MINUTES TRAVELING SOUTHBOUND. IT’S 12 MINUTES. THAT’S A LOOK AT YOUR TEETH. KRISTEN? TOYOTA
TIME SAVER TRAFFIC.
>>BRUCE HAMILTON: HISTORY IS
VERY TELLING NUMBER OF SCHOOL
SHOOTINGS BALLOONED OVER THE
PAST 20 YEARS AS HAVE THE
NUMBER OF SCHOOL RESOURCE
OFFICERS ON CAMPUS. ALEX
BATTALLA SOCIOLOGIST AT THE
CITY UNIVERSITY OF NEW YORK
SAID THE IDEA THAT A STANDARD
ARM SCHOOL POLICE OFFICER IS
GOING TO STOP SOMEONE IN THAT
SITUATION HAS PROVEN NOT TO BE
TRUE TIME AND TIME AGAIN. AND
HE NOTED THAT POLICE AND
SECURITY GUARDS ARE OFTEN THE
FIRST CASUALTIES IN MASS
SHOOTING EVENTS. JOINING ME ON
THE MORNING SHOW, MARC
CHANDLER, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR
OF THE JUSTICE POLICY
INSTITUTE IN THE NATION’S
CAPITAL. GOOD MORNING.
>> GOOD MORNING. THANKS FOR
HAVING ME. MY PLEASURE. I KNOW
YOU CO-AUTHORED A REPORT FROM
THE BROOKINGS INSTITUTION.
>>BRUCE HAMILTON: AND THE
STUDY FOUND NO EVIDENCE THAT
HAVING POLICE IN SCHOOLS MAKE
SCHOOLS SAFER OR PREVENTS
SCHOOL SHOOTING. SO SRO’S NOT
THE WAY TO GO.
>> UNFORTUNATELY, NOT THE WAY
TO GO. I MEAN, IF IT WORKED,
IT WOULD BE BUT THERE’S NO
EVIDENCE TO SHOW THAT IT DOES
WORK. AND IN FACT,
UNFORTUNATELY, THERE’S
EVIDENCE TO SHOW THAT THERE’S
UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES OF
HAVING POLICE IN SCHOOLS. WHAT
WE SEE IS THAT WHERE THERE ARE
POLICE IN SCHOOLS, A KID SOME
MORE LIKELY TO BE SUSPENDED
AND EXPELLED AND MORE LIKELY
TO BE REFERRED TO THE TO THE
JUVENILE JUSTICE SYSTEM. WHAT
MANY REFER TO AS THE SCHOOL TO
PRISON PIPELINE AND THESE
THESE NEGATIVE IMPACTS SCHOOL
DISPROPORTIONATELY ON YOUNG
PEOPLE OF COLOR. SO IN MANY
WAYS, UNFORTUNATELY, WE GET
THE WORST OF BOTH WORLDS. WE
GET IMPROVEMENTS TO SCHOOL
SAFETY. AND WE SOME REALLY
DAMAGING EFFECTS TO YOUNG
PEOPLE, PARTICULARLY YOUNG
PEOPLE OF COLOR.
>>BRUCE HAMILTON: BUT IN SOME
CASES, DOES THE SRO IS PRESENT
FOSTER BETTER RELATIONSHIPS
WITH THE STUDENTS WHEN IT
COMES TO POLICE RELATIONSHIPS
IN GENERAL.
>> YOU KNOW THAT THAT THAT’S
POSSIBLE, ALTHOUGH IT’S A LOT
OF MONEY TO FOR THAT. REALLY
WHAT WE SEE IS THAT THE BEST
WAY TO IMPROVE SCHOOL SAFETY
IS TO CREATE A CULTURE WHERE
KIDS FEEL TRUSTED AND WHERE
THEY CAN TRUST ADULTS. AND WE
SEE THAT THAT HAPPENS MORE
OFTEN THAN NOT. WHEN YOU HAVE
TRAINED COUNSELORS AND SOCIAL
WORKERS. YOU KNOW, ONCE WHEN
SCHOOL OFFICIALS WHEN COUNTY
OFFICIALS ARE MAKING BUDGET
DECISIONS, THAT’S WHERE THEY
SHOULD MAKE BE MAKING THEIR
INVESTMENT SCHOOL. POLICE
OFFICERS ARE MORE EXPENSIVE
AND COUNSELORS AND SOCIAL
WORKERS AND THEY DON’T GET THE
RESULTS THAT WE WANT.
>> THAT SAID, I KNOW THAT AT
JUSTICE POLICY INSTITUTE, A
SCHOOL OF THOUGHT IS THE
POLICE PRESENCE IS OFTEN
COUNTERPRODUCTIVE. AS YOU JUST
SAID, THINGS THAT WOULD HAVE
US IN THE PRINCIPAL’S OFFICE
WHEN WE WERE KIDS ARE
ESCALATED, I GUESS IS THE BEST
WORD.
