As you're talking,
I was thinking about something that I have thought about
and I've begun to say a lot,
that the enemy of our souls
will give us our formal theology
if he can control our hearts.
So because you got your doctrine in place
and your orthodox,
you can feel like you're spiritually okay
where you may not be
because when it comes down to what rules your heart,
the heart being the causal core of your personhood,
something else is ruling you..
- Absolutely.
- other than the Lord.
So it is a strategy.
I think there are a couple parts of that set this thing up.
I think this embarrassment, unwillingness, reticence
to talk about money is also one of those leftovers
of a spiritual-secular dichotomy that's still out there,
that somehow money is unspiritual to talk about.
And so we don't.
The other thing is,
it's been a bit of a mystery to me that in seminary training,
there isn't a course on the theology of money,
the gospel and money,
the church and money,
because you can't be in ministry and avoid this topic.
You may avoid preaching on it,
but money will be an issue in your ministry
and the way that you view money
and the way that you handle money.
And I mean,
one of the scandals of the Evangelical church
is how many churches are in massive debt.
I mean, crippling debt.
How...
This will get me in trouble but I don't care.
How churches, local churches
can fuel their ministry idolatries by money?
Because we can float alone to build a big building
or a new family community center
or whatever is the dream.
And we end up with such poor money stewardship,
such poor money management,
often debt.
That means we can't do other things that are more
directly gospel-oriented because of that debt,
the amount of anxiety that pastors
carry around inside of them
because they know they're in trouble.
Often too embarrassed to say to the congregations
how deep the trouble is.
So it just doesn't make any sense
that this topic isn't out there more.
All that means then,
in ministry,
it's hard to give away what you yourself don't have.
And so if pastors haven't thought well through this issue,
it surely is hard to give that away to their congregations.
And, again, it's not just churches,
but I think the average debt load of the average believer
is a scandal in the church.
It does keep us from kingdom-oriented
lives of generosity.