>>> NEW REPORTING TONIGHT IN THE MAR-A-LAGO DOCUMENT STORY THAT
DOES GET INTO THAT AREA WHERE PEOPLE JOKE THAT MAGA SUBSTANCE
FOR MAKING ATTORNEYS GET ATTORNEYS.
OR AT LEAST MAKING THEM UNEASY WORKING FOR THE FORMER
PRESIDENT. "THE WASHINGTON POST" HEADLINE
READS, TRUMP LAWYER REFUSED TRUMP REQUEST IN FEBRUARY TO SAY
ALL DOCUMENTS RETURNED AFTER INITIAL RETURN OF 15 BOXES ALEX
CANNON THOUGHT THERE MIGHT BE MORE RECORDS AT MAR-A-LAGO,
PEOPLE FAMILIAR WITH THE MATTER SAID, OUR SARAH MURRAY JOINS US
WITH MORE ON. THIS WHAT ELSE IS IN THIS
"WASHINGTON POST" REPORTING? WHAT DOES IT REVEAL ABOUT WHAT
PURPORTEDLY HAPPENED BETWEEN THE FORMER PRESIDENT AND HIS LAWYER?
>> I THINK WHAT THIS TELLS YOU IS, YOU KNOW, FORMER PRESIDENT
GOING TO ONE OF THE ATTORNEYS EARLIER IN 2022 AND ESSENTIALLY
SAYING WILL YOU TELL THE ARCHIVES THAT EVERYTHING THEY
ASKED FOR WE RETURNED IT. AND YOU SEE IN THIS "WASHINGTON
POST" REPORT THE ATTORNEY IS JUST NOT COMFORTABLE MAKING THAT
STATEMENT. A PERSON WOULD LATER LEARN WHY.
HE MADE THAT STATEMENT AND THEN CAME OUT AFTER THE SUBPOENA
AFTER THE AUGUST SEARCH THAT THERE WERE ALL THE CLASSIFIED
DOCUMENTS AT MAR-A-LAGO. THAT PUTS THE LAWYERS IN LEGAL
JEOPARDY. IT'S CLEAR THIS ATTORNEY HAD
ENOUGH MISGIVINGS HE DIDN'T WANT TO MAKE THAT DECLARATION.
>> THEY HAVE REPORTINGS ABOUT WHO PACKED THE BOXES INITIALLY
RETURNED TO THE NATIONAL ARCHIVES.
WHAT DO THEY SAY ABOUT THAT? >> THAT'S RIGHT.
THESE WERE BOXES RETURNED TO THE ARCHIVES IN JANUARY.
ACCORDING TO THE "WASHINGTON POST," DONALD TRUMP WAS THE ONE
WHO PACKED UP THE BOXES. CERTAINLY THIS WOULD BE
INTERESTING IF THAT IS IN FACT TRUE IF THE FORMER PRESIDENT IS
HANDPICKING THE THINGS THAT GO IN THE BOXES.
WE HAVE TO SAY THAT CNN HAS NOT CONFIRMED THIS REPORTING THAT
FORMER PRESIDENT WAS THE ONE WHO WAS ACTUALLY GOING THROUGH IT.
CERTAINLY IS AN INTERESTING ANECDOTE.
>> SARAH MURRAY, THANK YOU SO MUCH.
>>> JOINING US FOR HIS PERSPECTIVE IS CNN CONTRIBUTOR
AND FORMER NIXON WHITE HOUSE COUNSEL, JOHN DEAN.
JOHN, HOW COULD THIM PACT THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT INVESTIGATION
INTO THE FORMER PRESIDENT AND POTENTIALLY CRIMINAL -- THE
CRIMINAL CASE AGAINST HIM? >> YOU KNOW, I WAS LISTENING TO
SARAH AS SHE WAS REPORTING AND THINKING ABOUT WATERGATE DAYS.
AND HOW THESE STORIES KEEP COMING OUT.
