AT 9:00 ON THE RUSSIAN CYBER WAR AGAINST THE U.S.
JOINING ME NOW WILLIAM COHEN THE FORMER SECRETARY OF DEFENSE IN
BILL CLINTON'S ADMINISTRATION AND SERVED IN THE SENATE AND THE
HOUSE WITH A LOT OF DRAMA THERE. FIRST I WANT TO ASK YOU ABOUT
OUR BREAKING NEWS ON NORTH KOREA.
IT LOOKS ACCORDING TO SOME
SOURCES, BOTH U.S. AND JAPANESE, AS THOUGH THIS COULD BE ANOTHER
ICBM, ANOTHER LONG RANGE MISSILE AFTER THEIR SUCCESSFUL LAUNCH OF
JULY 3RD AND 4. THE FACT IS ACCORDING TO MY
REPORTING, THEY ARE NOW TWO YEARS AHEAD, CLOSER TO THE
TIMELINE OF MILITARIZING A WARHEAD IF THEY GET THE REENTRY
FIXED AND THEY SEEM TO BE MAKING A LOT OF PROGRESS.
THEY COULD REACH THE AMERICAN MAINLAND.
>> WE HAVE TO ASSUME THAT IS THE CASE.
>> IF YOU WERE SECRETARY OF DEFENSE WHAT WOULD YOU BE DOING?
>> INTENSIFYING THE SANCTIONS THAT'S BEING DONE.
I WOULD BUILD UP THE DEFENSE CAPABILITY ON THE SOUTH KOREAN
PENINSULA. I'D BE DOING THE SAME THING WITH
JAPAN AND PERHAPS EVEN TALKING ABOUT GIVING THEM OFFENSIVE
CAPABILITY IN THE REGION IN ORDER TO HAVE A REALLY STRONG
DETERRENT IN ADDITION TO OURS. A NUMBER OF OTHER THINGS, BUT I
WOULD INTENSIFY THE SANCTIONS TO SAY TO THE NORTH KOREAN REGIME
WE'RE GOING TO TRY TO BRING ABOUT A COLLAPSE OF YOUR
ECONOMY. SO THAT YOU CAN'T KEEP DOING
THIS. IT MAY NOT BE POSSIBLE.
WE WON'T HAVE THE SUPPORT OF THE CHINESE OR RUSSIANS SO IT WILL
HAVE TO BE UNILATERAL OR AS MANY FRIENDS AS WE CAN GET TO SHUT
DOWN THEIR ABILITY TO GENERATE THE REVENUE.
>> YOU TRAVEL ALL OVER THE WORLD AND SPEAK TO WORLD LEADERS.
THIS WORKED WITH IRAN WHEN WE APPLIES SANCTIONS AND STOPPED
IRAN FROM DEALING IN DOLLARS IN THE BANKING SYSTEM THAT
DOMINATES THE WORLD. WE CAN DO THAT TO CHINESE BANKS
AND RUSSIAN ENTITIES AS WELL. WE'VE DONE IT BECAUSE OF UKRAINE
TO RUSSIA ALREADY. WHY CAN'T WE RAMP IT UP?
>> I THINK WE HAVE TO. THAT IS ONE OF THE MAJOR GOALS
RIGHT NOW IS TO RAMP UP THE SANCTIONS TO SAY WE'RE NOT GOING
TO SIT BACK AND ALLOW HIM TO CONTINUE TO TEST AND TEST AND
2018, A SHORT YEAR FROM NOW OR LESS, SAY THAT WE CAN HIT SAN
FRANCISCO OR HAWAII OR CALIFORNIA.
SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA. >> WE HAVE HAD SUCCESSFUL TESTS
RECENTLY OF MISSILE DEFENSES BASED IN THE KODIAK REGION IN
ALASKA OFF THE COAST OF ALASKA. BUT THEY CAN'T BE 100% CERTAIN.
WE KEEP HEARING REPORTS FROM THE WHITE HOUSE ABOUT A PREEMPTIVE
STRIKE. ALL OF OUR REPORTING IS THEIR
FACILITIES ARE UNDERGROUND. THEY HAVE MOBILE LAUNCHERS NOW.
WE DON'T KNOW IF THIS WAS A MOBILE LAUNCHER.
MAYBE SOLID STATE FUELLING WHICH GIVES US LESS TIME TO SPOT THEM
OVERHEAD FROM SATELLITES. WE DON'T KNOW WHERE THEIR STUFF
IS. >> A PREEMPTIVE STRIKE DOESN'T
MAKE SENSE, IT'S NOT RATIONAL. IT WOULD PRECIPITATE A SITUATION
WHERE THOUSANDS WOULD DIE. OUR POSTURE IS REACTIVE,
DEFENSIVE. IT'S NOT DESIGNED TO INITIATE A
PREEMPTIVE STRIKE. COULD WE DO SO, BUT AT GREAT
COST. OUR CHOICE IS TO SQUEEZE UNTIL
THE REGIME SAYS LET'S MAKE A DEAL.
THEY'RE NOT THERE YET. BY INCREASING THE DEFENSIVE
CAPABILITY OF JAPAN AND SOUTH KOREA, AND POSSIBLY CONSIDERING
OFFENSIVE CAPABILITY THERE BECAUSE THE SOUTH KOREANS IN THE
PAST HAVE ASKED FOR PERMISSION TO HAVE A GREATER CAPABILITY OF
STRIKING THE NORTH. WE HAVE RESTRAINED THAT FOR FEAR
WE MIGHT BE AGGRAVATING THE SITUATION.