>> YEAH, THAT’S ABSOLUTELY
RIGHT. SO THINGS WHERE YOU AND
I WHEN WE WERE IN SCHOOL THAT
ICE BEHAVIORS THAT MIGHT
RESULT IN A TRIP TO THE
PRINCIPAL’S OFFICE TODAY, TOO
OFTEN ACTUALLY RESULTS TO A
TRIP TO THE POLICE PRECINCT.
AND SO WE’RE CRIMINALIZING OUR
YOUNG PEOPLE AND IT’S HAVING
VERY NEGATIVE FX WITH KIDS
BEING SUSPENDED AND EXPELLED.
AND SO WE CAN DO A LOT BETTER.
WE DO KNOW THE TYPES OF
SERVICES AND SUPPORTS THAT
YOUNG PEOPLE NEED. AND THAT’S
THE TYPE THINGS WE SHOULD BE
INVESTING IN. YOU TAKE EARLY
THESE WERE COMING OUT OF 2
YEARS, 2 PLUS YEARS OF A WE
KNOW THAT THE MENTAL HEALTH
NEEDS FOR YOUNG PEOPLE ARE
EVEN MORE SO THAN THEY WERE
BEFORE AND BEFORE THE
PANDEMIC. WE DIDN’T HAVE
ENOUGH MENTAL HEALTH SUPPORT
IN SCHOOL. SO WE SHOULD BE
DOUBLING DOWN ON THOSE TYPES
OF INVESTMENTS.
>>BRUCE HAMILTON: NOT ON
SCHOOL POLICE. SO LET’S SPEND
ON THAT A BIT MORE. IS THAT
WHAT WILL KEEP SCHOOLS IN OUR
KIDS SAFE?
>> YOU KNOW WHAT IT WILL BE
WHAT MAKE OUR SCHOOLS SAFER.
THERE’S NO GUARANTEE THIS IS
HARD WORK. AND SO WE NEED TO
PUT IN THE BUT UNFORTUNATELY,
SCHOOL POLICE I WOULD REFER TO
AS MORE POLICY BY SOUND BITE
AND SOUNDS APPEALING. IT
SOUNDS LIKE IT WILL WORK, BUT
UNFORTUNATELY, THE RESEARCH
JUST DOESN’T BEAR THAT OUT.
AND WE SEE IN THE SCHOOL
SHOOTINGS TIME AGAIN WHERE WE
POLICE OFFICERS THERE ON SITE.
IT DOESN’T PREVENT THOSE TYPES
OF INCIDENTS. SO WE NEED TO DO
THE HARD DAILY WORK TO MAKE
SURE THAT KIDS HAVE ADULTS.
THEY CAN TRUST ADULTS THAT
THEY FEEL COMFORTABLE TALKING
TO AND THAT’LL BE THE TYPE
THING THAT WILL MAKE OUR
SCHOOLS SAFER.
>>BRUCE HAMILTON: AND WE KNOW
THE REALITY. THERE’S A LACK
RESOURCES FOR EDUCATION
FUNDING. DO WE AS A SOCIETY
HAVE TO SIT BACK AND CONFRONT
SOME VERY HARSH REALITIES AND
DECIDE WHAT OUR PRIORITIES ARE
HERE.
>> WE ABSOLUTELY DO. OF
COURSE, POLICE ARE IMPORTANT
PART OF THE PUBLIC SAFETY
STRATEGY. AND SO WE’RE NOT
SAYING THAT WE SHOULDN’T HAVE
POLICE AVAILABLE TO RESPOND TO
SCHOOLS THAT THERE SHOULDN’T
BE RELATIONSHIPS THAT ARE
BUILT BETWEEN SCHOOL
ADMINISTRATORS AND POLICE
DEPARTMENTS. BUT WE HAVE TO
FIGURE OUT WHERE ARE OUR
RESOURCES CAN BE SPENT MOST
EFFECTIVELY. WE SHOULDN’T BE
ASKING POLICE TO DO THINGS
THAT THEY’RE NOT TRAINED OR
EQUIPPED TO DO. AND SO IN
SCHOOLS WHEN WE NEED
COUNSELING, WE NEED SOCIAL
WORK. THOSE ARE THE TYPES OF
THINGS THAT TRAINED COUNSELORS
AND SOCIAL WORK SHOULD BE
DOING. WE SHOULDN’T BE ASKING
POLICE TO SORT OF FAKE IT AND
DO THOSE JOBS. THEY SHOULD BE
OUT IN THE COMMUNITY DOING
WHAT THEY CAN TO PREVENT AND
RESPOND TO CRIME AND THE BEST
PLACE FOR THEM IS NOT IN
SCHOOLS. SO MAYBE WE’RE BEING
A BIT MYOPIC AND WE HAVE TO
LOOK AT THE BIGGER PICTURE.