THE KEY EVENTS HAVE HAPPENED. THEY HAVE PUT IN A GRAND JURY.
THE BUZZ AND CONCERN ABOUT HIS TESTIMONY OR LACK THEREOF OR HOW
THE ATTORNEYS ARE GOING DEAL IT WITH HAS ALREADY RIPPLED THROUGH
THE TRUMP TEAM. SO IT JUST SOMETHING WE AND THE
PUBLIC ARE LEARNING. IT LOOKS MORE AND MORE FROM THAT
INFORMATION THAT DEPARTMENT IS WORKING ON A VERY STRONG
OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE CASE. WHY?
>> WHY? BECAUSE PRESIDENT IS -- YOU KNOW
IT WAS THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE IS ACTUALLY IN THE
INVESTIGATION. THE PRESIDENT IS TELLING SOMEONE
TO NOT HONOR OR BE TRUTHFUL ABOUT WHAT YOU'RE TURNING OVER.
HE DICTATED A STATEMENT. THE LAWYER IS NOT GOING TO PUT
HIS NAME ON IT. THEY'LL LATER GIVE SOMEBODY WHO
WILL DO A MODIFIED VERSION OF THAT.
BUT IT'S PART OF A PATTERN. OF OBSTRUCTING THE
INVESTIGATION. >> SO ACCORDING TO THE REPORT,
AGAIN, YOU'RE REFERRING TO ALEX CANNON HERE.
THE FORMER PRESIDENT ASKED THIS ATTORNEY, ALEX CANNON, TO MAKE
THE STATEMENT TO THE NATIONAL ARCHIVES ABOUT THE DOCUMENTS.
BECAUSE IT'S AN ATTORNEY HERE, ARE THERE WAYS THAT THE JUSTICE
DEPARTMENT CAN INVESTIGATE IT WITHOUT HITTING ATTORNEY-CLIENT
PRIVILEGE ROADBLOCKS? >> IF YOU HAVE AN ATTORNEY
UNWILLING TO DO SOMETHING, WHILE HE MAY NOT HAVE TOLD THE
DEPARTMENT OF DIRECTLY IF SO, OTHERS MIGHT HAVE REPORTED IT
FOR HIM. IT DOESN'T SOUND LIKE A
PRIVILEGE IS RAISED HERE. HE WOULD BE ABLE TO FIGHT FOR
THAT FOR A WHILE, AND TRUMP. SOUNDS LIKE THEY'RE OVER THAT
HURDLE AND THIS INFORMATION IS OUT AND PARTst INVESTIGATION.
>> WHAT WILL THE POSSIBLE CRIMINALITY BE IN ASKING YOUR
ATTORNEY TO GIVE FALSE INFORMATION TO A GOVERNMENT
AGENCY? >> JUST THAT.
ASKING YOUR ATTORNEY TO GIVE FALSE INFORMATION.
THAT'S OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE. AND THAT IS PERJURY.
THAT IS FALSE STATEMENTS. IT IS A NASTY CRIME.
AND ONE THAT THE GOVERNMENT IS VERY ACTIVELY PURSUING.
>> AND THE FACT THAT "THE WASHINGTON POST" REPORTS THAT
TRUMP PACKED THE BOX OR BOXES HIMSELF, HOW DOES THAT IMPACT
THE CASE? DOES IT GIVE HIM KNOWLEDGE OR
GREATER KNOWLEDGE OF WHAT WAS IN THE BOXES SNEN THAT KIND OF
DETAIL. HE WOULD BE INVOLVED AND
ACTUALLY PACKING THE BOXES AND DECIDING OUT OF THE THOUSANDS OF
PAGES OF DOCUMENTS THAT ARE THERE TO PUT IN THE BOXES AND
WHAT TO KEEP. HIMSELF.
MAKING DECISIONS OF THAT MIGHT BE SOMEHOW EXPLANATORY.
