>>> IT IS A FACT OF AMERICAN POLITICS RIGHT NOW THAT ONE
PARTY, THE REPUBLICAN PARTY, IS
OVERWHELMINGLY WHITE.
OVERWHELMINGLY WHITE. AT LEAST IN ITS REPRESENTATION
AND ITS VOTERS AND INSTITUTIONS
ONE PARTY IS NOT.
IT’S ALSO A FACT THAT ONE OF THE
MAIN THRUSTS OF THE REPUBLICAN
PARTY’S MIDTERM STRATEGY THIS
YEAR WAS ROOTED IN BIGOTRY AND
RACISM.
RACISM. THE PRESIDENT SPENT THE SIX
WEEKS BEFORE THE MIDTERMS
FANNING THE FLAMES OF RACIAL
FEARS BY REPRESENTING IMMIGRANTS
AS MARAUDERS.
AS MARAUDERS. IS THIS THE START OF SOMETHING
NEW IN AMERICAN POLITICS OR JUST
A CLASSIC MID-COURSE CORRECTION?
JOINING US IS THAT ANY-- IS
TA-NEHISI COATES.
TA-NEHISI COATES. >> I FEEL LIKE WE’RE PICKING
RIGHT UP.
RIGHT UP. >> IN SOME WAYS IT’S A CHECK-IN
ON A BUNCH OF THE THESES IN THAT
ESSAY WHICH IS THAT THIS IS A
MAN WHO HARNESSED THE POWER OF
WHITENESS IN A WAY THAT NOBODY
HAD BEFORE BECAUSE NOBODY HAD
SUCCEEDED A BLACK PRESIDENT.
WHERE IS THAT PROJECT NOW AFTER
THE MIDTERMS?
THE MIDTERMS? >> I THINK IT’S PROBABLY EXACTLY
WHERE -- I’M TRYING TO THINK OF
HOW TO SAY THIS WITHOUT SOUNDING
ARROGANT.
ARROGANT. IT’S ABOUT WHAT I THOUGHT IT
WOULD BE.
WOULD BE. >> YEAH.
>> YEAH. >> I THOUGHT THERE’S QUITE A BIT
THAT BEARS IT OUT, QUITE A BIT
OF RESEARCH, MICHAEL TESSLER’S
BOOK.
BOOK. ALL OF THE RESEARCH HAS PRETTY
MUCH UNDERGIRDED THAT.
MORE IMPORTANTLY, THE HISTORY
WAS ALREADY THERE.
IT WAS QUITE CLEAR.
SO THE EXPECTATION THAT TRUMP
WOULD BE ANYTHING ELSE I THINK
IS QUITE NAIVE.
IT GOES AGAINST THE DATA, GOES
AGAINST THE HISTORY, GOES
AGAINST HIS BIOGRAPHY.
>> MICHAEL TESSLER IS A
POLITICAL SCIENTIST, I TALKED
ABOUT WITH HIM ON THE PODCAST,
WHO TALKED ABOUT HOW TRUMP
CULTIVATED WHITE PEOPLE’S RACIAL
ANXIETIES AND RACIAL FEARS.
>> I DON’T THINK OBAMA ACTIVATED
IT.
IT. HE ACTIVATED IT BY BREATHING.
>> YES.
>> YES. >> AND BEING PRESIDENT.
>> HE DID NOT CULTIVATE IT.
>> RIGHT.
>> RIGHT. WHICH IS VERY DIFFERENT THAN
WHAT TRUMP DID, WHICH WAS AN
ACTIVE ATTEMPT TO STIR IT UP.
IN MANY WAYS THERE WAS A KIND OF
GENIUS TO TRUMP IN THE SENSE
THAT FOR YEARS, YOU KNOW, IT WAS
THIS NOTION THAT THE REPUBLICAN
PARTY WAS ALL THESE OTHER
THINGS, IT WAS A PARTY OF
PRINCIPLED CONSERVATISM, FREE
MARKET POLITICS, RELIGION.
AND THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO --
LEGITIMATE PEOPLE WHO BELIEVE IN
THAT.
THAT. BUT TRUMP SAID, NO, YOU’RE THIS,
THIS IS YOUR ESSENCE RIGHT HERE.
AND THAT’S WHAT WE SEE RIGHT
NOW.
NOW. >> SOMEONE MADE THE POINT, A
CONSERVATIVE WRITER, THERE IS
THIS SORT OF ARGUMENT ABOUT
WHETHER TRUMP’S BASE IS RACIST
OR NOT.
OR NOT. TRUMP CLEARLY THINKS THEY ARE,
IT IS CLEARLY TRUMP’S JUDGMENT
THAT THESE PEOPLE ARE RACIST,
BECAUSE LOOK AT THE WAY HE
CAMPAIGNS TO THEM.
>> IT’S QUITE CLEAR.
ITS A MISTAKE, IT’S NOT A SHOCK.
I THINK THOUGH MAYBE, LIKE I
FEEL LIKE WHEN I PUBLISHED THAT
PIECE, THERE WAS STILL SOME
DEBATE.
