VERY DANGEROUS, INDEED, WITH ALL
OF THE DIFFERENT FORCES PILING
INTO THIS PART OF NORTHERN
SYRIA.
ERIC?
ERIC: BENJAMIN, THANK YOU SO
MUCH.
ARTHEL: WE'RE GOING TO BRING IN
FORMER DEPUTY ASSISTANT
SECRETARY OF STATE, JOEL RUBIN.
WHAT IS TURKEY DOING, WHAT IS
RUSSIA DOING?
>> YEAH, ARTHEL, TURKEY IS ABOUT
TO ENGAGE IN ETHNIC CLEANSING,
AND RUSSIA IS BACKING THEM UP.
AND IT'S REALLY TRAGIC BECAUSE
WE HAD OUR FOOT ON THE NECK,
ESSENTIALLY, OF ISIS.
WE DEFEATED THEM, AND NOW DONALD
TRUMP IS TAKING IT OFF.
AND I UNDERSTAND WHY HE CLAIMS
HE WANTS TO BRING OUR TROOPS
HOME, BUT AS YOU HEARING FROM
THIS REPORT AS WELL, OUR TROOPS
AREN'T COMING HOME.
THEY'RE GOING TO IRAQ, THEY'RE
STAYING IN SYRIA, AND TURKEY NOW
FEELS FREE REIN TO ENGAGE IN
MASSACRING OUR KURDISH ALLIES
WHO HELPED US DEFEAT ISIS, AND
IT'S A REAL TRAGEDY.
ARTHEL: YEAH.
AND THE TROOPS THAT WENT TO
IRAQ, IRAQ SAYING YOU DIDN'T ASK
ME IF YOU COULD BRING YOUR
TROOPS OVER THERE.
YOU'VE GOT ONE MONTH TO GET THEM
OUT OF HERE.
MEANWHILE, I WANT TO SHOW YOU A
TWEET FROM BRETT McGURK,
FORMER SPECIAL PRESIDENTIAL
ENVOY TO THE MIDDLE EAST, AS YOU
KNOW, TO DEFEAT ISIS.
HE WORKED UNDER PRESIDENTS BUSH,
OBAMA AND TRUMP.
SYRIA, LAST 24 HOURS, U.S.
MILITARY RETURNS TO GUARD OIL
FIELDS.
THOUSANDS OF REFUGEES STREAM IN
OTHER DIRECTION INTO NORTHERN
IRAQ.
ERDOGAN THREATENS AGAIN TO DO
THE CLEANSING WORK IN KURDISH
AREAS.
U.S. FORCES LEFT TO RUSSIA AND
ASSAD.
INCOHERENTMENT SO, JOEL --
INCOHERENT.
SO, JOEL, HAS PRESIDENT TRUMP
RELINQUISHED ALL U.S. POWER TO
COMBAT OR OFFSET THE RAPID
DAMAGE BEING DONE BY ERDOGAN AND
PUTIN?
>> HE HAS.
I HAVE TO SAY IT STRAIGHT LIKE
YOUD ASKED, HE ABSOLUTELY HAS.
HE COMPOUNDED IT NOT JUST BY
GIVING THE GREEN LIGHT TO
ERDOGAN TO INVADE NORTHERN SYRIA
AND HAVE OUR TROOPS WHO WERE
ACTING AS A BUFFER, THEY WERE
PEACEKEEPERS.
THEY WERE NOT ENGAGED IN ACTIVE
COMBAT.
WHEN HE REMOVED THEM, HE GAVE
THE GREEN LIGHT TO TURKEY.
BUT EVEN THIS WEEK HE FALSELY
CLAIMED THAT THE CEASEFIRE WAS
HOLDING AND HE WOULD, THEREFORE,
RELAX AND TAKE AWAY AMERICAN
SANCTIONS ON TURKEY, THEREBY
ESSENTIALLY TELLING ERDOGAN
YOU'RE FREE TO DO WHAT YOU WANT.
AND NOW ERDOGAN MADE A DEAL WITH
RUSSIA, RUSSIA IS THE BIG POWER,
AND AT A STRATEGIC LEVEL THAT
MEANS NOW WE'D HAVE TO TAKE ON
RUSSIA TO GET BACK IN, AND
THAT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.
WE REALLY HAVE VERY FEW LEVERS
TO INFLUENCE WHAT'S HAPPENING ON
THE GROUND.
ARTHEL: MEANWHILE, PRESIDENT
TRUMP IS SAYING U.S. TROOPS WILL
GO BACK IN TO PROTECT THE OIL
FIELDS IN EASTERN SYRIA.
HOW MANY TROOPS WOULD REALLY BE
NEEDED FOR THIS, AND WILL THEY
TRY TO REENLIST HELP FROM THE
KURDS?
>> THIS IS THE HIGHLY DEBATABLE,
AND THIS IS THE DANGER WITH THE
WAY THAT THE PRESIDENT ENACTED
THIS POLICY.
