CHANGING THE LAW'S VERY
EXISTENCE.
THAT CONVERSATION IS AHEAD THAT
YOU DON'T WANT TO MISS.
>>> BUT WE DO WANT TO BEGIN WITH
THAT BREAKING NEWS AND THE
POTENTIAL SIGN OF DIPLOMACY OR
SUCCESS FROM DIPLOMACY IN THE
WAR ON UKRAINE.
THE HEAD OF THE UKRAINIAN
DELEGATION, DAVID, JUST A SHORT
TIME AGO, IN A TELEVISED
INTERVIEW, SAYING DRAFT PEACE
TREATY DOCUMENTS BETWEEN RUSSIA
AND UKRAINE ARE AT A, QUOTE,
ADVANCED ENOUGH STAGE TO ALLOW
FOR DIRECT TALKS BETWEEN PUTIN
AND ZELENSKYY.
WE HAVE ALI ARUOZI ON THE GROUND
FOR US IN LVIV, UKRAINE.
GOOD TO SEE YOU.
THIS IS A MAJOR AND RATHER
UNEXPECTED DEVELOPMENT AMONGST
ALL OF THIS.
WHAT MORE DO WE KNOW?
>> Reporter: IT CERTAINLY IS AN
UNEXPECTED DEVELOPMENT.
WE WEREN'T EXPECTING TO HEAR
THIS TODAY, BUT AS YOU SAID,
UKRAINIAN NEGOTIATORS SAYING
THAT THOSE PEACE DRAFT TREATIES
HAVE REACHED AN ADVANCED ENOUGH
STAGE TO WARRANT A MEETING
BETWEEN ZELENSKYY AND PUTIN
IN-PERSON.
THEY SAY THEY'VE REACHED SOME OF
THOSE DRAFTS IN THOSE LAST
ROUNDS OF TALKS WHICH, QUITE
FRANKLY, HADN'T SEEMED TO GO
PARTICULARLY WELL.
NOBODY WAS HOPEFUL ANYTHING TANGIBLE WOULD COME OUT OF THOSE
TANGIBLE WOULD COME OUT OF THOSE
TALKS, NOT LEAST OF ALL THAWSBEC
THE UKRAINIAN FOREIGN MINISTER
WARNED PEOPLE NOT TO EAT OR
DRINK ANYTHING IN CASE THE
RUSSIANS POISONED THEM.
THE MEETINGS WERE COLD.
THEY DIDN'T SHAKE HANDS.
THIS REALLY IS A BIG SURPRISE.
THEY'RE SAYING THAT NOTHING HAS
BEEN PUT DOWN ON PAPER YET, BUT
THIS IS A VERBAL AGREEMENT
BETWEEN THE TWO SIDES THAT
RUSSIA HAS AGREED TO MANY OF THE
PROPOSALS THAT UKRAINE HAS PUT
FORWARD, WITH THE EXCEPTION OF
CRIMEA.
THEY SAID THEY'RE NOT WILLING TO
TALK ABOUT CRIMEA AT ALL, IN ANY
SORT OF PEACE TALKS, BUT STILL,
THIS IS A HUGE STEP FORWARD FROM
NOTHING TANGIBLE HAVING HAPPENED
IN THE PAST BETWEEN THE TWO
COUNTRIES.
NOW, THEY'RE SAYING THAT THE --
THERE'S NO DATE FOR THEM, BUT
THEY'RE SAYING THAT THEY ARE
POTENTIALLY GOING TO TAKE PLACE
IN TURKEY.
TURKEY IS, OF COURSE, BEEN
BROKERING A LOT OF THESE TALKS
THAT HAVE BEEN GOING ON IN THE
PAST, THEY SAY MAY TAKE PLACE IN
INSTAN
IN
ISTANBUL OR ANKARA.
SO FAR, ALL THE TALKS HAVE BEEN
AT WORKING LEVEL.
THERE'S ONLY BEEN ONE SERIES OF
TALKS BETWEEN THE FOREIGN
MINISTERS OF RUSSIA AND UKRAINE.
SO, AT A PRESIDENTIAL LEVEL,
THAT'S WHERE THE DECISIONS ARE
GOING TO BE MADE.
THAT'S WHERE A BREAKTHROUGH WILL
HAPPEN IF THEY CAN COME TO SOME
SORT OF UNDERSTANDING WITH EACH
OTHER.
IT ALSO MAY BE AN INDICATION
THAT RUSSIA HAS REALIZED THAT
THIS WAR REALLY IS NOT GOING IN
ITS FAVOR.
THEY HAVEN'T BEEN ABLE TO
CAPTURE ANY MAJOR CITIES HERE.
THE UKRAINIANS REMAIN IN CONTROL
OF VAST AMOUNTS OF THEIR OWN
TERRITORY, SO HOPEFULLY THE
RUSSIANS MIGHT BE LOOKING FOR A
WAY TO END THIS WAR AND SAVE
FACE.
