IF YOU CAN LEAVE THE AREA, PLEASE LEAVE THE AREA.
DON’T STICK AROUND.
LET’S GO NOW, WE’VE GOT BOB
WOODWARD WITH US, MIKA, TODAY.
BOB HAS DONE IT AGAIN.
>> "FEAR."
>> "FEAR." >> SERIOUSLY, BOB, YOU SEEM TO
OUTDO THE YOURSELF EVERY TIME
WITH THIS TIME YOU TELL THE
INSIDE STORY OF THE TRUMP
ADMINISTRATION IN THE BOOK
"FEAR."
"FEAR." WE KNEW YOU WERE WORKING ON IT.
WE KNEW YOU WERE WORKING ON
SOMETHING.
SOMETHING. AND YOU DISAPPEAR AND WHEN YOU
COME OUT, THERE’S AN EXPLOSION,
A POLITICAL EXPLOSION.
THERE’S BEEN ONE HERE, AS WELL,
BOB.
BOB. I WANT TO ASK YOU, THOUGH, WHAT
IS YOUR BIGGEST TAKE AWAY?
LET’S JUST LOOK AT THIS ENTIRE
PROJECT FROM 30,000 FEET.
IF YOU WERE TRYING TO DESCRIBE
TO SOMEBODY 30 YEARS FROM NOW A
HISTORIAN, WHAT WAS THE BIG IDEA
WITH THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION IN
ITS FIRST 18 MONTHS?
WHAT WOULD YOU SAY?
>> ONE WAY TO CONNECT THE DOTS
ON THIS, THERE’S A WAR ON TRUTH
THAT THE PRESIDENT LAUNCHES AND
HE JUST WILL NOT ACCEPT -- IT’S
NOT A MATTER OF ALTERNATIVE
DATA, BUT THE INFORMATION AND
THE DATA AND THE CONCLUSIONS OF
PARTICULARLY NATIONAL SECURITY
EXPERTS IN HIS OWN GOVERNMENT
AND ECONOMIC AND FINANCIAL
EXPERTS.
EXPERTS. SO IN THE COURSE OF THIS, PEOPLE
CLOSEST TO HIM DO NOT TRUST HIM.
AND THE IMPULSE-DRIVEN
PRESIDENCY IS SOMETHING THAT THE
MORE PEOPLE KNOW, THE MORE THEY
REALIZE WE’RE AT RISK.
>> YOU CUT YOUR JOURNAL CYSTIC
INVESTIGATIVE TEETH, OBVIOUSLY,
ON THE NIXON ADMINISTRATION.
COMPARE RICHARD MILLHOUSE
NIXON’S RELATIONSHIP WITH THE
TRUTH TO DONALD J. TRUMP’S.
>> WELL, THERE WAS -- NIXON WAS
NOT A BIG BELIEVER IN THE TRUTH,
BUT AS THE TAPES AND THE
TESTIMONY AND THAT INVESTIGATION
IN THE 70s ESTABLISHED, HE WAS A
CRIMINAL PRESIDENT.
CRIMINAL PRESIDENT. BREAKING THE LAW ALL THE TIME,
USING THE POWER OF THE
PRESIDENCY AS AN INSTRUMENT OF
PERSONAL REVENGE TO SETTLE
SCORES WITH ENEMIES REAL AND
PERCEIVE.
PERCEIVE. IN THE CASE OF TRUMP, THERE IS
THE MUELLER INVESTIGATION WHICH
CLEARLY IS IMPORTANT, BUT IT’S
NOT ENDED AND WE DON’T KNOW
WHETHER THEY’RE GOING TO COME UP
WITH INFORMATION THAT
ESTABLISHES CRIMINALITY.
ESTABLISHES CRIMINALITY. BUT WHAT -- I THOUGHT THE VACUUM
HERE IN THE COVERAGE OF TRUMP
WAS, FIRST OF ALL, EXCELLENT
REPORTING BY MY NEWSPAPER, "THE
WASHINGTON POST," THE "NEW YORK
TIMES," "WALL STREET JOURNAL."