MAGGIE WILL BE MUCH MORE ATTUNE TO THIS THAN I AM.
AND WHAT WE MIGHT LEARN FROM THE PATTERN OF WHAT HE DID GIVE --
WHAT HE KEPT. SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT I WOULD
KNOW ALL THAT BECAUSE A THE LOT OF WHAT IS CLASSIFIED.
BUT THE NONCLASSIFIED MIGHT SHOW A PATTERN OF WHAT HE WANTED TO
KEEP AND WHY HE WANTED TO KEEP IT. WE WANT TO DISCUSS NOW WITH
CNET LEGAL ANALYST, ELIE HONIG.
ALI, GOOD EVENING. HE HAD ANOTHER TWIST UNTURNED.
IN THE DOCUMENTS AGA. ALEX CANNON, TRUMP'S ATTORNEY,
SAYS THAT ALL THE MATERIAL THE NATIONAL ARCHIVES WAS RETURNED
BUT THEN FIND OUT THERE STILL THOUSANDS MORE DOCUMENTS AT
MAR-A-LAGO. AND TRUMP DO THAT, THEN WHAT
DOES THAT MEAN? >> YES, DON, THIS IS CRUCIAL
EVIDENCE OF DONALD TRUMP'S KNOWLEDGE AND INTENT.
THESE ARE KEEPING THE PROSECUTORS LOOK FOR.
LET'S PLAY THIS OUT. DONALD TRUMP SAYS, TO HIS
LAWYER, I WANT YOU TO TELL THE ARCHIVES THAT WE'VE NOW
RETURNED EVERYTHING TO THEM. THIS IS AFTER THEY RETURNED
THAT INITIAL BATCH OF 15 OR SO BOXES.
THAT IS FALSE WE, KNOW THAT IS FALSE.
THERE ARE NOT JUST A FEW DOCK WITH SCHEDULE RUN MAR-A-LAGO,
BUT THOUSANDS OF DOCUMENTS LEFT.
AND THEN, TRUMP'S LAWYER, RESPONDED THAT I CAN'T OR WON'T
DO THAT. THE ONLY REASON A LAWYER WOULD
DO THAT IT'S COOLER KNOWS IT IS NOT TRUE.
LAWYERS CANNOT LIE TO INVESTIGATORS TO COURT.
SO THAT POINT, DONALD TRUMP CERTAINLY KNOWS THAT HIS LAWYER
BELIEVES IT IS A FALSE STATEMENT.
IT REALLY IS IMPORTANT PROSECUTORS WANT TAKE A CLOSE
LOOK AT. >> WE HAVE A SIMILAR
CONVERSATION, I BELIEVE IT IS LAST WEEK, WE ARE TALKING OF
THE STORY WILL SILENT FOR DONALD TRUMP.
AND I SAID MAYBE THEY DID NOT HAVE A RATIONAL ARGUMENT TO
COME UP WITH. THEY SAY WE CAN ALL STOP WITH
SOMETHING. IS THAT WE'RE SEEING PLAYING
OUT HERE ONCE AGAIN? A SIMILAR THING.
>> IT IS MORE OF THE SAME, THAT.
THIS IS A WAVING RED FLAG. ANYTIME DONALD TRUMP SAYS THEY
PUBLICLY WANT TO ARGUE SOMETHING IN COURT.
AND HIS LAWYERS SAY, NO CAN DO. THE REASON IS, YES, AS WE
DISCUSSED. LAWYERS HAD VERY BROAD LATITUDE
IN THE KIND OF THINK THAT THEIR LAST.
ARGUABLY OUR DUTY, AS A LAWYER TO ARGUE VIGOROUSLY OR YOUR
CLIENT. HOWEVER, YOU CANNOT LIE TO A
COURT UNDER COURT ETHICS RULES. AND YOU SURE SECOND CANNOT LIE
TO INVESTIGATORS, WHETHER THE FROM THE, ARCHIVES OR THE FBI.