DEBATE. I THINK THE DEBATE IS
DISAPPEARING.
DISAPPEARING. >> I AGREE THE DEBATE IS
DISAPPEARING.
DISAPPEARING. BUT WHAT I THINK IS INTERESTING
ABOUT THE MIDTERMS IS IT ALSO
SHOWS THERE IS A LIMITATION TO
THE ELECTORAL EFFICACY OF THAT
APPEAL.
APPEAL. >> WELL, RIGHT NOW IT IS.
RIGHT NOW IT IS.
I WAS LOOKING AT THE RESULTS,
YOU KNOW, I’VE BEEN VERY
ENCOURAGED, NO MATTER WHAT
HAPPENS IN FLORIDA OR GEORGIA,
THE CAMPAIGN THAT ABRAMS RAN AND
THAT GILLUM RAN, A VERY, VERY
ENCOURAGING CAMPAIGN.
ENCOURAGING CAMPAIGN. THEY STOOD AND SAID, THIS IS WHO
WE ARE.
WE ARE. AND NO MATTER WHAT HAPPENS, CAME
DAMN CLOSE, LIKE REALLY, REALLY
CLOSE.
CLOSE. I THINK IT’S A STATEMENT FOR
FOLKS OF OUR POLITICAL
PERSUASION FOR HOW TO PROCEED.
BUT YOU CAN’T GUARANTEE, IF
THOSE GOVERNORSHIPS GO THE OTHER
WAY, THAT THE ELECTION LAWS WILL
BE THE SAME THE NEXT TIME.
WE JUST DON’T KNOW.
I’VE BEEN A SKEPTIC OF BELIEVING
IN DEMOGRAPHICS AND SAYING,
WE’LL JUST RUN THIS AGAIN.
YOU JUST DON’T KNOW.
YOU DON’T KNOW IF IT WILL BE THE
SAME.
SAME. >> IT’S ALSO THE CASE THAT
NOTHING STAYS FIXED IN POLITICS.
>> THAT’S RIGHT.
>> ONE OF THE THINGS IN THE
SOUTH, THIS WAS REMARKABLE,
STACEY ABRAMS HAS 200,000 MORE
VOTES THAN THE LAST PERSON TO
TRY THIS.
TRY THIS. A WHITE MAN JAMES JASON CARTER
WITH ONE OF THE MOST FAMOUS
NAMES IN POLITICS IN THE STATE.
YOU CAN’T MOBILIZE BLACK VOTERS
WITHOUT DOING SOMETHING ELSE,
WHICH IS MOBILIZING A LOT OF
WHITE VOTERS TOO.
>> THAT’S EXACTLY IT.
THE OPTIMISTIC PIECE OF THIS
WOULD SAY, EVERY YEAR WE GET A
LITTLE MORE BROWNER, A LITTLE
BIT MORE BLACKER.
BUT AGAIN, YOU CAN’T ASSUME THAT
THE LAWS ARE GOING TO STAY
FIXED, THOUGH.
FIXED, THOUGH. AND I THINK LIKE WHEN I THINK
BACK TO ’08, HOW EXCITED A LOT
OF FOLKS WERE ABOUT THE
PRESIDENT, THE FIRST BLACK
PRESIDENT, ONE OF THE GREAT
MISTAKES THAT WAS MADE WAS NOT
TO ASSUME THAT THERE WAS GOING
TO BE A RESPONSE TO THIS, THAT
SOME PEOPLE -- AND OTHER PEOPLE
WERE WATCHING HOW CLOSE GILLUM
AND ABRAMS GOT.
>> AND ARE THINKING.
>> AND ARE THINKING ABOUT HOW TO
RESPOND TO THAT.
I THINK FOLKS SHOULD NOT SIT
PAT.
PAT. >> THE OTHER PART OF THAT TOO,
AND THIS IS ENCOURAGING ME ABOUT
THE MIDTERMS, BACKLASH WORKS IN
BOTH DIRECTIONS.
BOTH DIRECTIONS. IT’S ALSO THE CASE THAT THERE IS
A CONTINGENT OF AMERICANS WHO
WATCH DONALD TRUMP, AND THEY’RE
THE MAJORITY, IF YOU LOOK AT THE
MAJORITY.
MAJORITY. >> RIGHT.
>> RIGHT. >> THERE’S MILLIONS AND MILLIONS
OF PEOPLE WHO WATCH THIS AND
THINK, THIS IS AWFUL, THIS IS
AWFUL BIGOTRY AND RACISM, NOT
JUST PEOPLE COLOR BUT WHITE
VOTERS TOO.
VOTERS TOO. >> I HAVE TO TELL YOU, I WONDER
IF THIS IS HOW BIGOTRY AND
RACISM IN PARTICULAR, TO SOME
EXTENT, ALWAYS WORKS.
SO YOU NEED A CRITICAL MASS OF
DEEP BELIEVERS, YOU KNOW, WHO
ARE HARD CORE RACISTS.