HE DID NOT PLAN IT OUT.
THERE WAS NO INTERAGENCY PROCESS
WITH THE DoD TO SECURE OIL
FIELDS.
SO NOW THEY'RE GOING IN, BUT
IT'S NOT EVEN CLEAR THAT THAT'S
A BIG PRIORITY, QUITE FRANKLY.
OIL FIELDS IN THE PAST, THEY
WERE USED TO FUND ISIS, THEN WE
DESTROYED THEM THROUGH AIR
RAIDS.
IT'S NOT QUITE SURE WHAT THE
ACTUAL PURPOSE IS.
HE MAY FIND IT ATTRACTIVE, THERE
ARE OTHERS WHO WANT US TO CREEP
BACK IN AND THINK THAT'S A WAY
TO BEGIN TO DO THAT.
BUT FROM A POLICY PERSPECTIVE,
THE OIL FIELDS ARE VERY
INSIGNIFICANT, QUITE FRANKLY.
CERTAINLY TO OUR OIL USE HERE AT
HOME.
THE BIG ISSUE IS TURKEY'S
INCURSION NOW INTO AN ETHNIC
CLEANSING OPERATION AGAINST THE
KURDS AND RUSSIA'S STRONGHOLD
RIGHT THERE.
THOSE ARE THE BIG ISSUES THAT
WE'RE NOT GRAPPLING WITH AND
THAT WE SHOULD BE.
ARTHEL: SO FAR YOU'VE GOT 900
SQUARE MILES THAT HAVE BEEN
SEIZED BY TURKISH AND RUSSIAN
FORCES, 160,000 KURDISH
CIVILIANS HAVE BEEN DISPLACED.
SO WILL THE KURDS, ALL ALL
DIVISIONS, BE SLAUGHTERED OR IS
THERE REALLY A DEAL WITH THE
DEVIL THAT CAN SAVE THEM?
>> WELL, THE KURDS THOUGHT THEY
HAD A DEAL WITH THE DEVIL, AND
THAT DEVIL BEING ASSAD OF SYRIA.
AND THEY THOUGHT HE WOULD
PROVIDE PROTECTION, BUT THAT
PROTECTION HASN'T COME.
RUSSIA CONTROLS ASSAD.
WILL RUSSIA STEP IN AND
POTENTIALLY PROTECT THEM?
BUT THE BIG QUESTION HOVERING
OVER ALL OF THIS IS THEN WHAT?
WHAT ABOUT THE THREE AND A HALF
MILLION SYRIANS SITTING IN
SOUTHERN TURKEY?
WILL THEY BE PUSHED INTO THOSE
CLEARED AREAS, CREATING A
VIOLATION OF THE GENEVA
CONVENTIONS OF A MASS POPULATION
TRANSFER IN THE PROCESS?
NONE OF THESE ARE ADDRESSED.
BUT WE NEED TO HAVE A ROBUST,
FRANKLY, ROBUST INTERNATIONAL
DIPLOMATIC DISCUSSION NOW WITH
URGENCY TO INSURE THAT THESE
ISSUES GET DISCUSSED AND
RESOLVED.
BUT THAT TIME WAS BEFORE WE
LEFT.
WE STILL HAVE TO TRY TO DO IT,
BUT THOSE ARE THE ISSUES RIGHT
NOW THAT ARE VERY SERIOUS AND,
YES, I THINK AN ETHNIC CLEANSING
IS VERY MUCH IN THE OFFING
POTENTIALLY FROM TURKEY.
ARTHEL: FINALLY, JOEL WITH, WHAT
ABOUT ISIS?
WILL ISIS REGROUP AGAIN?
NOT NECESSARILY AS A CALIPHATE,
BUT ENOUGH TO SERIOUSLY THREATEN
THE U.S. AND EUROPEAN ALLIES?
>> SO THINK OF IT, IF YOU'RE THE
KURDS WHO HAVE BEEN FIGHTING
ISIS AND THEY LOST 31,000
PLUS -- 11,000 PLUS SOLDIERS AT
OUR REQUEST WHEN THEY COMBATED
ISIS FIGHTERS, THEY WERE THE
ONES PROTECTING AND GUARDING
AGAINST ISIS.
NOW THEY'RE DEFENDING FOR THEIR
LIVES, THEY'RE PROTECTING THEIR
FAMILIES.
ISIS IS THE LAST THING ON THEIR
MIND.
AND WE ALSO HAVE MANY PROBLEMS
WITH TURKEY RELATED TO ISIS OVER
THE YEARS, AND THE TURKS DID NOT
VIEW ISIS AS THEIR THREAT, THEY
VIEW KURDISH MILITIAS AS THEIR
THREAT.
ISIS, THEY'RE NOT GOING TO BE
GUARDED BY THE KURDS.
SO WHAT HAPPENS THEN?
WE HAVE ISIS FREE.
ARTHEL: AND THEY'RE NOT JUST,