WE HAVEN’T SEEN IT YET. WE’LL SEE WHAT HAPPENS OBVIOUSLY
OVER THE NEXT TEN MONTHS, 11
MONTHS.
MONTHS. >> AND WE MENTIONED THE POLL OUT
OF SOUTH CAROLINA.
LET’S TAKE A LOOK AT THAT RIGHT
NOW.
NOW. 2020 DEMOCRATIC NOMINATION FOR
SOUTH CAROLINA, JOE BIDEN AT THE
TOP THERE.
TOP THERE. BERNIE SANDERS, ELIZABETH WARREN
AT 19%.
AT 19%. PETE BUTTIGIEG AT 9%.
>> YEAH.
>> YEAH. >> THERE’S TOM STEYER AND THEN
CORY BOOKER AT THE BOTTOM.
IS IT TIGHTER?
>> YES, IT IS.
>> JOE BIDEN YOU WOULD THINK
WOULD RULE THERE, NO?
>> WELL, HE HAS.
BUT JOHN HEILEMANN, AT LEAST IN
THIS POLL, ANOTHER VERY GOOD
POLL, GETTING TIGHTER IN SOUTH
CAROLINA.
CAROLINA. >> YES.
>> YES. YOU KNOW, YOU LOOK AT BERNIE
SANDERS RIGHT THERE AND
ELIZABETH WARREN BOTH VERY CLOSE
TO EACH OTHER THERE IN THAT
EFFECTIVE TIE FOR SECOND PLACE.
THOSE TWO CANDIDATES HAVE, YOU
KNOW, BIDEN HAS BEEN SO FAR
AHEAD IN SOUTH CAROLINA FOR SO
LONG, THE FACT THAT THERE ARE
NOW A COUPLE OF CANDIDATES AND
AT THIS MOMENT THEY’RE STILL
SEVEN, EIGHT POINTS BEHIND
BIDEN.
BIDEN. BUT AS WE GET CLOSER AND CLOSER
TO SOUTH CAROLINA, THAT’S A
CLOSEABLE GAP AND SUGGESTS THAT
THEY MIGHT BE STARTING TO MAKE
END ROADS IN THE NONWHITE VOTE
DOWN THERE.
DOWN THERE. PETER BAKER, I ASK YOU, THERE’S
BEEN NOT TO PIVOT TOO MUCH OFF
OF THIS BRITAIN THING, BUT
THERE’S NO DOUBT THAT THERE’S
BEEN A SEA CHANGE OVER THE
COURSE OF THE LAST THREE MONTHS
IN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY,
CONCERNS ABOUT ELECTABILITY,
CONCERNS ABOUT MOVING TOO FAR TO
THE LEFT.
THE LEFT. ELIZABETH WARREN WHO HAS RUN
EASILY OVER THE COURSE OF THE
YEAR THE BEST CAMPAIGN AND WAS
THE FRONT RUNNER THIS RACE I
MAINTAIN IN OCTOBER, HAS LOST
SOME ALTITUDE BUT SHE’S STILL
VERY MUCH IN THE FIGHT.
SO WHERE DO YOU THINK THINGS
STAND IN TERMS OF THE
IDEOLOGICAL FIGHT THAT IS
PLAYING OUT, IS GOING TO I THINK
GET MORE INTENSE OVER THE COURSE
OF THE NEXT MONTH AND A HALF AS
WE START TO GET INTO THOSE EARLY
FEBRUARY STATES IN THE
DEMOCRATIC RACE?
DEMOCRATIC RACE? >> YEAH THINK THERE YOU’RE
RIGHT.
RIGHT. I THINK THE ENERGY THAT YOU SEEN
TWO OR THREE MONTHS AGO ON THE
LEFT, THE IDEA IT WAS TIME FOR
SOMETHING DRAMATIC, TIME TO
ALMOST REF
ALMOST REF ALMOST REVOLUTIONARY IN THE
PARTY, THE WHO CAN WIN ARGUMENT,
YOU’RE RIGHT.
YOU’RE RIGHT. WE TALK ABOUT WHAT THIS ELECTION
IS GOING TO BE ABOUT.
IT’S GOING TO BE ABOUT THIS
THREE, FOUR, FIVE STATES IF THE
COMES DOWN TO THIS SMALL PART OF
THE AMERICA BECAUSE THE REST OF
THE COUNTRY IS LOCKED IN.
AND THAT ARGUMENT IN THE
DEMOCRATIC PARTY IS WHO’S GOING
TO SELL BETTER IN WISCONSIN AND
PENNSYLVANIA?
PENNSYLVANIA? VICE PRESIDENT BIDEN DOES BETTER
IN THOSE POLLS, BUT THE QUESTION
IS WHETHER HE’S STILL AT HIS
PEAK.
PEAK. WE’VE SEEN HIM ON THE CAMPAIGN
TRAIL AT MOMENTS THAT SEEM LESS
THAN IDEAL.