I THINK NOW IT MAY BE A DIFFERENT SITUATION.
WE HAVE A NEW PRESIDENT WHO HAS BEEN TRYING TO SAY LET'S DO IT
DIPLOMATICALLY. THE NORTH IS NOT INTERESTED IN
DOING SOMETHING DIPLOMATICALLY. THEY WANT TO HAVE NUCLEAR
WEAPONS CAPABILITY WHICH CAN THREATEN THE UNITED STATES.
>> DOES IT MAKE ANY SENSE WITH NORTH KOREA HAVING NUCLEAR
WEAPONS, THEY HAVE AN ARSENAL, ICBMs, DOES IT MAKE ANY SENSE
FOR THE PRESIDENT TO BE PICKING A FIGHT WITH THE REST OF THE
WORLD BY CANCELING THE IRAN AGREEMENT AND UNDERMINING HIS
SECRETARY OF STATE 90 DAYS FROM NOW?
>> WHAT'S GOING ON IN THE WHITE HOUSE IS SHAMEFUL.
THAT WE ARE SEEING THE KIND OF DISARRAY TAKE PLACE IN PUBLIC
THAT THE PRESIDENT APPEARS TO BE TV TOUGH.
NOT REALLY TOUGH. IN OTHER WORDS, IF I'M THE
PRESIDENT, SAYING I DON'T LIKE THIS, GET FIRED.
GET OUT. I WANT PEOPLE WHO WILL RESPOND
TO ME IN THE WAY I WANT. HE'S UNWILLING TO DO THAT.
THAT SERVES AS A SIGN OF WEAKNESS.
DON'T BE TV TOUGH. IF YOU REALLY DON'T WANT THESE
PEOPLE BE SAYING THE THINGS OR REPRESENTING YOU IN THE WAY THEY
ARE, GET RID OF THEM. >> SPEAKING OF TOUGH, YOUR
FRESHMAN REPUBLICAN HOUSE MEMBER FROM MAINE, YOU WERE ON THE
NIXON COMMITTEE. YOU CAST THE DECIDING VOTE.
HOW TOUGH WAS THAT? CAN YOU IMAGINE GIVEN THIS HOUSE
AND HOW LOYAL THE REPUBLICANS ON THE HOUSE SIDE HAVE BEEN TO THIS
PRESIDENT, ANY SIMILAR SCENARIO TO WHAT YOU SAW WITH RICHARD
NIXON. >> WHAT I WANT THE AMERICAN
PEOPLE TO KNOW, ESPECIALLY THE TRUMP SUPPORTERS, HE HAS MANY.
PEOPLE LIKE BOB DOLE WHO LOST HALF OF HIS BODY --
>> JOHN McCAIN. >> WHO SPENT SIX YEARS AS A
PRISONER OF WAR WHO IS SUFFERING FROM DISABILITIES OR TAKE TAMMY
DUCKWORTH, SENATOR FROM ILLINOIS WHO LOST BOTH LEGS.
THEY FOUGHT TO SAY WE'RE A DEMOCRACY, I DON'T WANT TO SEE
THE PRESIDENT OR ANYONE ELSE IN ANY WAY DIMINISH THAT BY SAYING
PRESIDENT PUTIN, IT'S OKAY YOU CAN LAUNCH A SNEAK ATTACK AT THE
HEART OF OUR DEMOCRACY AND NOT PAY A PENALTY FOR IT.
JOHN McCAIN BELIEVES IN THE RULE OF LAW.
HE'S MY HERO, HE WILL ALWAYS BE MY HERO.
I THINK THE NATION OWED HIM A DEBT OF GRATITUDE. THE
INSTITUTION IS REALLY THE -- HAS TO REMAIN STRONG AND CANNOT BE
POLITICIZED. EVERYTHING TODAY IS BEING
POLITICIZED IN A WAY THAT'S PARALYZING US.
OTHER COUNTRIES ARE LOOKING AT US SAYING YOU CAN'T MAKE A
DECISION. THE PRESIDENT SHOULDN'T BE
DEALING WITH THESE MINOR ISSUES SENDING OUT TWEETS.
HE KNOWS MORE THAN THE GENERALS ACCORDING TO WHAT HE SAID DURING
THE CAMPAIGN. YET, BY-PASSED THE GENERALS,
SENDS OUT A TWEET SAYING TRANSGENDER PEOPLE CAN'T SERVE.
HE'S DOING THOSE THINGS WHILE NORTH KOREA IS TESTING MISSILES.
SO WE'VE GOT TO GET SERIOUS AND DISCIPLINED.
WE HAVE TO HAVE SOME SENTIMENT THE PRESIDENT IS ACTING
PRESIDENTIALLY, MAKING DECISIONS IN THE BEST INTEREST OF OUR
COUNTRY AND NOT ENGAGE SETTING PEOPLE ONE AGAINST THE OTHER SO
HE CAN ENJOY THE SPECTACLECTACL. BECAUSE IT LOOKS LIKE WE'RE
SENDING IN THE CLOWNS. I WANT MORE FROM