Do we wanna continue to supply funding to law enforcement in counties that
refuse to implement state and federal gun laws?
Red flag laws are wildly popular, right?
You just temporarily taking guns away from people that-
>> So you wanna withhold money for
law enforcement?
>> I think we have to have a conversation about whether we can continue to fund law
enforcement in states where they are refusing to implement these gun laws.
>> Democratic senator Chris Murphy is furious with law
enforcement failing to enforce gun laws, including red flag laws,
and wants to have a discussion about potentially stripping
federal funding from police departments that refuse to enforce such laws.
In fact, why don't we take a listen to his argument with more context?
Let's watch.
>> Virginia and Colorado, where these mass shootings took place over the last ten
days or so, they already have red flag laws in place and
they did not prevent those mass shooting.
>> What we've, I think, learned in Colorado, is that the county in which
the shooting happened is a so called Second Amendment Sanctuary State.
And I think the country is gonna have to learn about what's going on in this
country.
The majority of counties in this country have declared that
they are not going to enforce state and federal gun laws.
They have decided that they are going to essentially,
refuse to implement laws that are on the books.
That is a growing problem in this country, and
I think we're gonna have a conversation about that in the United States Senate.
Do we wanna continue to supply funding to law enforcement in
counties that refuse to implement state and federal gun laws?
>> Now Jake, I know you have some strong thoughts on whether or
not defunding police departments makes sense in this context.
But first, let me give you some details, some stats here.
And I think the comparative stats with Colorado Springs versus
Denver is illuminating, to say the least.
So, Murphy is correct that so called Sanctuary Gun Counties exist.
And yeah, Colorado Springs happens to be one of them.
Of 64 counties in the state of Colorado, El Paso County, home to Colorado Springs,
is one of at least 37 counties that have declared themselves
a Second Amendment Sanctuary and openly defied the state's gun laws.
El paso County's commissioners did so
in response to the state's proposed red flag laws in 2019.
In fact, let's give you a statement from Bill Elder,
he is the El Paso County Sheriff who says,
we're not going to pursue these on our own, meaning potential red flag cases.
And he said that as the law was being debated in the state Legislature,
meaning that Sheriff's office is not going to run over and try to get a court order.
Elder has said that the Sheriff's office would enforce court orders, but
that it wouldn't pursue petitions on its own, except in some extreme circumstances.
Because remember, in order for someone who might have violence issues,
mental health issues, someone who isn't suited to own a lethal weapon like a gun,
well, that case needs to be made.
A petition needs to be made in regard to that individual and it can be filed by law
enforcement, which in this case, the Sheriff's department is like,
we ain't gonna do it, or friends and family of the individual in question.
Now, Elder has been true to his word.
So, take a look at these stats, it's incredible.
In Colorado, red flag petitions can be filed by law enforcement,
or a family or household member.
An analysis of court records by 9News found that, between January of 2020,
when the law went into effect, and November of 2021,
just 39 risk protection order petitions were filed in El paso County,
the most populous county in the state, with more than 737,000 residents.
Only eight of those petitions, or 21%, were granted, and
guess what, not a single one of them was filed by law enforcement.
Again, that's in El paso County where Colorado Springs is.
By contrast, in less populous Denver County to the north,
law enforcement and family filed 63 petitions, and
judges issued a risk protection order in 79 percent of those cases.
Of the 50 orders approved, 47 were filed by law enforcement.
So, Murphy has a point here.
When he says that the majority of counties in the United States are sanctuary
counties, that's not true.
[LAUGH] We don't know that, but we do know that at least, as I mentioned earlier,
there are 37 counties that have declared themselves gun sanctuaries.
Jake. >> Yeah, so
there's three different issues in this story.
Issue number one, should the local authorities abide by red flag laws?
Of course they should, and
this is a perfect example of unfortunately what happens when they don't.
This Yahoo, Sheriff Elder, thought, well, gun rights are the most important thing,
I'm gonna interpret the constitution on my own.
Okay, and I say, screw up protecting people.
Okay, by the way that guy threatened to kill cops and said he had a bomb and
he's gonna blow up the whole house and God knows, what else in the neighborhood.
And that idiot sheriff was like, I don't see a danger.
I think he should be allowed to own guns.
Okay, so not enforcing red flag laws is a disastrous idea.
Number two, this idea of the sanctuary cities.
Okay, so now remember guys, shoe on the other foot,
you always have to be ideologically principled.