BUT THE FOCUS WAS NOT SO MUCH ON
THE MUELLER INVESTIGATION.
THE QUESTION REALLY IS HOW DOES
TRUMP PERFORM AS PRESIDENT.
AND IN THE FOREIGN POLICY AREAS,
THE HANDLING OF NORTH KOREA,
AFGHANISTAN, THE MIDDLE EAST,
ALL OF THE IMMIGRATION ISSUES,
ALL OF THE TRADE ISSUES, I WAS
ABLE TO EXCAVATE AND FIND OUT
ACTUALLY WHAT HAPPENED.
AND, AGAIN, THIS IS THE PATTERN
HE WON’T FACE WHAT’S REAL.
>> RIGHT.
>> RIGHT. SO BEFORE WE GET INTO THE
SPECIFICS OF THAT, I STILL WANT
TO TALK ABOUT TRUMP THE MAN
BECAUSE SO MANY PEOPLE HAVE
DIFFERING OPINIONS ON HIS
FITNESS TO BE PRESIDENT, MENTAL
FITNESS, HIS PHYSICAL FITNESS.
LET ME START, THOUGH, BY, AGAIN,
LET’S FOCUS ON THE TRUTH.
LET’S FOCUS ON DONALD TRUMP THE
PERSON.
PERSON. HOW IS DONALD TRUMP LIKE RICHARD
NIXON?
NIXON? HOW IS DONALD TRUMP DIFFERENT
THAN RICHARD NIXON?
>> EACH PRESIDENT -- I’VE DONE
BOOKS NOW ON NINE PRESIDENTS
FROM NIXON TO TRUMP.
THAT’S 20% OF THE PRESIDENTS
WE’VE HAD IN THIS COUNTRY.
EACH ONE IS DIFFERENT AND
UNIQUE.
UNIQUE. SOME SIMILARITIES, SOME
DIFFERENCES.
DIFFERENCES. I THINK THE KEY IN EXAMINING
TRUMP IS ACTUALLY WHAT WILL HE
DO WHEN PEOPLE PRESENT HIM WITH
FACTS?
FACTS? FOR INSTANCE, IT SOUNDS A LITTLE
ESOTERIC, BUT THE WORLD TRADE
ORGANIZATION, WHICH THE UNITED
STATES IS A MEMBER OF, VERY
IMPORTANT, ALLOWS US TO FILE
COMPLAINTS OF UNFAIR TRADE
PRACTICES.
PRACTICES. AND THERE’S A MEETING IN THE
OVAL OFFICE AND THE PRESIDENT
SAYS, WELL, THE WORLD TRADE
ORGANIZATION IS THE WORST
ORGANIZATION EVER.
ORGANIZATION EVER. WE LOSE ALL OF OUR CASES.
AND THEY PRESENT DATA -- PARDON?
>> I DIDN’T KNOW WE ACTUALLY
WHIP MOST OF OUR CASES THERE.
>> YEAH.
>> YEAH. LIKE 85.7% OF THEM.
NOT JUST 85%, BUT 85.7%.
AND HE SAYS, NO, THAT’S NOT
TRUE.
TRUE. AND THE PEOPLE ARE SAYING, LOOK,
CALL THE U.S. TRADE
REPRESENTATIVE, YOUR GUY, AND
YOU WILL CONFIRM THIS.
I DON’T WANT TO HEAR.
I DON’T WANT TO CALL HIM.
I DON’T WANT TO DEAL WITH IT.
AND AT SOME POINT, HE GETS
LITERALLY WHERE THE AIDES ASK
HIM, WHERE DID YOU GET THESE
IDEAS?
IDEAS? AND HE WILL SAY, WELL, I’VE HAD
THEM FOR 30 YEARS.
THEY’RE RIGHT AND IF YOU
DISAGREE, YOU’RE WRONG.
