Washington, D.C.
I'm Jessica Dean.
Good morning, everyone.
Jim sciutto is off today.
New this morning, house
Democrats releasing six years
worth of former president
trump's tax returns, giving
deeper insight into his personal
financial situation.
Right now, CNN is sifting
through the hundreds of
documents that were just
released in the last hour.
But the former president is
already responding.
CNN national correspondent
Kristin Holmes joins me now to
break it all down.
Walk us through what we're
learning from the tax returns,
again the caveat being they just
came out an hour ago and there
is say lot of data here and how
the former president is
responding.
>> So a as you said, we have a
team combing through hundreds of
pages but trump paid a very low
amount of income tax in the
first and last year of
presidency.
We're talking about 2017 he paid
$750.
2018 and 2019, it was combined
$1.1 million in income tax and
in 2020 it was $0 and that is
important and here is why.
We hope the tax returns will
show the raw data of the numbers
but it is looking at the
detailed documents that were
providing to give us insight
into his businesses.
Are they really as successful as
he has said.
And I talked to a number of tax
experts who say that $0, that
indicates that there might be
been some faltering business.
He said in 2016 it was smart not
to pay taxes when he was talking
with Hillary Clinton about why
he wouldn't release them.
But is it actually business
losses?
Which is important when you
think about the political
ramifications of a man who ran
on the fact that he was a
wealthy and therefore successful
businessman and trump is
agitated.
He has already issued a
statement saying Democrats
shouldn't have done this and the
great usa divide will now grow
far worse.
The radical left Democrats have
weaponized everything.
But remember that this is a
dangerous two-way street.
And he released a video as part
of the 2024 campaign calling on
Republican tosz start looking
into Biden's finances and to
Biden's family.
So that is what he referred to
when he talks about a two-way
street.
>> And the GOP is taking over
the house in mere days with a
lot of over sight.
We know that Richard Neil put
out a statement after this came
out.
Of course he's the Democrat.
>> And he said congress serves
as a check on the executive
branchond our committee is
entrusted with an over sight.
A president is no ordinary
taxpayer, they hold power and
influence and with great power
comes greater responsibility.
And the important thing to note
here is that trump said -- he
broke an enormous amount of
precedent when he became the
first president in modern
history not to release his
taxes.
This is something he chose to
do.
And on top of that.
That is something that for
decades he has shielded from the
public.
And one other thing I want I to
quickly touch on is foreign
entities and bank accounts.
That is something that we're
going through these additional
documents for.
Does he have foreign bank
accounts?
Are there any foreign owned
businesses.
That is important because you
remember this was a big topic of
conversation during his entire
presidency so that is something
we're looking at closely as we
go through the hundreds of
pages.
>> We also want to bring in
Margaret taller, and Steven
Rosenthal.
Great to have you all here.
Margaret, let's start first with
you.
As I mentioned the GOP taking
control of the house in mere
days.
Timing everything here.
The Democrats releasing these at
the last minute they kind of
could.
We know that Republicans are
planning for a lot of oversight
investigations but is there any
indication that they'll try to
push back on this specifically?
>> I think they're going to
message around it but we've
already seen that.
But Republicans have an
opportunity, if they want to,
they could push to put this in
legislation so future
presidents, including democratic
presidents, will be required to
release this.
That is not where their
messaging is at right now and it
might never get there.
Are they going to use this to
try to require more disclosure
from Joe Biden and from everyone
in Joe Biden's family.
Probably.
But there is a difference
between running for president
for the United States and being
related to a candidate has long
been what Americans expect.
And the messaging from
Republicans so far has been if
they could do this to Donald
Trump, they could do this to
you.
The ordinary person will all
have of our voluminous tax
information revealed.
It is simply not true.
Second of all, there is no
interest in making an ordinary
member of the tax public's
records and what would it show.
Many people who earn a fraction
of Donald Trump's holdings are
paid much more in taxes in 2020
to the best of everyone's
knowledge.
And so, it is -- so far the
messaging is a scare tactic but
it is not on point.
There is a completely different
standard and the polling shows
that a huge majority, between
two-thirds and four out of five
Americans say that former
president trump's tax returns
should be made public.
>> And it is the precedent.
And to your point, the average
American is not running for
president or the president.
There are very few Americans
doing that.
Steven, you could explain what
you would be looking for, that
would be a blockbuster
revelation beyond what we've
earned in bits and pieces or key
nuggets that could be gleaned
from them?
>> Well, we just got the
documents posted.
And I've been looking closely at
foreign accounts, and foreign
sources of income, and in the
last hour what strikes me
immediately is that in 2015, '16
and '17, Donald Trump had
foreign accounts in the U.K.,
Ireland, China and also it looks
like St. Thomas, S.T.
And then in 2018 only U.K. And
then in 2020 only U.K. And that
is what I'm looking at.
And we know from last month's
trial of the trump organization
in New York, that trump's tax
account apts said that his
presidential returns had to be
squeaky clean.
So I suspect that things got
cleaned up some later on.
>> Yeah.
And it is interesting and that
is a little bit of what Kristin
was talking about earlier, too,
you said it is key about foreign
entities where would -- where
was the money going and what
foreign entities was he involved
with.
We know that president trump was
supposed to have a mandatory
audit from the irs and he didn't
have one three out of four
years.
He was always so paranoid around
his taxes as you alluded to
earlier.
Do you think that there is any
appetite to codify this into law
from -- it would have to come
through congress.
But also doesn't this just speak
to just the broader paranoia of
trump's feelings around his
money and his taxes.
>> And I do think to goes to
politics in general.
When you think about trump, you
could say is his base going to
turn on him for anything that
happens and is this something
they will do, probably not.
Before he was considering that
level of politics, this is
something that he sold his life
on.
The trump hotel, it was his
brand and it was associated with
success and wealth.
So that is part of why there
have been rumors for decades
around New York that he might
not be as wealthy as he seemed.
I taurked to some of the closest
associated believes he would
never run for president and it
is too much financial scrutiny
because he's so private and
invested in not sharing the
information publicly, you
couldn't get through that and
run for president.
He did and he did not release
his taxes and broke precedent
there.
But yes, this is a big part of
how he even ran back in 2016.
He said that if he could be the
successful of a business man he
could successfully run a nation
and that is why we're looking so
closely as just how successful
those businesses were and that
is why it is so interesting when
you look at the fact that, yes,
some of this is strategic
accounting, people with that
kind of money and resources do,
they claim large losses and they
carry over millions of dollars,
we already know he carried over
$105 million in 2015,
$73 million.
These are losses in order to
offset his income tax and pay
less money.
But when you look at 2020
number, did that come from the
offsets or was this a covid
number or where businesses were
severely impacted.
So it is interesting to paint a
picture of this because we only
know one narrative and it is
Donald Trump's narrative that he
is a wealthy, successful
business man and that is what
gives him this power and this
strength in this country.
>> And Steven, do you believe
that president should be
required by law to disclose
their tax returns?
Should this be codified and be
made mandatory, should there be
a mandatory audit?
>> Yes.
Tax returns are a window into a
person's financial character.
And we need to know about our
president as to whether he's
pursuing our interest or his
own.
And to your point earlier, sure,
legislation would be quite
helpful and the house already
passed legislation but it
couldn't get past by the senate
before the congress adjourned.
As to rich people generating and
carrying over hundreds of
millions of dollars of losses,
in my practice experience, that
is unusual.
Trump lost money spectacularly,
tens and hundreds of million
dollars through the 1990s and
2000s.
For this five-year period, 2015
through 2020 trump businesses
lost $7 million to
$20 million.
Every single year he lost money.
Now the question ultimately is