to
power. His short area explosiveness is phenomenal.
He can beat you at speed to the outside and he can embarrass
you by putting his hand in. Your chest and putting you in
the dirt. So I think when you look at it like that and I do
I think he plays hard. I don't know.
I know there's a mixed opinion on this, when I look at
the tape, you know, listen, that team was just okay. I know he
was playing her at times. He had that green light on and got
after it and kept them in games. Won them some games,
which is not easy to
do as a defensive end at the college level. So
I think they like that, and I think some guys like his
personality that he's an outside, the box thinker that
he's not afraid to speak outside of just being a, you
know, a For Meathead, right? He's not afraid to speak his
mind on things like that. He looks out for himself. But he
also does look
out for what is best on the football field. So
everybody gravitates towards different personalities quite
differently, but every since I've gotten is the Lions front
office has been a big fan of Kavon Thibodeau for a long
time.
Last thing we got for you, man is a,
a teams again have two picks. So
could see a flurry of activity tonight.
When it comes to the trade
front,
the team that I'm probably most interested in is that first
team that has two picks said, nobody ever. I'm interested in
the Texans.
I mean, if we were ranking like irrelevant franchises. Like
the Texas would be really high on the list. Yeah. They've been
fibbing relevant for all the wrong reasons. The last couple
of years and are most relevant, you know.
Is now in Cleveland as we know, right?
Nick is Serio's got a lot of ammunition to nail this draft,
but you don't have to stick to the Texans. I guess. What's
the scuttlebutt? Because I saw what the Texans are looking to,
maybe move up from that 13th, slot into the top 10.
What's the scuttlebutt in terms of movement? Whether it's
the Texans or another team. That's got your attention as the clock
ticks toward
the first round.
Yeah, the Texans are interesting, right? They can
try to get a top-flight corner like saucer Stingley and then
still try to get an offensive lineman or vice versa. They
I can do it the reverse way,
see what corner Falls after they take their tackled choice
at three. I find the Eagles, very interesting in this draft.
I think how Heroes Min is trying to be extremely
aggressive for a big-time talent. I think he's looking at
them, sitting at 15 and 18 and going
man. The Draft starts to fall off at 12. I don't want to be
outside looking in looking at everybody having fun with their
Blue Chip talents. And I didn't get one. I think he would move
up for somebody that falls whether that's Jameson.
To pair with Devonte Smith, whether Kavon Thibodeau does
slide or not. And once again, it sounds like he could go
number two overall. And then the Kansas City Chiefs. They
are not going to make all those pics. They have a million
picks, guys. They're too good
of a roster to carry in a 12-man rookie class. So I think
when you look at the Chiefs, they are going to be aggressive
at some point. It's just a matter of when they can strike
because how many teams want to move back to pick 29 or 30. The
list is pretty low, but they're going to give it a go.
Got a Roy Rogers Moon, franchise player, do franchise,
you make it. Immediate impact that make us better. We'll make
it easy. We'll make it easier. Contact. Kind of Rogers is
there. We'll take him. You make us
a better every time
you always bringing kind of Rogers or Bleacher Report. We
will talk to you tomorrow and we will certainly have plenty
to cover.
Thanks so much for having another live from Las Vegas.
Thanks so much for having us. I can't I can't wait to talk to
you tomorrow. We're going to have a lot of fun to recap this
thing. I know it's good.
No doubt. You got it, man.