>> SO HAVE YOU -- DO YOU HEAR
FROM -- WHEN YOU INTERVIEWED ALL
OF THE PEOPLE THAT, THE STAFF
MEMBERS AND ACQUAINTANCESHIPS
AND PEOPLE CLOSE TO HIS ORBIT
ANY CONCERN ABOUT DONALD TRUMP’S
WELL BEING MENTALLY OR DID THEY
JUST BELIEVE THAT HE JUST --
HE’S GOT AN EFFICIENT
PERSONALITY THAT CAN’T HANDLE
THE TRUTH?
THE TRUTH? >> HAPPILY, I’M NOT A
PSYCHIATRIST AND I DON’T DIG
INTO THAT.
INTO THAT. WHAT MATTERS TO PEOPLE IS THE
PERFORMANCE AS PRESIDENT.
AND WHEN YOU DIG INTO THIS AND
EXCAVATE IT, AGAIN, YOU FIND
PEOPLE ARE WORRIED ABOUT THE
PERFORMANCE, THE INABILITY TO
GROW, THE INABILITY TO LISTEN,
THE INABILITY TO CHANGE HIS
MIND.
MIND. AND SO YOU HAVE A SITUATION -- I
MAKE THIS POINT, BUT I THINK A
REAL ARDENT TRUMP SUPPORTER
WOULD GO THROUGH THIS AND SAY,
GEE, MAYBE I LIKE TRUMP AND SOME
OF THE THINGS, BUT THIS IS NOT
THE WAY TO MANAGE THE
GOVERNMENT.
GOVERNMENT. >> I KNOW YOU’RE NOT A
PSYCHIATRIST, I’M JUST CURIOUS
IF ANYBODY EXPRESSED CONCERN TO
YOU WHILE YOU WERE ENTRYING THEM
THAT HE MAY NOT HAVE THE MENTAL
CAPABILITIES TO BE PRESIDENT OF
THE UNITED STATES.
>> WELL, DEMONSTRATE SCENE AFTER
SCENE HOW HE DEALS WITH REALITY
AND DATA.
AND DATA. AND IN THE COURSE OF IT, I MEAN,
IN ONE NATIONAL SECURITY COUNSEL
MEETING, HE IS SO WORKED UP
ABOUT HOW MUCH MONEY WE ARE
SPENDING WITH TROOPS, AMERICAN
TROOPS ABROAD OR IN SOUTH KOREA
OR IN EUROPE AND HE THINKS WE’RE
BEING CHEATED.
BEING CHEATED. FINALLY SECRETARY OF DEFENSE
MATTIS, WHEN TRUMP IS, YOU KNOW,
WHY ARE WE DOING THIS?
WHAT DO WE GET OUT OF IT?
MATTIS SAYS, WE’RE TRYING TO
PREVENT WORLD WAR THREE.
MATTIS AT THIS POINT IS SO
FRUSTRATED, HE HAS THE TO
COMMUNICATE AND TELL THE
PRESIDENT -- AND THIS IS A YEAR
INTO OFFICE.
INTO OFFICE. THIS IS NOT THE FIRST WEEK.
LITERALLY HAS TO TELL HIM WE’RE
TRYING TO PREVENT WORLD WAR
THREE.
THREE. CAN YOU IMAGINE THIS SECRETARIES
OF DEFENSE WE’VE HAD, SAY BOB
GATES, HAVING TO TELL GEORGE W.
BUSH OR BARACK OBAMA THAT
ACTUALLY OUR JOB IS TO PREVENT
WORLD WAR THREE.
THEY KNEW THAT.
THAT’S THE CORE PROBABLY THE
NUMBER ONE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE
PRESIDENT.
PRESIDENT. >> BOB, YOU’VE HEARD ALL THE
DENIALS FROM THE PEOPLE, FROM
THE PRESIDENT ALL THE WAY DOWN.