THAN IDEAL. IT’S NOT THE NORMAL BIDEN GAPS,
IT’S IS HE REALLY FULLY IN
COMMAND OF THE STAGE AT THIS
POINT?
POINT? IS HE -- IS HE GOING TO CONTINUE
TO BE ABLE TO DOMINATE A RACE
WHERE THERE ARE MANY CHOICES AT
THIS POINT?
THIS POINT? WHERE DOES MIKE BLOOMBERG COME
IN AT THIS POINT?
HE’S SPENDING AN AWFUL LOT OF
MONEY.
MONEY. HE’S THE ALTERNATIVE IF BIDEN
FAILS FOR THAT MODERATE CENTRIST
DEMOCRATIC VOTE.
DEMOCRATIC VOTE. BUT IT’S A FLUID MOMENT AND
WE’RE ABOUT TO START COMING TO
VOTING PRETTY SOON AND THAT’S
WHEN WE’LL STOP SPECULATING AND
START GETTING ACTUAL RESULTS.
>> LET ME ASK YOU, RICHARD, I’M
CURIOUS.
CURIOUS. THERE’S BEEN SOME TALK ELIZABETH
WARREN’S BEEN TALKING ABOUT
GETTING RID OF THE ELECTORAL
COLLEGE, IT’S NOT GOING TO
HAPPEN, BUT I DO WONDER AS WE
TALK ABOUT THREE STATES AND THE
FUTURE OF OUR REPUBLIC RESTING
ON HOW A SUBSET OF VOTERS IN
THREE OR FOUR STATES VOTE.
IT’S -- IT’S HARD TO NOT
OVERLOOK THE FACT THAT THE
DEMOCRATS HAVE WON THE POPULAR
VOTE IN ’96, IN 2000, IN 2008,
IN 2012, IN 2016 ONLY BUSH IN
2004 WON THE POPULAR VOTE, AND
YOU GET THAT PICTURE FROM THE
’92 CONVENTION OF BILL CLINTON,
AL GORE, HILLARY CLINTON, AND
TIPPER GORE.
TIPPER GORE. AND THREE OF THOSE FOUR PEOPLE
ON STAGE WON THE POPULAR VOTE IN
THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.
THREE OF THOSE FOUR.
>> HOW MANY GOT --
>> AND ONLY ONE GOT TO BE
PRESIDENT.
PRESIDENT. AND I’M JUST CURIOUS, PASSING NO
JUDGMENT ON OUR CONSTITUTION
WHATSOEVER, I LOVE OUR
CONSTITUTION, BUT I’M WONDERING
IF PEOPLE AROUND THE WORLD ASK
YOU WHEN YOU TRAVEL AROUND THE
WORLD, OKAY, WAIT, WAIT, WHAT’S
GOING ON?
GOING ON? >> HOW DOES THIS WORK.
>> DEMOCRATS KEEP WINNING.
THEY’RE GOING TO WIN THE POPULAR
VOTE THIS TIME TOO.
BUT YOU REALLY WORRY ABOUT A
SUBSET OF VOTERS AROUND
MILWAUKEE AND PENNSYLVANIA AND
DETROIT, THEY’RE GOING TO --
JUST IN THOSE THREE METRO AREAS
THEY’RE GOING TO DETERMINE WHO
THE NEXT PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED
STATES IS?
STATES IS? >> YEAH.
>> YEAH. I’M JUST BACK FROM THE MIDDLE
EAST TWO WEEKS BEFORE I WAS IN
CHINA.
CHINA. PEOPLE ARE SO BAFFLED BY THE
UNITED STATES.
UNITED STATES. YOU’RE RIGHT, THERE’S THAT.
WHICH IS IRONIC BECAUSE ONE OF
OUR BIG THINGS HISTORICALLY IS
WE PUSH CONSTITUTIONS ON OTHERS.
WE ENCOURAGE OTHERS TO ADOPT
CONSTITUTIONS.
CONSTITUTIONS. OBVIOUSLY THE DEVIL’S IN THE
DETAILS.
DETAILS. PEOPLE FORGET THAT OURS WAS
WRITTEN AT A TIME WHEN OUR
POPULATION WAS ONE 100th THE
CURRENT SIZE.
CURRENT SIZE. COUNTRY WAS GEOGRAPHICALLY MUCH
MORE CONTAINED.
MORE CONTAINED. WE HAVE NOT ADAPTED AS WE HAVE
EVOLVED AS A COUNTRY, AS A
SOCIETY.
SOCIETY. BUT THERE’S LOTS OF OTHER THINGS
THAT OTHER -- THE EXAMPLE OF
AMERICAN POLITICS, THE EXAMPLE
OF OUR ECONOMY AFTER 2007 AND
’80, THERE’S NOT A LOT OF’
’EIGHT, THERE’S NOT A LOT OF
PEOPLE THAT GET UP IN THE WORLD
AND SAY I WANT TO BE JUST LIKE
THEM.
THEM. >> THAT’S WHAT I DO WITH
HEILMAN.
HEILMAN. >> ALL RIGHT.