BUT YOU DON’T NEED THE MAJORITY
TO BE HARD-CORE RACISTS.
WHAT YOU NEED IS FOR THE
MAJORITY TO BE ABLE TO LOOK THE
OTHER WAY.
OTHER WAY. YOU TALK ABOUT, SAY, SEGREGATION
IN THE ERA OF JIM CROW, YOU
DIDN’T NEED THE WHOLE TOWN TO GO
TO THE LYNCHING.
YOU JUST NEEDED A HARD CORE
GROUP THAT FELT LYNCHING NEEDED
TO HAPPEN.
TO HAPPEN. I’M NOT SAYING YOU’RE WRONG, I
THINK IT DESERVES SOME PUSHBACK.
>> WHAT’S UNNERVING IN SOME WAYS
IS THE WAY HE SEEMS TO RECOGNIZE
YOU CAN CULTIVATE A POWERFUL 38%
OF THE COUNTRY, 40% OF THE
COUNTRY, PREDOMINANTLY WHITE,
THE DATA SHOWS PREDOMINANTLY
WITH RACIAL ATTITUDES THAT ARE
FEARFUL AND PREJUDICED AND
SKEPTICAL, AND WIELD THAT POWER.
HE SEEMED TO GET THAT.
>> SO THE QUESTION I HAVE, GOING
FORWARD, AND I KNOW YOU’VE DEALT
WITH THIS QUESTION QUITE A BIT,
IS WHAT DOES IT MEAN FOR US AS A
DEMOCRACY, WHEN YOU ONLY
ACTIVATE A MINORITY, AND
NEVERTHELESS YOU CAN, YOU KNOW,
BE IN A SITUATION WHERE YOU GET
A JUSTICE KAVANAUGH, YOU KNOW?
LIKE THERE ARE RESULTS TO THIS,
WHERE YOU CAN AFFECT THE SUPREME
COURT, YOU KNOW, IN SUCH A
HISTORIC WAY.
HISTORIC WAY. THIS IS WHAT REPUBLICANS HAVE
CHASED FOR YEARS.
BY ACTIVATING THE MINORITY, AND
I AGREE WITH YOU, IT’S NOT THE
MAJORITY.
MAJORITY. >> IT’S THE POWER OF THE
MINORITY.
MINORITY. >> WHAT DOES IT MENAN FOR HOW
WE’RE SET UP AS AN ACTUAL
GOVERNMENT.
GOVERNMENT. >> THERE’S A STORY ABOUT HOW
HE’S STREET CERTAIN JOURNALISTS,
LIKE BLACK WOMEN, THIS WEEK,
DISGUSTING EVEN FOR HIM.
THIS IS HIM TALKING TO YAMICHE
ALCINDOR AND HIS RESPONSE TO
HER.
HER. TAKE A LISTEN.
>> ON THE CAMPAIGN TRAIL YOU
CALLED YOURSELF A NATIONALIST,
SOME PEOPLE SAW THAT AS
EMBOLDENING WHITE NATIONALISTS.
>> I DON’T KNOW WHY YOU WOULD
SAY THAT.
SAY THAT. IT’S SUCH A RACIST QUESTION.
>> SOME PEOPLE SAY THE
REPUBLICAN PARTY IS NOW
SUPPORTING WHITE NATIONALISTS
BECAUSE OF YOUR RHETORIC.
WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THAT?
>> WHY DO I HAVE MY HIGHEST POLL
NUMBERS EVER WITH
AFRICAN-AMERICANS?
AFRICAN-AMERICANS? THAT’S SUCH A RACIST QUESTION,
HONESTLY, I KNOW YOU HAVE IT
WRITTEN DOWN AND YOU’RE GOING TO
TELL ME -- LET ME TELL YOU,
THAT’S A RACIST QUESTION.
EXCUSE ME.
EXCUSE ME. BUT TO SAY WHAT YOU SAID IS SO
INSULTING TO ME.
IT’S A VERY TERRIBLE THING THAT
YOU SAID.
YOU SAID. >> IT’S A RACIST QUESTION.
WHAT’S GOING ON THERE?
>> WELL, I MEAN, IT COMBINES
DONALD TRUMP’S TWO GREAT LOVES,
RACISM AND MISOGYNY.
THAT’S THE FIRST THING GOING ON.
THE SECOND THING IS ONE OF THE
HIGHLIGHTS OF WHITE SUPREMACY AS
A FORCE AND RACISM AS A FORCE IS
THIS KIND OF TRUCULENT APPROACH,
HOW DARE YOU IMPLY I’M RACIST.
IT’S TYPICAL TRUMP.
FOR YAMICHE AND THE OTHER BLACK
WOMEN WHO HAVE BEEN INSULTED
LIKE THIS OVER THE PAST WEEK,
WHILE IT IS, YOU KNOW,
COMPLETELY PREDICTABLE, I STILL
THINK IT’S ABSOLUTELY OUTRAGEOUS
AND DISGUSTING AND I THINK THAT