THE PRESIDENT EFFECTIVELY
CALLING THIS BOOK A WORK OF
FICTION, DEFENSE SECOND MATTIS,
CHIEF OF STAFF KELLY, GARY
COHEN, ALTHOUGH HIS WAS FULL
THROATED PERHAPS MORE THAN THE
OTHER ONES.
OTHER ONES. >> THERE IS NO THROAT AT ALL.
>> HE SAID THIS BOOK DOESN’T
PORTRAY MY EXPERIENCE AT THE
WHITE HOUSE, BUT DIDN’T DENY
WHAT YOU LAY OUT IN DETAIL WITH
SOME QUOTES.
SOME QUOTES. THE LATEST IS FORMER GOVERNOR OF
NEW JERSEY CHRIS CHRISTIE.
HE RAN THE TRANSITION AND I.
CHRIS CHRISTIE SAID THIS JUST
DIDN’T THE HAPPEN, THESE ARE
LEAKS FROM STEVE BANNON.
>> I REACHED OUT TO ABSOLUTELY
EVERYONE.
EVERYONE. THIS IS AT A TIME WHEN THEY WERE
PUTTING THE WORD OUT IN THE
WHITE HOUSE DON’T TALK TO
ANYBODY FOR A BOOK, DON’T TALK
TO WOODWARD.
TO WOODWARD. I DID MY DUE DILIGENCE ON THIS.
AND YOU WOULD CALL PEOPLE AND
THEY WOULD SAY, OH, IS THIS FOR
A BOOK?
A BOOK? CABINET OFFICERS, WELL, YES, IT
IS FOR A BOOK.
WELL, I’M SORRY, WE CAN’T TALK
TO YOU OR SOMEBODY WOULD SAY,
YEAH, I’LL TALK TO YOU IN A
CLANDESTINE WAY.
CLANDESTINE WAY. SO WHAT THESE ARE -- AND THIS
GOES WAY BACK TO THE NIXON ERA.
I CALL THEM POLITICALLY
CALCULATED SURVIVAL DENIALS.
THEY ARE NOT REAL.
THEY ARE A FORM OF THE NONDENIAL
DENIAL OR PEOPLE SAY THIS DIDN’T
HAPPEN, THIS IS UNTRUE, THAT IS
FINE.
FINE. AND THEN WHEN THE TRUTH COMES
OUT, OFTEN YEARS LATER IN THE
INVESTIGATIONS OR IN MEMOIRS,
YOU SEE THAT’S PRECISELY WHAT
HAPPENED.
HAPPENED. >> SO IS IT AS SPECIFIC AS
PEOPLE TALKING TO YOU?
PERHAPS SOME OF THE PEOPLE I
JUST MENTIONED, AND THEN SAYING
IF THIS EVER GOES PUBLIC, I’M
GOING TO HAVE TO DENY IT, BOB?
>> WELL, THEY DON’T TELL ME
THAT, BUT I UNDERSTAND THE
CONTEXT.
CONTEXT. THIS MIKE IS LAUGHING.
THIS IS -- ONE REPORTER ACTUALLY
GOT HIVES YESTERDAY BECAUSE
THERE WERE DENIALS ABOUT THINGS
THAT THIS REPORTER HAD HEARD
FROM THE PERSON.
PEOPLE TOLD ME, OH, YEAH, I
HEARD SO-AND-SO SAY THAT.
BUT OFF THE RECORD.
WELL, WHEN I DID THIS, I WAS
ABLE TO NOT TAKE ANYTHING OFF
THE RECORD.
THE RECORD. PEOPLE WOULD, YOU KNOW, IN THE
EIGHTH HOUR OF A SERIES OF
INTERVIEWS, HEY, I’D LIKE TO DO
THIS OFF THE RECORD.
I’D SAY NO.
>> IT WAS ON THE RECORD, JUST
ANONYMOUS.
ANONYMOUS. >> IT’S NOT ANONYMOUS.
I KNOW WHO IT IS.
>> ANONYMOUS TO THE READER,
THOUGH.
THOUGH. >> WELL, THE SOURCE, BUT NOT THE
INFORMATION.