Okay, because there's sanctuary cities in regards to immigration laws.
Okay, and those are on the left.
So, what is the correct standard for sanctuary cities?
It has to apply to both, right?
And so, the reality is that, yes, local law enforcement does have some
flexibility when it comes to things where they have to be proactive and
where they have discretion.
Okay, now there is one giant difference in how it's
applied between the Second Amendment ones and the immigrant ones,
in the case of the sanctuary cities and immigrants with the local authorities.
And remember, it's the cops that are mainly saying it, are saying, no,
we don't want to as for their papers and
do the law enforcement job not of ours, but of the federal authorities and
immigration divisions within the federal government, right?
And the reason we don't wanna do it is, if I'm going to investigate a rape or
murder or something else and they're worried that I'm gonna ask for
their papers, they're not gonna talk to me.
So the cops need that as a tool to protect everyone, not just immigrants,
but the non immigrant community too.
In the case of the Second Amendment one, the local cops,
Sheriffs mainly, are saying, yeah, this puts the community in greater danger and
it puts even me and my guys in greater danger, but I don't care.
Because of my personal opinion about the Second Amendment,
I'm gonna say I'm not gonna follow it.
Now, does he have the authority to not follow it?
Well, I think he does,
under the same concept of Sanctuary Cities when it comes to immigrants.
But is it the correct decision?
No, it is not the correct decision cuz all of those sheriffs are purposely
choosing to make their communities unsafe and
that's exactly what happened in Colorado, right?
And then the last part of it is the framing, and that's the politics,
not the policy, right?
When it comes to the politics, there's a lot of ways to frame this so that you put
the onus on the sheriffs that make them look like bad guys, which they are, right?
But instead, Chris Murphy framed it as if they don't do as we tell them,
we're gonna take away funding from cops,
which sounds like defund the police, which is an electoral disaster.
Okay, so you can say no Jake, I love it and we should run into an issue where it
pulls a 20% and we should choose to lose elections because of that.
But I would disagree, okay?
>> Can I just jump in real quick?
Why not pass a federal law that would punish the sheriff's
departments that refuse to enforce the laws, right?
Or the state, right?
The state lawmakers, the state legislature,
should have some concern over the fact that local sheriff's departments
are refusing to enforce the laws that they have passed through their legislature.
This whole thing about, okay, this is our default,
one size fits all response to cops we don't like, let's defund them.
Okay, but we're having a conversation about cutting funding to a social service
that is flawed.
But is that supposed to keep the community safer?
I don't get it.
>> Yes, so the sanctuary stuff is a little bit tougher cuz it's really on the edge of
their discretion.
But there's often times when cops through the blue flu,
where they just don't show up to work cuz their feelings were hurt.
There was protest of us, yeah, then we're not gonna show up.
And there's 1000 other ways that cops disobey orders that come from a legal
source, right?
Whether it's the mayor, the governor, whoever it might be, right?
See, what I would do instead if I was a Democrat is say, look,
I'm going to get more funding for mental health treatment so
that this doesn't all go out on the cops doorstep.
I might even do more funding for police depending on the situation, but
it would be tailored towards things that are actually lead to reform, right?
But I'm also going to fire the guys that are not following the law.
Yeah, and I don't know, they're so deathly afraid of doing that,
especially Democratic mayors, they often puff sometimes about police and
sometimes they do counterproductive reform, right?
But what they never do is actually hold the police accountable.
I've never seen it, never, right?
So when you say, hey, there's a guy who's not the cops in general,
not making the community feel unsafe, no, that guy and that guy and
that guy are not doing their jobs, they're fired.
It's that simple.
But when it comes to cops, they get so nervous, my God, they have a strong union.
And my God, the publicity will be bad.
Well, grow a pair and be a leader.
>> Yeah, and look, there is a difference between a police department and
sheriff's department because the sheriff is elected.
And here in Los Angeles, a ballot measure just passed, during the midterm elections,
that indicates that the board of supervisors can basically do away with
the elected sheriff if he's found engaging in any kind of misconduct, right?
Now, I don't know how I feel about that ballot initiative overall,
because an unelected body of people making that kind of decision about an elected
individual doesn't make me feel too great.
But at the same time, I do think there needs to be some system of checking
an elected sheriff who's refusing to do his job, which is definitely the case
when it comes to this particular sheriff in El Paso County, Colorado.