Susan, what's really going on there?
What's really going on there is,
it's a lockdown facility where these girls are broken.
That is his goal, that is his stated goal
in written material and in sermons.
The goal is to break the will.
What kind of teen were you before you went?
Were you rebellious?
Were you?
I actually wasn't rebellious,
but I did run away from home.
Well, that sounds kind of rebellious.
(audience laughs)
Yes.
But then when you got to this facility,
did that seem worse than where you came from?
Oh yes, I agreed to go to Hephzibah House.
It was painted to me as being,
you know, a lovely place for healing,
where I would get personal one on one counseling
with professionals who specialized in child sexual abuse.
You said when you were there,
at 30 weeks for example, in total time,
you weren't allowed to speak.
Absolutely.
And why were you not allowed to speak?
I was constantly on sentence restriction
because I'm not, it's not very easy to break my will.
Well, how was that achieved?
How did they keep you from talking for 30 weeks?
Sentence restriction, it's given weekly.
That's where you are given,
you have to write a bible passage.
So, let's say 12, 13 verses 500 times.
While you're on sentence restriction,
you are not allowed to communicate
with the girls you're around.
You are only allowed to do necessary talking
to the staff such as, "May I use the restroom?"
There was no communication.
So other than that, no chitchat?
Absolutely not. You can't talk at dinner.
You can't talk to somebody in the hallway.
Nope. Or in the bedrooms?
Or anything like that?
Nope, and if you were caught trying to communicate,
like if you made eye contact with somebody in a mirror,
you would not be able to look in the mirror,
and sometimes if they thought you were gonna communicate,
you would have to look right at a wall.
I recognize that sometimes if you've got like,
wild, out of control, defiant, rebellious,
screw authority, I'll do what I want,
sometimes you have to be rigid in restriction and structure,
I'm not saying abusive.
These are two very different things,
but I'm curious what kind of young girls
they were dealing with.
What was your situation?
I was in a fundamentalist home already,
so by mainstream standards, I was a pretty good kid,
but I did rebel against my parents' rules,
which was not listening to the radio,
not watching television, not wearing pants.
And rebel how?
I would sneak and listen to the radio,
and if I had a friend that I could go to
that wasn't part of the church and they had a television,
I would watch it or if I thought I could.
So, you would listen to the radio?
Yeah. You devil child!
Right, right.
(audience laughs)
We told the pastor that there were allegations
that this was a prison like condition,
and here's what he said.
We said it was like a dark basement,
and only outside occasionally,
12 foot fence like a prison around.
His response was, "The girls live
"in a ground level walkout basement,
"which has many windows looking out to a large yard.
"Sunlight comes in every day.
"The outside recreation area is large
"and includes a volleyball net,
"a fire pit where the girls enjoy songs,
"fellowship on warm summer evenings,
"roasting marshmallows and singing songs together.
"The area also includes a large garden
"for raising vegetables,
"beautiful flowers as well as a picnic area where meals
"and other outdoor activities are enjoyed in good weather.
"They also enjoy ministry animals such as dogs,
"rabbits, kittens, and even a farm animal or two.
"The girls are outside five days a week
"in nice weather, on weekends as well.
"They walk every day after school around a track,
"or if it's raining,
"they do a Leslie Sansone walking program."
They walk in a gerbil trail around that little fence.
How many times, do you think, Kalie?
I can't say specifically how many times.
We would, it was during bible memories,
so we would be, until the staff thought
that we had gone around the track
and recited the bible verses that we were learning,
'cause we were required for our star charts
to say scriptures as part of our grading system.
So, they would help us memorize by walking around the trail.
I would say probably 12 times seems about right,
but I can't be sure.
Because this sounds like Mary Poppins,
like you're walking around with umbrellas.
These are rarities.
This is not a common occurrence that we get to enjoy.