INFORMATION. AT 2:00 ON TUESDAY, JULY 17th,
THESE PEOPLE GATHERED IN THE
WHITE HOUSE AND THIS HAPPENED.
THE REAL PORTRAIT OF SOMETHING
LIKE THIS, IT IS SPECIFICALLY
WHAT HAPPENED AT WHAT TIME AND
WHAT’S GOING ON IN THE WHITE
HOUSE.
HOUSE. BUT PEOPLE CAN SAY WHAT THEY
WANT.
WANT. THANK GOD FOR THE FIRST
AMENDMENT.
AMENDMENT. I’M ABLE TO SAY WHAT I FOUND
OUT.
OUT. >> BOB, YOU’VE COVERED NINE
PRESIDENTS.
PRESIDENTS. YOU’VE WRITTEN ABOUT ALL NINE
PRESIDENTS, SOME OF THEM IN
BOOKS, MOST OF THEM IN THE DAILY
NEWSPAPER, "THE WASHINGTON
POST."
POST." HAVE YOU EVER HEARD OF, BEEN
AROUND, ACCORDING TO YOUR
REPORTING, SOMEONE SO ILL
EQUIPPED TO HOLD THE JOB OF
PRESIDENT AS DONALD TRUMP?
>> WELL, THAT IS THE JUDGMENT OF
PEOPLE WHO WORK FOR HIM, WHO
ARE -- THE MOST -- THE ECONOMIC
DISCUSSIONS, FOR INSTANCE, ON --
AT ONE POINT, TRUMP SAID, WELL,
LET’S PRINT MORE MONEY.
WE’LL RUN THE PRINTING PRESSES
AND THEN WE’LL BORROW MONEY AND
WE’LL MAKE MONEY AS THE FEDERAL
GOVERNMENT.
GOVERNMENT. NO, NO.
NO, NO. THAT IS NOT THE WAY IT WORKS
BECAUSE YOU INCREASE THE
DEFICIT, INTEREST RATES GO UP,
YOU COULD HAVE A CALAMITY.
BUT HE DOES NOT UNDERSTAND THAT.
HE THINKS THAT AT ONE POINT I
HAVE THIS IN THE BOOK WHERE HE
ACTUALLY WRITES IN HIS OWN HAND,
TRADE IS BAD.
THAT HE THINKS SOMEHOW WE’RE
LOSING OUR NATIONALISM, THAT WE
NEED TO BE ISOLATED.
HE WAS ELECTED AS A DISRUPTER.
FINE.
FINE. THAT’S EXACTLY THE -- YOU KNOW,
HE WON.
HE WON. AND YOU CAN DISRUPT THINGS, BUT
YOU INHERIT A FRAMEWORK.
AND PRACTICES -- AND, YOU KNOW,
WHEN PEOPLE SAY THIS IS NOT
NORMAL, I THINK, YOU KNOW, WE
KNOW HIS APPROACH IS NOT NORMAL.
>> SO GIVEN THAT, WHO IS THERE
IN THE WHITE HOUSE TO CONTROL OR
MONITOR THE DAILY DANGERS THAT
ANY PRESIDENT AND THIS
PRESIDENT, OBVIOUSLY, IS
CONFRONTED WITH?
CONFRONTED WITH? WHO IS THERE?
>> THE CHIEF OF STAFF KELLY.
I TALKED AT SOME LENGTH ABOUT --
AND HE LITERALLY PUT OUT MEMOS
TELLING PEOPLE WE HAVE TO HAVE A
PROCESS.
PROCESS. GENERAL KELLY DIDN’T EVEN KNOW
THERE WAS A MEETING ON STEEL
TARIFFS.
TARIFFS. >> SO WE’RE GOING TO HAVE MUCH
MORE WITH BOB WOODWARD STRAIGHT
AHEAD.
AHEAD. WE’RE GOING TO BRING IN KASIE
HUNT AND THE PRESIDENT OF THE