BECAUSE THAT IS A FEDERAL CRIME.
TO MAKE A FALSE STATEMENT TO A FEDERAL INVESTIGATOR.
POTENTIALLY, DESTRUCTIVE JUSTICE AS WELL.
SO ANYTIME WE SEE THIS PATTERN, DON.
AND YOU'RE RIGHT, IT'S BEEN A RECURRING PATTERN.
TRUMP SAYS SOMETHING PUBLICLY, HIS LAWYERS REFUSED TO SAY IN
COURT. THANK YOU HAVE YOUR ANTENNA
THERE. >> ELIE, THIS IS FASCINATING.
THE WASHINGTON POST IS REPORTING THAT TRUMP, HIMSELF,
HAD THE BOXES THAT WERE RETURNED IN JANUARY.
WHAT ARE THE IMPLICATIONS OF THAT?
>> SO, THAT IS ACTUALLY IMPORTANT.
ONE OF THE BIG QUESTION IS HOW DID THESE BOXES GET FROM THE
WHITE HOUSE DOWN TO MAR-A-LAGO. AND THEN WHO PUT THEM TOGETHER
FOR THE PIECEMEAL RETURN THAT WAS MADE TO THE ARCHIVES, AND
THEN D.O.D.. WHAT THIS TELLS US THAT DONALD
TRUMP, A, HE IS A HANDS ON GUY I GUESS.
HE PHYSICALLY PUT TOGETHER THOSE BOXES ACCORDING TO THIS
REPORTING OF DOCUMENTS. SO SOMEBODY, AND IF YOU FOLLOW
THOSE REPORTING, SOMEBODY SAID THESE 15 BOXES WE ARE GOING TO
GET BACK TO THE ARCHIVES. WHAT YOU HEARD IN THAT IS NOT
THE REST OF THESE DOCUMENTS. NOT THE OTHER DOCUMENTS THAT
WERE MADE OF MAR-A-LAGO. UNTIL DOJ GETS INVOLVED.
SO, THAT SHOWS ME SOME INTENTIONALITY HERE BY DONALD
TRUMP. SOME CONSCIOUS DECISION MAKING.
GIVE THEM THESE DOCUMENTS, BUT NOT THOSE.
>> THE POST IS ALSO POINTING OUT, HERE, THE TRUMP CONTINUE
TO PRESSURE. THAT TRUMP CONTINUED PRESSURE
AIDS TO MAKE FALSE STATEMENTS EVEN AFTER THEY'RE IN THE
JUSTICE DEPARTMENT WAS INVOLVED IN RETRIEVING DOCUMENTS.
THAT COULD BE SEEN AS OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE.
DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT? IF TRUMP CONTINUED TO PRESSURE
AID THAT CAN BE SEEN AS OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE?
CAN YOU SPEAK TO THAT? >> I DO.
I DO AGREE WITH THAT. THAT REPORTING PROVES THAT IT
IS A CRIME TO MAKE A FALL STATEMENT YOURSELF, TO
INVESTIGATORS. IT ALSO IS A CRIME TO PRESSURE
OTHERS TO MAKE A FALSE STATEMENT.
THAT WOULD BE, SORT OF AN ACCESSORY TO THE FALL
STATEMENT. BUT ALSO, DONALD TRUMP WAS
AWARE THAT THERE WAS A FEDERAL INVESTIGATION GOING ON THAT
FEDERAL DISCUSSION WAS FAIRLY LIKELY.
THEN ALSO COULD BE OBSTRUCTION OF THIS.
KEEP IN, MIND THESE ARE VERY CLOSELY RELATED AND IN SOME
INSTANCES THE EXACT TIME THE DOJ CITED WHEN THEY WENT TO A
JUDGE TO GET THAT SEARCH WARRANT, AND AUGUST.
SO, IT SEEMS LIKE DOJ IS THINKING ALL THESE LINES AS
WELL. >> ELIE HONIG, THANK YOU, SIR I