ALSO IN THAT INTERVIEW, THE
NEGOTIATOR GAVE ON UKRAINIAN TV,
HE SAID THAT GERMANS, ITALIANS,
AND THE TURKS WERE WILLING TO
GIVE THE UKRAINIANS THOSE
SECURITY GUARANTEES THAT THEY
WERE LOOKING FOR IF THEY AGREE
NOT TO JOIN NATO.
SO A LOT OF ADVANCES SEEM TO
HAVE BEEN MADE IN A VERY SHORT
PERIOD OF TIME.
>> IT'S INTERESTING, ALI, AND I
WOULD LIKE YOUR ANALYSIS ON THIS
AS YOU'VE BEEN COVERING THIS WAR
NOW FOR THE PAST FEW WEEKS OR
SO, BUT I'M CAUTIOUSLY
OPTIMISTIC AS TO WHAT WE'RE
HEARING, OF COURSE, FROM UKRAINE
ON UKRAINE TELEVISION AND I SAY
THAT BECAUSE YOU TALK
SPECIFICALLY, OF COURSE, ABOUT
THE COMMUNICATIONS WE HEARD FROM
THOSE TALKS HAPPENING IN TURKEY.
THE UKRAINIANS SEEMED A LOT MORE
OPTIMISTIC THAN THE RUSSIANS DID
COMING OUT OF THOSE TALKS,
ESPECIALLY FROM THE REPORTING WE
HEARD FROM OUR OWN KEIR SIMMONS
SO I'M KEEPING THAT IN MIND AS
WE'RE HEARING THIS REPORTING
FROM A POSSIBLE MEETING BETWEEN
THE TWO LEADERS.
TALK ABOUT THAT A LITTLE BIT AND
THE SIGNIFICANCE OF TURKEY, OF
ISTANBUL BEING A POSSIBLE PEACE
BROKER AMIDST ALL OF THIS.
>> Reporter: THAT'S RIGHT.
THE UKRAINIANS WERE MORE UPBEAT
ABOUT IT.
I THINK THEY WERE TRYING TO BE
DIPLOMATIC AS WELL.
OBVIOUSLY, YOU KNOW, NOTHING
TANGIBLE HAD COME OUT FROM THE
PREVIOUS TALKS, AND THEY WANT TO
SHOW THAT THEY'RE FLEXIBLE,
THAT, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE WILLING
TO TALK TO THE RUSSIANS AT ANY
TIME, AT ANY PLACE, AT ANY
LEVEL, AND THEY WANTED TO SHOW
THAT THE RUSSIANS ARE THE ONES
BEING OBSTINATE.
THEY'RE THE ONES THAT DON'T WANT
TO COME TO THE TABLE, ESPECIALLY
VLADIMIR PUTIN, BECAUSE HE HAD
SHOWN NO SIGNS OF WILLING TO
JOIN ANY TALKS.
SO, YOU HAVE TO TAKE IT WITH A
PINCH OF SALT.
I AGREE WITH YOU.
UNTIL THEY ACTUALLY MEET AND
SOMETHING REALLY BIG DOES
HAPPEN, NOTHING HAS HAPPENED
UNTIL THAT POINT.
BUT THIS IS BIG.
AND OBVIOUSLY, THE TURKS WANT TO
BE A MAJOR PLAYER IN ALL OF
THIS.
THEY'RE THE ONES THAT KEEP
SAYING THEY'RE TALKING TO THE
UKRAINIANS, TALKING TO THE
RUSSIANS, THEY'RE TRYING TO
BRING THE TWO SIDES AT A
PRESIDENTIAL LEVEL TOGETHER SO
THEY WANT TO LOOK LIKE THE PEACE
BROKER IN ALL OF THIS TERRIBLE
WAR BETWEEN THESE TWO COUNTRIES.
SO, THEY ARE GOING TO PUSH VERY
HARD FOR THIS TO HAPPEN IN
ISTANBUL, IN ANKARA AS SOON AS
POSSIBLE BUT A LOT OF THIS
DEPENDS ON WHAT HAPPENS ON THE
GROUND HERE AS WELL.
AS THE RUSSIANS ARE LOSING
TERRITORY HERE THAT THEY HAD
CAPTURED AT THE BEGINNING OF THE
WAR, IT MAY BE MAKING THEM
REASSESS WHAT THEY NEED TO DO TO
GET OUT OF THIS AND SAVE SOME
FACE AND MAYBE GET THOSE
GUARANTEES FROM UKRAINE THAT
NAIR NOT GOING TO JOIN NATO.
JUST A FEW DAYS AGO, WE WERE
SAYING, IT'S PROBABLY NOT ENOUGH
FOR THE RUSSIANS TO ACCEPT
UKRAINE NOT JOINING NATO.
IT LOOKS LIKE THEY WANT SOME
LAND TOO.
SO, THIS IS GOING TO BE VERY
INTERESTING TO SEE WHAT COMES
OUT OF THOSE TALKS.
>> EXACTLY.
SO, ALI, AS YOU'RE THERE AND
YOU'RE FOLLOWING THIS
DEVELOPMENTS ON THIS, IF YOU
HAVE ANYTHING NEW, GIVE US A